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Special 25
9th Nov 2005, 09:41
Its that time of year again, but now it would seem, more night flying that ever. At 5 O'Clock at night, there are still 5 or 6 flights going outbound.

Are we so well legislated, that we can conduct offshore flights at night safely, or do we just get away with it more often than not ?

Any thoughts ?

332mistress
9th Nov 2005, 09:49
What is your problem with night flying offshore, as I don't understand your quote "or do we just get away with it more often than not ?"

It is perfectly safe as the limits are slightly higher than day flying and we are all well trained. If you have a problem night flying see your training department or perhaps go day VFR;)

332M

Special 25
9th Nov 2005, 10:46
My problems ............. Well let me see.

Yes limits are extended to allow for greater visibility, higher transit heights etc. But none of that is going to make it any safer to land on a sparsley lit oil platform at night. Let alone a boat or vessel.

Are you trying to tell me the limits being any greater are going to help you land with very limited and sometimes deceptive visual cues, or that they are going to make me feel any better when I know I'm sitting next to a relative newbie co-pilot, and I can feel my buttocks clenching so hard, I dare say, I could snap a pencil ??

My son also flies offshore now (as a passenger) and I can't deny, even having the inside knowledge into the business, I feel a greater concern for his welfare when they are flying at night, than I do during the day - By that simple fact alone, I can be sure that my inner concience feels that it just isn't as safe flying at night.

332Mistress, you have an enviable confidence in your abilities (and those that you fly with), but I'm sure there may be others that have some empathy with my opinion - Or maybe I should retire now before I totally lose the plot !

airspeed alive
9th Nov 2005, 11:40
Special 25,
Maybe you're becoming more aware of your mortality & therefore concerned about reaching the finishing post in one piece!
What do the statistics show with regard to night flying offshore, perhaps a contribution from CAA/SRG might be in order.?Certainly your chances of survival could be enhanced if you are flying with the benefit of a 3/4 axis autopilot with coupler(F/D) & HISL(high intensity strobe lights). The reality is there are a considerable number of machines currently flying the N.Sea without this equipment. One could be forgiven for thinking the regulator might have made this eqpt. mandatory especially after the Scillies S61 accident & several brushes with tornado's (the F3 variant) with offshore/pipelining helis.
regards, airspeed alive

Geoffersincornwall
9th Nov 2005, 12:43
The prospect of a night landing on a moonless night an a little 'flat-top' in the SNS in the pouring rain when the copilot is the only one who can see the landing area is not one that can fill anyone with glee. When it's just one of 15 landings on an evening shuttle it then becomes daunting.

Thank god for rad alts - we didn't even have those in the 105s during the 80s but struggled on regardless. The 'stab' system was three green lights that were either on or off but you had trouble feeling the difference - good old Ferranti!

These days a Rad Ht hold is a blessing and lets you relax a little on a busy shuttle.

What are the stats? Here in Brazil they banned offshore ops at night after an accident. Were they right or were they wrong?

I did my apprentiship in an ASW Wessex and count my blessings, many others may not have the benefit of so many nights spent below 200' and landing on stuff with a bit of rock and roll. Certainly I can say that night ops are not something to enthuse about

:cool:

Hummingfrog
9th Nov 2005, 17:08
Special 25

One of you "problems" may be a lack of confidence due to a lack of practice. Some oil companies insist that any crew that flies for them at night has to be night current which is a very good idea.

I am "lucky" I suppose in that I do about 600 night landings, to a variety of manned and unmanned platforms, each winter and therefore feel very comfortable at night. In fact I would rather shuttle at night than at the absolute day VFR min. My background also includes a lot of low level night flying in appalling weather which helps.

You talk about sparsely lit platforms but have you done anything about them? The smaller rigs in the SNS were improved with leg floodlights after pressure from the pilots.

The problems with inexperienced copilots can cause the odd "moment" but a good stabilised approach which you can monitor usually ends with a good landing.

I have noticed the increase in night departures so perhaps as more of us do night landings it will become more routine.

HF

donut king
9th Nov 2005, 17:14
Whoa boys!Whoa!

First off, Special25, what a/c are you flying?

We should be fair because not all of us are flying twin engine, auto pilot, radalt.....equipped a/c. Maybe special25 is blasting off with his jetranger at full gross in the dark......... geez, now I'm scared!!!!

Little more info dude????

DK.

Wizzard
9th Nov 2005, 19:11
Landing at night offshore is not a problem. Getting to a position from which to safely make that landing is the key, in my experience the main problem is arriving with too much airspeed and getting into problems with extreme attitude changes abeam the deck. Pitter-patter is the key!



And of course training.



And experience.



And bottle!


Wiz

;)

Special 25
9th Nov 2005, 19:15
OK, I'm obviously a wimp - I am flying the all powerful, twin engine, 'Alt Hold' equipped Super Puma. But admitedly, the aircraft is great for the job. I've got lots of time flying around single pilot at night, even a fair bit single engine back in a past life, and it never really bothered me much.

Maybe it is my impeding mortality as someone kindly pointed out, but I do feel offshore, things are different - Over land, there is no problem. Out in the middle of the sea, you can have some beautiful nights on which it is a joy to fly. I just feel there are too many occasions when the viz isn't so good, the platforms are of course lit up like a Christmas tree, but just your luck on those nights, the wind has you pointing away from the platform, looking out into nowhere.

Having read my previous message, I hope nobody thinks that I am knocking new co-pilots. I am always genuinely impressed with the standard of new guys coming through, but like hovering, you can't be taught it, you just have to build up experience and it takes a while to be comfortable.

Certainly, we don't do enough of it, and I was never one of those to be based offshore, where I know they got very comfortable with night flying. Like most oil-support pilots, for 8 months of the year we don't fly at night at all, then suddenly you have to get yourself back up to speed again.

I've been around for a few accidents in the UK, and a couple were directly related to night flying, a couple of close calls at night, and I can think of at least two ditchings, that were perfectly successful, but I worry they would have had a very different outcome had it been dark. I can't help but think - Why ? Even up in the Shetlands and the worst time of winter, there are still 7 or 8 good hours of daylight to get the flights done. As someone above said, it just took an accident in Brazil for them to stop night operations, and I think, if we had another big accident here, people would perhaps be surprised at what we do at night. I just don't want us to get to that stage.

spinwing
9th Nov 2005, 19:44
Sorry ...I'm a bit confused .... If your flogging around the traps in a 332 I have to assume the company your working for know what your / their doing ... your obviously in the Northern Hemisphere so where abouts are you operating ??

I also assume your operation is IFR ... so ????

NickLappos
10th Nov 2005, 14:07
Does anyone believe that airlines would have the safety record they do if they allowed operations as close to the edge as a night rig landing?

The reliance on judgement and skill needed to hover the craft to the deck is awesome, and likely to produce poor results in a small but consequential portion of the approaches performed. It is exactly hard enough to make that true, and just easy enough to blame the pilot if it goes wrong.

It is time for our industry to recognize this, and fix it. I have flown, 15 years ago, control systems that make the night rig landing cake for a housewife, let alone a trained professional. The aircraft held position absolutely, rigidly, like SAR doppler hover on steroids, and could be hand flown to the landing without caring a whit about the wind, the horizon or the cues. Why do we not have proper introduction for these solutions in the civil environment? Why when I try to raise the need for advanced fly by wire controls among the manufacturers do they tell me, "The customer pilots don't want it?"

Why is safety automatically assumed to be a subject for ernest talks with pilots prior to flight?

Why do I ask so many rhetorical questions?

Hummingfrog
10th Nov 2005, 19:13
Hi Nick

Now just hold on I don't want a system that

" make the night rig landing cake for a housewife"

otherwise her in doors might want to do it and leave me with the kids;)

HF

NickLappos
10th Nov 2005, 19:44
Hummingfrog,
Having flown with my share of Army female warrants, I think our jobs are in jeopardy right now!

GLSNightPilot
12th Nov 2005, 00:55
I've spent the last several years flying almost exclusively offshore at night, almost all of it in 412s and S76s with no augmentation at all. All the nice equipment Nick mentions would be very gratefully accepted by me or anyone I've ever flown with. We aren't the ones who are declining it, it's the cheapskate bastards who are paying our salaries who won't pay for any fancy equipment. Landing an S76 on a platform with 4 dim lights, one in each corner, on an overcast dark night with no other lights within miles is not the easiest thing I've ever done with my pants on or off, and it takes concentration, practice, and lots of faith in the guy in the other seat. I'll gladly accept any electronic help I can get. The problem is selling it to the boss, who just figure it's more expensive equipment to maintain, and we're getting by without it now, right?

NickLappos
12th Nov 2005, 01:00
GLS,
Let's all work together then, because it is about time. The effort I made to try to get those controls in the civil S92 fell on deaf ears because there was no customer input.

SASless, are you there? Let's set up a Skype seession, and I can explain exactly what I mean about the new control laws.

BTW the FBW controls are CHEAPER than the mechanical controls and they save over 150 lbs of payload, too. The computers are more expensive, but the 200 lbs of precision machining in the rods and mixer are completely eliminated!

If you want to set up a Skype conference call seminar, lets try to arrange a mutual time and I will chair the meeting. Anyone who wants, add me to your Skype list, I am rotorhead101

Or lets just complain a lot!

JimL
12th Nov 2005, 07:14
I am with you all on improvements to the facilities for night flying to helidecks. However, there are a number of improvements already available for deck lighting and it is there where the first push should take place. See the report at this site:

http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/33/CAPAP2004_01.PDF

In particular read the pilot's survey on the workload for night operations.

Fly-by-wire will be a great advance as it has the potential to give an improvement in handling and consistency to the look-and-feel - just observe what has been achieved with the Airbus fleet. However, that is a medium/long term goal; that is not to say that we should not press for early introduction but it will not impact on offshore operations in the immediate future (remember that the S92 was the only helicopter certificated to FAR 29 in the last 30 years).

There should be a push to improve offshore lighting as that has the potential to give the best bang-for-buck in the immediate time scale.

Special 25
12th Nov 2005, 07:20
I'm glad that we at last have responses from pilots who agree that landing offshore at night is potentially difficult / dangerous - At first there seemed to be so many responses from crews who felt it was perfectly normal and safe, that I was beginning to doubt myself.

Having landed at night a couple of times this week, I was trying to analyse all the things that make it such hard work, and draw the following conclusions ..........

Lack of local visible landmarks ie surface, other platforms, takes away your straight and level references, and limits your appreciation of closure until the last stages of approach.

Mixture of Instrument and Visual approach is required, carrying out an 'Approach by Numbers' at the beggining using GPS, and reverting to visual approach for landing, and a mixture of looking in and out during that ugly middle bit ! Not neccessarily a problem - Similar to what we do during a Radar Approach, but at night we seem to have one pilot doing both rolls rather than handing over control.

The state of aircraft windows, always covered with a layer of grime and possibly salt from the days flying so far. Even if you get them cleaned inside and out, on a shuttle on a windy day, they invariably get covered in salt spray etc that just absorbs and spreads the light from an offshore installation. The Super Puma windows in particular seem worse than any other aircraft I have flown at night. Their curved profile seems to bend light from outside (especially when mixed with a bit of streaming rain water) and reflect the lights from inside. It does seem bizarre that in 2005, we're sticking our heads out of a door window, just to see where we're going !!

Hovering at night is a bit of an aquired art. When training new students to hover, we get them looking far out across a field getting an appreciation of relative movement. As we get experienced those reference points can move in, and I know many SAR pilots that can hold a good hover with a small light in the chin bubble. But we all know that those sort of stable hovers can go horribly wrong, and quickly. I find that it isn't just new co-pilots, but also senior pilots that hold a fairly wobbly hover over a poorly lit deck without much to look at (ie pointing out to sea), which is why I was so surprised to find so many positive thoughts about deck operations at night.

I particularly welcome the response by Nick (who's input is beyond doubt) and GLSNightPilot who shows that even after years of night flying experience (which in my opinion is the only way to have any sort of safety an night) is also concerned about how little pilot assistance there is during night operations. I am sure the passengers would be surprised to learn how little technical input there is in a night landing offshore and how different such an approach is from one during the day. They are putting their lives basically in the hands of one pilot and we are all subject to making mistakes - mistakes that won't neccessarily be picked up by the other crew member who is often entirely unsighted for the crucial part of the approach and landing.

We have given the North Sea offshore environment an impressively safe record for helicopter operations. Lets keep working to keep things safe.

Geoffersincornwall
12th Nov 2005, 08:56
In our work out here in Brazil we are running a programme of upgrades to the offshore helideck inventory and to help with briefing the non-aviators I have a little video clip of a landing carried out at night onto the Forties Echo. Twas in a 365 and the camera was a Fuji Finepix in video mode hand - held out of the LH DV window.
The reaction from the non aviators has always been a stunned silence, especially when I freeze the video just prior to the slide over the deck and they see how much you can't see...if that makes sense. Don't have any problems talking about 'obstacle environments' then.
Anybody who wants a copy to amuse their friends please PM me and I'll send you a copy.
Forgot to add that although night ops are not the norm we do have a fully equipped EMS machine (with doc) that is on Nt/Sby for emergencies.
G
:ok:

have put this clip on YOUTUBE - click here

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ZLmjLHGQFY

whirlyhen
13th Nov 2005, 12:00
Have to agree with with wizzard here - absolute confidence in your IFR/night skills - your company must allow you to build this by practice! Nothing worse than feeling your heart thumping whilst on approach - only truly realise how much effort it takes after a very high level of skill is needed and you are in bed trying to sleep and rehashing the approach. Do not push your limits. Fly safe!

ps. worst time to fly an approach is actually not at night - but that time when sun is just under the horizon, lots of fog and your eyesight is working over time trying to adjust - again keep your ifr skills really sharp and keep the airspeed in control. Although not recommended keeping a very nice bottle waiting for the home run helps reduce the tension!

clearance
14th Nov 2005, 10:34
It is not the operator's that we need to target to provide better equipment, it's the clients. An operator will only provide what the client wants, providing there's a profit. It is the client that we need to target, as they pay the bills.

airspeed alive
14th Nov 2005, 20:46
Special 25,
If you & other professionals using this forum believe there is a problem with operations to helidecks at night then file an MOR or alternatively complete the insert in your CHIRP newsletter.
The more inputs there are to CHIRP the more CAA/SRG will have to take a pro-active (don't hold your breath) stance instead of just pushing out questionnaires which are then conveniently filed to gather dust.
airspeed alive

21st Century
18th Nov 2005, 05:37
Does anyone know of a visual approach slope indicator (VASI) that is designed for use on jack-up rigs? The problem of course is that the direction of the approach path is not fixed, it is variable being dependant upon wind direction at the time. The unit would have to be pointed in the right direction (down wind) by the HLO, or it would need to show glide path indications throughout a very wide azimuth.

Deck Clear
18th Nov 2005, 06:52
The main problem is not Jack-ups but small NUI's (normally unmanned" installations. These are small.....sometimes monopods with a helideck on top and often many miles from any other platforms. On dark grotty nights there are no other visual clues apart from one circle of lights. Nothing else around.
Occasionally even the most experienced crews have to work hard to keep disorientation at bay during an approach.
I enjoy night flying and spend much of the winter doing it but there are times in certain weathers that I don't look forward to the evening shuttles.

Steve76
18th Nov 2005, 07:12
Does anyone else wonder what all the fuss is with this topic?

It reminds me why getting away from Offshore is a good thing. Not enough flying and too much time to think of things to worry and complain about.

The call for automated approaches to rigs at night seems great but why take away the only flying the autopilot lets these guys do?

I also cannot see why a trained pro would not relish the night approach and find it a doddle. Really it is.. face it, you know generally where the wind is, you are over the ocean (ie: flat), there are no wires, you know the orientation of the pad and platform, it is brighter than the sun, the radalt reads off your exact clearance from the planet, the radar paints the target, you have another pilot there to help and all you have to do is fly a constant angle, controlled rate of decent into a defined landing area. WHAT's THE ISSUE?

If it is an issue and concerning, I think a shift down to the slabwing operators might be in store.

But think! you might have to fly single pilot night approach on a back course ILS, without a working weather radar and TS in the vicinity to minimums at 3am in a grotty old Chieftain.... yuk!

ho hum...back to the tent and drill.

:ok:

Bertie Thruster
18th Nov 2005, 08:37
Isn't all this stuff what you offshore drivers get paid for?

or2rot8
18th Nov 2005, 11:50
What ho! Spot on Bertie!

Galapagos
18th Nov 2005, 12:49
Totally agree with you Steve!

Was just waiting for you to post your thoughts to save myself the hassle of writing it all!!!

Nobody complains about night flying here... so, not all offshore pilots do... probably cause were too busy flying our ... off.

Have to go fly my late afternoon trip in the dark now...

:confused:

paco
18th Nov 2005, 13:30
Sheesh - and we used to worry about landing a Beaver in crossed headlights!

Phil

Shawn Coyle
18th Nov 2005, 22:53
What ever happened to the Firefly night approach lighting system that was developed years ago?
Variable azimuth and elevation that gave the standard flashing green, green, red and flashing red lights, could be pre-set for any number of different approach directions.... Could be controlled from the cockpit via a simple keypad through the radio.
Seemed to be an ideal solution.
Anybody ever use it?

Steve76
19th Nov 2005, 04:49
Hey hey Galapagos!

The North Sea is a millpond compared to where you blokes fly. How are those 70kt winds and the freezing fog?

Not nearly as hard as the landing light approach into Southampton at 2am with only one light and BA as your cojoe ... now that is hazardous!
Set the OBS to the inbound track please and look out for the towers ;)

HEY! and there is nobody wandering across the pad on late finals either!!!

Ha!

Woolf
19th Nov 2005, 10:52
Morning All,

I think most people will agree that flying Offshore (certainly in the North Sea) at night is quite well regulated and safe. Sufficient lighting is (mostly – see thread on southern North Sea NUI’s) in place and decks are regulated in terms of size and also movement which in most cases are more restrictive at night.

However I can sympathise with Special 25, especially when we are talking night landings to a smallish bow deck with lots of fast movement and nothing to look at. To be honest I do actually like the challenge of a difficult landing and feel quite satisfied after a smooth and safe landing in those conditions (you might even call it professional pride). But then again if I am the flying pilot I know that should things go wrong (e.g. deceptive references) or should I loose visuals with the deck I WILL initiate a safe go around and come back to try again.

Things are slightly different as the non-flying pilot. It’s a bit like being front seat passenger in a car in difficult driving conditions were you find yourself hitting the “air brakes” or leaning into the turn to help it round the corner. It just feels better if you drive yourself …. I think pilots especially are people who like to be in control of every situation (and so they should be). In a multi-crew environment this is slightly more difficult because there has to be trust in the other pilot’s abilities. In a well regulated company you have the knowledge that the training department thinks that the pilot is able to do the job, but personally I find that this trust is built up over time as you get to know each pilot flying the line.

As others have said before the key to safe night landings is appropriate training, a good brief, a stable approach and plenty of practice (which is probably the hardest part to get). Above all not being afraid of going around if things go wrong.

Steve76, congratulations on being such a great pilot, I genuinely hope you will miss those towers every time and I certainly take my hat off to all EMS drivers (especially the ones flying at night)! However not everyone is up there with you, yes there are mediocre and even bad pilots working within the industry (Sometimes flying single pilot has its advantages). In my opinion a discussion on how to improve safety is always a good thing - that’s why your comments make me slightly uneasy. Overall I think flying offshore, even at night, has an excellent safety record which cannot be said about your industry.


Regards,

Woolf

free wheeling
19th Nov 2005, 13:58
What luxury.... two engines, two pilots , auto pilot
blah blah balh...

Grab a tissue princess and wipe your tears..

When I was a lad .......jet ranger, no stab. system, 3 inch AI

But testicles the size of grape fruit......... get over it.

Woolf
19th Nov 2005, 14:07
Oh the good old days .... To be honest I sure do prefer two engines to your testicles, at least they get a power check every day! :)

332mistress
19th Nov 2005, 14:44
Oh dear oh dear the macho idiots are out in force - whose mantra is

"When I was a lad we only had one light to fly on, no instruments, one great pilot - me and it was perfectly safe 'cos I am the best pilot in the world and you guys in the N Sea have it cushy."

And Steve 76 I find your quote

"Not nearly as hard as the landing light approach into Southampton at 2am with only one light and BA as your cojoe ... now that is hazardous!
Set the OBS to the inbound track please and look out for the towers"

very disturbing in that you are willing to place yourself and crew/pax in a known hazardous situation. Why have you not refused to fly in there until they sort out the lighting to give you a non-hazardous approach???

The main reason safety is good in the N sea is because the pilots demand it. The oil companies are interested in profit and will generally only spend on safety if it is cheap to do so or forced on them. The leg lights on the SNS platforms are a case in point - pilot pressure got them installed.

We all have to strive for a safer environment in which to fly. Remember we choose to fly the guy/girl in the back has to provide an income for their family and some of them are scared witless by flying but still do it. It is therefore incumbent on us to provide them with the safest possible means of getting to work with the minimum risk. This is what the airlines do as many Ops Manuals state that the a/c is to be flown in the automatic mode rather than hand flown as it is "safer".

Commercial flying is not for fun and to prove how great we are it is to get the pax safely to their destination. If you want to prove how great you are, then go off and fly for pleasure.

I am all for every possible aid to safe night flying and will always strive to get the oil companies to provide it.

332M

Yabu
19th Nov 2005, 22:30
Yes, Gentlemen, Steve 76 certainly is full of himself it would seem. More interested in telling how great he is. Now the post I hope does produce info to all. Good on ya.

Galapagos
20th Nov 2005, 21:43
Allright, I think the latest posts have gone a little too far for my taste.

Don't know whysome guys need to start getting personal like that... very disappointing.

I thought this was a place to exchange and express opinions, thoughts, experiences... not to personnaly bash people.

As for the latest post that Steve76 did... it was directed to me as I was the co-jo flying with BA. Long story behind it... that nobody would be interested in. Just remembering the old (sad) days flying EMS in Southwestern Ontario, Canada... So, Southampton,ON not England!

Anyway, I could go on and on and on about why I totally disagree with the tone the post has taken but I'll just leave it at that.

I enjoyed getting everybody's opinion and take on flying offshore at night... even if I don't agree with some of them I respect the vues and thinking behind them... I don't think you've seen me bashing people posting them... Have you? No, exactly.

I would probably have more time picking apart everybody's post when I don't agree with them but I've just been too busy FLYING for that!

Just thought I'd put this tread back on track before it gets out of hand.

You guys who took it too far should think about apologizing to Steve76 as (probably) none of you know him and/or have had the pleasure of flying with him... so what were your comments based on then???

Galapagos


:* :* :* :* :*

TeeS
20th Nov 2005, 23:36
Sorry Steve

You really should realise that there is no room for a little light-hearted humour in this very serious (and very professional) aviation forum. Please stop these comments or the humour police will be straight round!

Actually, the most scared I have ever been (in a helicopter) was my first single pilot night departure from the Tharos - All North Sea night operations should include a co-pilot to hold your teddy bear!

TeeS :)

Geoffersincornwall
1st Nov 2006, 06:45
Just thought I would re-read the comments about offshore night ops that were posted last winter. The joys of landing in sh***y conditions with ancient equipment on monopod platforms are with me again and with my other hat on I wonder when this whole process was last "risk-assessed".

How many of our ops have the "skill-meter" running in the last 5% ? It may be fun to take on a tough challenge and succeeed, but in a world where 80% of accidents are caused by human error is this the right approach to take? Shouldn't we be identifying those areas where the skill-meter is maxed out and trimming back our expactations. Alternatively we could take Nick L's approach and use technology to mitigate the risk.

We're all a year older and a year wiser. Do we still think that the only problem with night flying is the size of your gonads!

What new technologies have emerged over the last 12 months I wonder?

G

:ok:

Special 25
1st Feb 2007, 09:54
Well, tried to revisit this subject, but not much comment.

Now sadly, we have had the inevitable offshore accident at night, maybe there will be some added enthusiasm to debate this issue without the masculine bravado that seems to have populated this thread.

Of course I don't know what caused the Dauphin to crash into the sea at night with the loss of several lives, but the initial findings suggest it was not a mechanical fault. No firm conclusions yet but the likely suggestions will of course revolve around instrument error, gyros, auto-pilot malfunction, pilot error or catastrophic failure (which again seems to have been initially put to one side). Any of these conclusions would be perectly understandable, but all except the last one would most likely have been recoverable by day, but were not in this instance at night, and this involved pilots that were as good as (if not better) than the average crew.

Hidden Agenda
1st Feb 2007, 11:21
What I am hearing is that pilots agree that:
Night flying can be fun
Night flying can be satisfying
Night flying is more hazardous than day
The risk can be mitigated by modern technology
The modern technology is expensive and the client needs to pay.

Recently the company I fly for did a job for BP in an “all singing, all dancing” S76. BP refused to let us even board passengers in the dark at the airport, never mind actually fly. It was against their policy and rules for normal ops! Too risky!

If leading oil companies believe that the risk is that high and are not investing, or even indicating a willingness to invest, in the technology what is the point in the pilots ‘swimming upstream’? No matter how often you “say mine is bigger” there is going to be a paymaster that says “no it is not”.

How are we going to convince the user otherwise?

MBJ
2nd Feb 2007, 08:47
How many of our ops have the "skill-meter" running in the last 5%

That's a good analogy Geoff and I think it brave of "25" to raise the subject. There's no doubt in my mind that night-flying to rigs is more dangerous than by day. Continuation training is key but I doubt anyone gets enough.

Certainly the closest I've been to the water at night is flying with high time but out of practice Management pilots who have cocked up their approach.

How good are the simulators these days for honing that last 1 mile on approach?

IMHO take it slow, and make sure the Rate of Descent never approaches the level of your overdraft!

FlightPathOBN
28th Mar 2011, 20:53
ARA minima is now 500', pretty much useless for getting in in the crap.

Have you considered a coded SOAP, PinS, or ARA procedure?

Depending on your location, the minima get down to 250 or 350 fairly easily.

21st..
Does anyone know of a visual approach slope indicator (VASI) that is designed for use on jack-up rigs? The problem of course is that the direction of the approach path is not fixed, it is variable being dependant upon wind direction at the time.

Yes, there is an omni-directional unit that will broadcast a sector 'fan'. I will have to root it out...