AAE looses UK AOC

[old fart]

Would some wise person explain to me what this actually means?
Thanks,
Old fart.

[old fart]

Air Atlanta Europe

[monkey lover]

is it because of the merger with XLA ???

[African Tech Rep]

Simplistically it means they are grounded – no AOC no Commercial flights.
BUT
The pulling of an AOC is relatively unusual – before this is done the CAA would have issued LOTS of warnings etc, the surrendering of an AOC is more normal but it’s only “more normal” for airlines stopping flying.

If it is Air Atlanta they would most likely also hold an Icelandic AOC and could sub lease the UK reg planes to the Icelandic AOC holder – but if it was a “pulled” AOC the UKCAA wouldn’t exactly be happy if this was done.

I admit to knowing little about Air Atlanta but would need a definitive source before I believed it had been “pulled”.

[danjones]

EUK flights from Sanford were still operating. Any idea why its AOC is suspended?

[African Tech Rep]

If they are still operating flights they probably still have an AOC

JAR–OPS 1.175 General rules for Air
Operator Certification
(a) An operator shall not operate an aeroplane for the purpose of commercial air transportation otherwise than under, and in accordance with, the terms and conditions of an Air Operator Certificate (AOC).

That is unless they were using Icelandic Registered planes – these would be being operated under the Icelandic AOC.

But of course wouldn’t like to argue with a boyo from back home or an “old fart” in case they know something I don’t – but from the sound of it the AAE AOC is alive and well.

PS
In AOC parlance “suspended” differs from “revoked” in that once you’ve fixed the reason for suspension you can get the AOC back – but a suspension means you’ve done something really bad and can’t fly until you fix it – revoked means you haven’t fixed it and the CAA don’t belive you ever will.

[danjones]

EUK476 to Paphos is showing as cancelled today.

[GOLF-INDIA BRAVO]

Is that the flight ex Manchester? if it is I think it was operated by European Air Charter with their B747 as I saw it go out
earlier and it is due back mid afternoon
which is about the right flight times

G-I-B

[Munkeh]

Where has this information come from?

AAE deliberately removed the B747 from their AOC last week. Are you sure this isn't the story you're refering to?

The reason they removed the 747 is presumably so that Excel have no obligation to the 747 operation when the AOCs merge, thus allowing the 747 crews to be made redundant.

If there's something out there to back up this rumour could someone please post a link?

[Shanwickman]

I can not see anything on the CAA website about this AOC being
revoked

[Munkeh]

old fart,

Your profile suggests you're a 747 Captain with AAI. So spill the beans please, where have you picked up this rumour that you're posting here as fact, or are you just trying to stir up some trouble?

[trainer too 2]

Where on the CAA site can one find the actual list of OAC's at any one time?

[old fart]

It would seem that on further investigation that it applies only to the 747 operation in preparation for the merger with excel.
Sorry if I got you excited.

[GOLF-INDIA BRAVO]

Couple of questions

1 is it just the B747-200 as they are going to a rest home anyway

2 Who`s AOC do the B747 300 operate
ie The Travel Direct as they are still operating today

Note as posted before European Air Charter operated the Paphos fligth as it had the same flight No except prefixed with EAF

G-I-B

[UFGBOY]

EAF operated EUK 476/7 today due late finish of mx on another a-c and damage to another caused by 3rd party whilst on ground

B747-200/300 are all operated on AAI AOC - will continue UFN for Travelcity (brokered by Excel Aviation)

Mix of AAE/AAI employed crews

NO G-REG B747; therefore no need to have AOC for same

Those are the facts..........

[African Tech Rep]

Ah – things now make sense – the removal of a type is far different than the loss of an AOC – unless of course it’s the only type.

TT2 – this is the answer I got from the CAA Site :-
Do you have a list of AOC holders?
A list of AOC company names is held by the LIC. Company addresses can be found in the ‘Directory of British Aviation’.

Then some b*****d gave me some real work to do and the subject interested but didn’t concern me I didn’t chase further.

Hope the 74 crews get a transfer or find someone else who’ll give them a plane to play with

[trainer too 2]

Hi ATR

TT2 – this is the answer I got from the CAA Site :-Do you have a list of AOC holders?
A list of AOC company names is held by the LIC. Company addresses can be found in the ‘Directory of British Aviation’. That is how far i got as well :)

[Captain Airclues]

Did you try here (www.caa.co.uk/default.aspx?categoryid=183&pagetype=90&pageid=340) ?

Airclues

[African Tech Rep]

Well LIC stands for Library and Information Centre.
Don’t ask me why they can’t just call it the library.

If we ask for Directory of British Aviation it seems to give.

Who operates/owns UK airports?
See ‘Directory of British Aviation held in the LIC and also available in larger public libraries or http://fly.to/avinfo

I tried the link – whoever owns it wanted to sell me a Domain name – I have written to the CAA asking about this.

Cpt Airclues – about three minutes too late to stop above mail to CAA :ugh: – but thanks anyway :ok: – the link is now saved just in case I need it in future :D

[mystic_meg]

Would some wise person explain to me what this actually means?
Certainly: To loosen something is to slacken it off, perhaps because it was too tight in the first place, e.g. a tie around one's neck.
To lose something is to temporarily, or perhaps permanently, misplace something.

Hope that clears it up for you. :ok:

[African Tech Rep]

I was extremely impressed that today I received a listing of UK CAA AOC holders from a very nice lady in the CAA Flight Ops department.
Considering that I only wrote last night
Just realised it’s current as of today seems some parts of the CAA are on the ball.

The link question is being dealt with by a different dept – but the nice lady did mention this in her mail so I know it’s not been overlooked.

[Desk Driver]

Oh my aching sides Meg oh so funny:bored:

[old fart]

Well it all goes to show that my wife was right all the time.
I should have been put out to pasture years ago.
Cheers.

[African Tech Rep]

If anyone’s interested the “different dept” mentioned previously was “Infoservices” – they have confirmed the link was wrong and they are going to fix it.

I’m actually impressed at their actions – many authorities I’ve dealt with would have been far slower with replies and actions