Air America

[collective bias]

Ever noticed how pilots screw up when on camera?
I hope it is not standard proceedure but I have seen twice on films pilots running the stinger on the Jetranger into the ground while landing. One such film was Air America. In one of the airport scenes a pilot flares the stinger into the tarmac after a steep approach. Oops! or Normal op's?


:)

[Capn Notarious]

What part of a Jetranger is the stinger

[Vfrpilotpb]

Hi Capn,
Its the long pointy thing at the end of the long bit with the little propellor on it at the back, put there to let pilots know the angle of landing is slightly wrong! :D :D

[collective bias]

The stinger is the last thing to prevent the tail rotor entering planet earth. I know the blackhawks can land the tail first but I am not sure the 206 can also do that. :eek:

[B Sousa]

My Two Cents............ha ha.. The stinger is the last thing you can bend on a high angle flair before the Tail Rotor passes you by.............

[RW-1]

By the lord, I just saw the movie last night, and he's right! :eek:

I wonder what the owner of the heli thought if he/she noticed ....

Hi B, has the Vegas spot been filled yet? (curious guy that I am, I want to know who got the spot I'd so for if i had the quals :) )

[Lu Zuckerman]

If you want to see a near disaster, watch the opening credits on Magnum PI. The pilot almost digs a skid at fifty to sixty miles per hour.

[ 01 August 2001: Message edited by: Lu Zuckerman ]

[GulfPLt]

Tailstinger = Automatic Leveling Device.

[B Sousa]

Hey RW yes, We got a guy from a local tour company. Seems as he will work out good...........Im gone now.. Back to the Caribbean this winter.....(After Africa for a month)

[B Sousa]

As to Tail Stingers, they were invented hundreds of years ago and used by developing nations for planting seeds. Helicopter Engineers in their wisdom found these ancient items and decided to place them on Helicopters as it was forseen to be what helicopter pilots would do with them anyway. Its a proven fact that Helicopter Pilots still use them for digging in fields albeit only to plant helicopters.
Maybe even Lu would agree on that..

[Capn Notarious]

So now that I know what a stinger is.
Will some one explain why a teeter rotor ___206/22/44 helicopter
Is less responsive to cyclic and collective commands than a four blade elastomeric o/r titanium; the latter of which is the most rigid.

You folks make interesting reading

[B Sousa]

PUHLEEEZZE dont put a 206 in the same sentence with the numbers 22 or 44. Its very embarrassing......
Teeter Rotors are just that they sit teetering until someone turns on the engine. Then they go round and round....In a high wind condition and when the rotors are getting up to speed or slowing down they also have a tendancy to teeter into the tail boom in the rear or the dummy standing in the rotor arc in front.

[SouthXross]

Was working ground crew for Silverstone saw a very reputable operator with a Augusta 109d strike the stinger twice in one day…doh! Must be the public waiting.

[ 08 August 2001: Message edited by: SouthXross ]

[FLA-ENG]

A-109's when loaded with happy pax for a day out, lots of fuel and only one pilot will sit nose high in a hover. Cant always do a level running landing to most event pads.

[huverluver]

An instructor I know used to show how quickly an R22 could be levelled out on a fast approach (wth flare) using the subterranean stinger method. Very interesting to watch and never damaged a blade!!!

[LAFalot]

Sort of makes you wonder why the S76, with its very nose high hover attitude doesn't have a stinger. Could it be so as not to spoil the looks? The tail rotor is mounted well up on the fin though so I guess any tail-first arrivals are unlikely to wipe it out.
In North Sea fit, some design guru decided the best place for the ADELT beacon was under the tail boom. Definitely not good for aft CG problems, nor ground clearance, and so it used to be standard practice with at least one operator to remove the beacon when carrying out any single engine training. This lesson was naturally learned the hard way after a few ADELT housings had become the first point of touchdown during running landings...!!

[md 600 driver]

I do wonder after reading the reason for stingers. unfortunately someone went wrong with mine i do have a stinger but i have no tail rotor maybe someone got it wrong

i think the stinger was designed by chopper spotter so that there was something to hold onto when moving the heli around steve

[Arm out the window]

Two other uses for the stinger I have seen (in the UH-1):

1. For climbing up on and standing on when you want to check if the 90 degree gearbox cap is on properly (probably not very good for it)

2. As part of the question sometimes asked by anally retentive check captains about how many pieces of wood there are in the helicopter (eg cork throttles, plywood false floor) - it's got a wooden plug in the end of it!

[helmet fire]

Collective Bias, you mentioned you had seen stinger strikes twice...apart from Air America, when was the other?
I believe the Air America movie also bent a Porter during that incredible landing on the one-way very steep strip, mid way through the movie. I had heard they had to sling it out after the landing. Can anyone substantiate this (or shoot it down)?

Pilots have been doing strange things under the pressure of a camera for ages, same as airshows. In "Outbreak" look for the single engine, restricted category UH-1 flying low over the crowds! You gotta love it. Those extras earnt their $1.50 that day.

People occaisionally lose their heads when a camera is pointed at them - ask Vic Morrow - and there are probably many examples, but maybe the pressure is not restricted to cameras: there are some good examples of airshow accidents too.

[ 11 August 2001: Message edited by: helmet fire ]

[collective bias]

Helmetfire,
The other film was a real old 70's flick. I think it was a B grade. The name escapes me but the guy came directly down into the camera so that you were looking thru the chin bubble into the machine. I guess he really had to stop or he would've squashed the camera. It was a 206 and the stinger was most helpful in assisted the levelling of the ship.
Other noteworthy moments in hollywood is the two handed cyclic control by the lead chick in the movie 'Matrix'. A mate of mine was the crewie in that one....thought he was a legend until they missed his name in the credits but he does have a photo of himself with her... :rolleyes: Lately I saw a really pathetic movie called .......(arghhh! help me out here..:confused :) where Temuera Morrison (a NZ actor) is playing the part of a Pakistani Pilot who is dropping a team of rescuers on K2. Its an incredible feat of aviation as he hovers in the blizzard at 20000 odd feet! :eek: haha. As usual the blades are inches from granite and people and he lives to tell the story. I hear that the 'Perfect Storm' also has a good helo scene in it?
regards :D

[advancing_blade]

collective bias

That film was Vertical Limit (and it was the limit), the most outragous piece of film that caused much "tutting" was the james bond flick with Pierce Brosnan and the BMW motorbike. The fearless agent is in a cul de sac with an AS350 tilted very nose down, but only acheiving about 6 knots with rotors ,clearing all asunder. I mean, what are they like? :rolleyes:

[Hoverboy]

I hesitate to enter the following message because it might create a wrong impression... but here goes...
Want to see a Hiller 12E drag it's tail rotor and blow it right off, rotate a few times before it slumps over in a pile of parts? The crew and passenger are fine, no injuries, however... the movie is...
"Attack of the Killer Tomatoes."
Yes, I'm ashamed to admit that I've actually seen the movie which regularly appears prominently in "The Ten Worst Movies Ever Made" lists, but someone told me about it and it exists.
The special effects are non-existent, the "Killer Tomatoes" are obviously being flung from just off camera, but there is a good example of a quickstop carried out too low.
There.
I've said it, now I'm going to hide under the rock I crawled out from...
:D

[Capn Notarious]

Type numbers are irrelevant; its the machine , pilots and pax that matter.

A mans role in life:to pay the bills and take the blame

[before landing check list]

In my humble opinion, The worst helo movie has to be......"Fire Birds" With Tommy Lee Jones. Everything from Warrants saluting Warrants to very bad flying scenes. Hid my face walking out of that theater.

Jerry

[FODA]

collective bias,

The scenes in "Perfect Storm" are pretty interesting to say the least, but is based on a real event and they end up ditching, consequently losing the helo. Must have been pretty hairy even before the hollywoodization! :eek:

[Arm out the window]

Hoverboy,
Congratulations on your fine taste in movies.
I too must admit to seeing 'Attack of the Killer Tomatoes', but it's that long ago and too many brain cells killed in the meantime that I can't remember the helo scene - looks like I'll have to get it on video.

That and 'Dark Star' are classics for unconvincing special effects! :)

[helmet fire]

Sounds like the Killer Tomatoes is a movie I need to see! I believe there have been other good crashes whilst filming, but most have had the budgets not to show it in the final movie.

I loved the home movie of the Robbie owner/pilot on his third ever helicopter flight. He wants his friend to film it but the IP is late and the friend has to go. The pilot decides he will take off for a bit of a hover before the IP arrives so the friend can film it. Friend starts video, pilot lifts up to hover, aircraft yaws and climbs unaturally. Friend gets scared and runs whilst filming, hides behind nearby C150 and pokes camera out in time to see perfect demonstration of flapback and the dynamic instability of the helicopter. The Robbie is still yawing all over the place, it pitches down to about 20 deg ND at about 10 ft, then moves forward until massive flapback and spectacular meeting with the ground. Something about a cyclic lock.......

Beware when the camera is around!

[w_ocker]

did any one see Troy Dann (all round aussie legend-in-his-lunch-box) and his brother having a helo-mustering comp? He in a B47, the brother in a robbi. The competition - wait for it camp drafting INSIDE A SET OF CATTLE YARDS! Cant believe they came that close but didnt actually spear in! Worth seeing if you get a chance. Dont know which eppisode (not much of a fan), but the show is called "outback adventures". A mate who knew with him tells me he had about 150 hours helo at the time. oh dear... :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[Helibiggles]

Good ol' troy!
The only man I have seen who flys the 47 with no shirt on....HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHA!
I know the crowd quite well who did his helo work and shonk op's describes the whole affair. Still what do you expect from ringers? :D
Some beaut country filmed during the series though. Did wonders for NT tourism...except for the waterfall strip scene......!!
Can't really go past 'Apocalypes Now' when mentioning helo films.... :eek:

[helmet fire]

Saw the Troy Dan outback stunt flying show and wished I'd taped it.

How about that Cobra crew who wave to the camera, begin to take off and create a brown out. All you can see is this huge cloud of dust envelop the aircraft as it is about to come to the hover, then you hear all sorts of engine noises and blade slap. Camera guy has no idea what is happening and doesn't run. Dust settles to reveal trashed Cobra. D'OH.