Round Usa Trip - 2007

[silvereagle]

Three of us are planning a round USA trip in spring 2007. The plan is to rent a suitable aircraft which will take us plus kit and to set off on a clockwise or anticlockwise trip, the direction depending on where we source a suitable aircraft.

We are all experienced fliers (3000-11000hrs) and all have SEP and MEP ratings (plus the appropriate FAA qualifications). A brief study of the various charts and so on suggests a 100 hour block (or thereabouts) should do it.

The advice I need from you is:

Any suggestions as to who would be prepared to rent us a suitable aircraft for a month and about 100hrs?

Which type of aircraft would you recommend? (We had thought of something like a BE76 or a PA44 but with fuel prices rising, we wonder if something like a 182 might be more pragmatic?)

Any tips from anyone who has done this sort of thing before? We are hoping to do the whole trip (everything including accommodation etc included for around £5K. each)

That's probably enough to get you started! Once this thread develops, we could perhaps discuss on the phone or via e mail. Let's go!

[raisin]

I did a trip which totalled about 30 hours over 2 weeks a couple of years ago in the states. I hired a 172 out of Reid-Hillview in San Jose, CA, and flew to Amarillo (I was actually trying to get to Mississippi, but the weather closed in).

The club were fine about me hiring the aircraft and going so far. I had to do a check out with an instructor, and then their booking system allowed me to hire the aeroplane for two weeks. The club is called Squadron 2.

It was an awesome trip - I will never forget flying over the Sierra Nevada and the tip of the Grand Canyon.....

[big.al]

and flew to Amarillo

...I'll get Tony Christie to PM you, apparently he's still trying to find the place...:D



(sorry but somebody had to do it - ok I'll get my coat again).

[Farrell]

Oh big.al......you have made my day!

I'm still crying with laughter here.

I knew someone was bound to say something, but that reply is just class! :ok:

[silvereagle]

Amarillo, yes its on my list. As is Winslow, Arizona - remember the Eagles?!

I've actually done several 3-400NM trips out in the States, so I'm happywith how to get about and so on. What i need is solid advice on clubs/private owners who might be willing to rent out a suitable aircraft for a month.

I do have a fallback position of a PA44 in Sn Diego but would like advice on where else I might try. I'd rather have a good recommendation rather than just show up at a flying school and hope for the best.

Grateful for any help on this one. Thanks.

[englishal]

How about a 2005 T206H, G1000 glass cockpit with A/C? Or a DA42 TwinStar (Glass cockpit?). These should have sufficient oomph to get you into the flight levels if you need to.

California Flight Center at Long Beach (www.californiaflightcenter.com) have both, the DA42 is arriving early 2006. Their minimums for weekly rental are 15 hours, and they are normally good about letting the aircraft go out for block periods. Their aircraft are also of extremely high standard.....

[fernytickles]

You'll probably find www.airnav.com useful for your flight planning. Great website, really helpful. Unfortunately doesn't cover Canadian airports yet...

[Tinstaafl]

I think a C182 is a good choice. Retractable if you can get it if you'd like the extra speed. I definitely tend towards high wing for the view of the countryside. It's boring as hell sitting in the back of something where most of the view consists of sky + patches of ground.

A C172RG might also be suitable. Depends on what useful load you will need. Similarly a C177 or C177RG.

I wouldn't go for a C206. Too slow for the fuel consumption. If you need that class of useful load then better off with a C210.

[slim_slag]

The C172RG "gutless" (a bit unfair) might not be able to get upto the neccessary altitudes when flying around the Rockies with three + baggage on board. I agree that the 182 is a fine machine, can be loaded to the gills and still perform at high DH. The 182RG would be my choice out of the ones suggested.

When crossing the Rockies stop off at one of the ski towns for a bit of a bum around, and hang out at the airport for great advice about mountain flying. There are freight dogs in those places who are just amazing founts of knowledge.

It can be cheaper to rent from airfields in the middle of the US as opposed to the edges, and there are some cracking deals on the airlines right now to get you there from your port of entry.

My advice would be to get an Argos phone card, get to know airnav, and work the phones. Rule number one about America is everything is negotiable, so get a deal renting dry, and don't be afraid about asking for extras. As fernytickles says, airnav is invaluable and has a great feature where you can work out a cross country flight stopping off at the places where the fuel is cheap. That's why you need to rent dry.

Duats is also great, if you don't have a login get one.

Should be a great trip.

[jimbo jet set]

Trey sunstate aviation, www.sunstateaviation.com based at Kissimmee. I renterd an immaculate brand new 172 for two weeks and did about 40hrs earlier this year. They are very competitively priced and very flexible.

Jimbo:O

[drauk]

For quick "how far's that? how long will that take?" plans, try http://fly.dsc.net/u/Plan?country=US

For serious plans, use http://www.aeroplanner.com

[silvereagle]

Great stuff. This is just the sort of information I was after. I have now e mailed one or two of the possible flight schools.

Where is the best place to get the appropriate charts? I need something now to conduct early planning and then I think I'll buy new when I get out there so that everything is in date. Where can I get US 500,000 maps and airways charts over here in England? Are there any UK suppliers - to save me dealing direct with Jeppesen in Colorado?

[Genghis the Engineer]

The AFE catalogue carries a full set of 1m and ½m North American charts.

G

[Chilli Monster]

..........however, if you'd rather use the charts you'd most likely be using in the states (Not the military style charts that AFE supply) then you might as well get a complete set from Sportys (http://www.sportys.com) .

In adition, if any of your group are members of U.S AOPA they have an excellent, downladable, online flight planner - which also gives access to airport diagrams and approach plates.

[slim_slag]

airnav gives you all the plates for free. duats gives you what you need for planning the flight, logs with the authorities the fact you have asked for the weather and done preparation, and will file your plan. Again, for free.

[fernytickles]

Also, have a look at Howie Keefe's chart website. I've used his charts for the past year, and so far, so good. I don't know how it will compare price wise, but worth looking into.

[20driver]

You can get some Canadian info here http://www.copanational.org/non-members/index.htm

Airnav is the best resource for airport info

Might be worth it to join AOPA - the legal plan is very handy and cheap.

ADDS weather is a great site - probably the best for getting all the weather.

FBO's tend to be really helpfull regards cars etc - again check out the comments in Airnav re

forget the name but there is a company that does VFR atlases - might be just what you need for this trip.

Sporty's does charts as well

Sounds like a blast - have a good trip

[slim_slag]

Came across an FBO today who was charging $4 a gallon at its pumps but only reimbursing $1.80 for fuel bought by a renter when away. So watch for that sort of thing, would add up over a long trip.

[silvereagle]

thanks for all that. I have now spoken to Sun State and they look good. I'll keep my options open. Of course, it doesn't matter where I start in the US, because the trip will end there as well. I suspect most of the quality renters are either in Florida or California. Anyone know of any other good locations to rent, remember it is for 4-5 weeks and about 120 hours?

Thanks for the note on fuel prices. Quite a change from when I was last there in 2003.

[Genghis the Engineer]

If you can get there easily, there are some pretty good FBO renters in AZ. The best rental aeroplane I've ever had in the US was a Beech Musketeer from an FBO called "Sky School" at Prescott/Love field. (Curiously, it was also one of the cheapest).

G

(http://www.skyschoolinc.com/)

[drauk]

Sectionals can be downloaded for free from:

http://aviationtoolbox.org/raw_data/FAA/sectionals/current/

Using them to plan over long distances would be a pain, but an Aeroplanner membership is $4.95 or $12.95 for their graphical planner.

And Genghis, how do you reckon those Sky School guys get their planes for rent to fly without pilots? (look at the pictures)

[slim_slag]

Not wanting to spoon feed, but the cheapest places I know are the clubs in the San Diego area. No sales tax and no profits for shareholders. I still think you could beat CA, FL and AZ prices in the mid west but I don't know where. Find out which clubs have planes based at montgomery field (MYF) and this will lead you elsewhere.

If you are planning to spend $10-15k might be worth putting an advert out somewhere and seeing who bites, that would be an attractive offer to some private owners, it would pay a lot of fixed costs.

Also look into insurance, around $220 for a policy that covers a $5k deductible on hull + a few hundred grand in liability, probably worth it.

No point in planning at this stage, it will depend on the weather and what you find interesting on the day. Just get the WACs for now. Get up on the day and decide where to go within your fuel range.

[Tinstaafl]

Register a free account at www.fltplan.com and you can plan your flights online, submit them to ATS, print the plan & route obtain weather briefs etc etc. The mob I work for uses this service as our main planning/scheduling system.