Tristars Return To Fi

[KPax]

Any thruth in the rumour that the Timmys are doing the FI run again due to a mishap at BZN involving a set of steps and a B747

[scpc]

Tis true. First one goes tomorrow. However, the rumour that the reason is because our gallant movers have driven some ground equipment into the 747 at BZN is absolute poppycock. Bzn is closed at the moment and the 747 is at Fairford. :mad:

[The Rocket]

:confused: :confused: :confused:

I X-Reference you to THIS (http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=2136726#post2136726) thread. Are they not all supposed to be broken?

Why are we using Timmys for the Falklands again, when we are unable to rustle up enough to serve Iraq?

Surely if we need Tristars or other military aircraft to get in and out of Basra, and there are no requirements for such at MPA there is a serious need to look at priorities here?:confused:

Am I being stupid, or am I missing something?

[Duncan D'Sorderlee]

After reading this: 'Troops stranded in Basra by grounded planes'

I'd have thought that they might have gone east.

:confused:

[scpc]

We obviously haven't got the "Big Picture".

Anyone know in whose office it's hanging in?

[FOMere2eternity]

Rocket

Unfortunately visitors to BZN (or Fairford) often see a number of 'white planes' and wonder why when their 'white plane' breaks they can't just jump on the 'white plane over there'.

Without going into the nitty gritty these 'white planes' come in several variants, of which only one type is capable of operating to certain operational airfields.

The remainder of the 'white planes' are not sufficiently equipped to do so or, as is quite often the case, broken.

Visitors to the likes of Lyneham make similar mistakes; a row of aircraft and a silenced workforce do not mean it is anything other than crisis management. It is.

Ironically, Brize's flightline currently provides a very good visual of our 'spare' capacity...

:ugh:

[The Rocket]

FOMere2eternity,

Thank you very much for that explanation. However, I am most certainly not a "visitor" to BZN who wonders why my "White Plane" is delayed, and I cannot get on the one next to it.

Perhaps if you'd bothered to look at my profile before typing up your patronising reply, you'd have seen that too. I was merely shocked and surprised that we are concentrating on saving a few pounds by taking back the BZN-MPI route instead of concentrating our efforts upon arranging alternative transport in and out of a WAR ZONE.

Unless the White Jets require different wings/fuselages/engines to get in and out of Basra instead of ECM equipment.

However, I'm sure you'll put me right again, of course, without going into the nitty gritty.

:mad: :mad: :mad:

[BEagle]

The joys of Base Aerea Gringo, Islas Malvinas:

EGYP 071930Z 072115 30015KT CAVOK BECMG 0508 34025G35KT PROB40 TEMPO 0915 35035G45KT 520003 PROB40 TEMPO 0915 VRB07KT 560003 PROB30 TEMPO 1315 7000 -RA BKN020

Lovely.......:yuk:

[scpc]

You're not the only one shocked and surprised. Ask the TriStar drivers!!!

[P-T-Gamekeeper]

Rocket

Without reading your profile, you are obviously either an air rank or a FJ T**t.

FOM tried to give a reasoned answer to a question that showed a lack of understanding of the issue.

If you knew what you were talking about, you would have known how long it took to prepare 3 T*s for Op flying, and would not have made such a naive post.

When you have grown up, come back and join the discussion.

( I can't beleive I'm defending the shiny fleet!!!!)

[brit bus driver]

Unless the White Jets require different wings/fuselages/engines to get in and out of Basra instead of ECM equipment.
Actually, one of them is now grey.....

And its MPN (or MPA) but not MPI. Looking at your profile, I'd have thought you'd have known that.

Perhaps they're sending a K1 or a KC1 - I know, having looked at your profile, that I don't need to explain the differences to you.

:ok:

[Controversial Tim]

As Rocket thinks we should all read his profile, now that I have I am dearly disappointed that I can't throw some banter at a Harrier mate.

As he's only Tonkas though suppose we'd better type more slowly so he can keep up.

T h e _ o n e' s _ t h a t _ g o _ S _ d o n ' t _ g o _ E.

Let us know if you require further explanation. Danke.

[scpc]

brit bus driver is right about 1 being grey. Relax, oh worried reader, for their airships have our concerns at heart and are keeping TriBirds out of B***a by sending them off for 4 weeks at a time to be painted grey to "Improve our corporate image"

:ok:

[Always_broken_in_wilts]

Having observed the "squibs" posts on here over the last few weeks and, as advised checked his profile, I can only assume, based on the ineptness (is that a real word) of his posts that he lives in the back seat of his pilots pointy thing :E

Which would explain the strong smell of wee:p

all spelling mistakes are "df" alcohol induced

[The Rocket]

Blimey Charlie O'Riley,!!!!!!

Look at all those responses. It's times like now that I wish I was fishing:p

Seriously though, apart from a small amount of angry, in haste posting, I clearly don't know exactly HOW MUCH is involved in role changes between Eastern and Southern fit, but I certainly wouldn't have thought it was prohibitive. Especially not if we're getting slated in the press. During a previous posting I was witness first hand as to what could be quickly put through, and brought into service when the need arose, and I am surprised as to the action being taken in this situation.

P_T Gamekeeper,

Unfortunately I still don't think that FOM was trying to give a reasoned answer to my question. Upon re-reading it, it still seems to be a patronising fob off.


BBD, Cont Tim,

It's Friday night, Thank you for speaking slowly and clearly ;) Sometimes a spot of red does affect your keyboard skills;)

Bon Soir, Mon Amies

[P-T-Gamekeeper]

It isn't a role change, its like changing a GR1 into a GR4. We only have 3, due to a lack of cash. We reap what we sow.

The relatives of any squaddie stuck in the desert should complain to their MP, or write to the Sun. The AT fleet is now the busiest operational fleet in the military. (So busy that they have no TELIC Battle Honours due to late submission of 540's - I kid you not)

[Controversial Tim]

Bu99er. A decent reply just when we were getting going. :suspect: Typing more quickly now;

The change of fit is structural, expensive and isn't performed at BZN.


(Damn, how come PTG got in there first?)

[The Rocket]

PT_G, Controversial Tim,

That makes a lot more sense now, thank you. Please excuse my ignorance.

ABIW,

...........tut..tut..tut........

:mad: :mad:





Sorry about the hat thing earlier this week also

:p :p :p

[Cockney Geezer]

To reinforce previous points, there's a difference between the Timmys needed for BSR and MPA.

MPA:
Considering how busy the 216 Sqn boys are with BSR alone, I say keep up the good work. I'm not surprised the jets are struggling..."any money to spare sir?"

And with MPA back on the horizon, I say a little appreciation to the Sqn may be in order! The jets may stumble, but I'm sure the Sqn's effort won't!


CG

[brit bus driver]

CG

If only everyone were as pragmatic.

Let's face it, it's a great for the crews having such shabby serviceability on their ac. They could depart on time and return to their loved ones on time, dealing with happy punters (well, on the return leg!) delighted that, once again, the RAF AT fleet has picked them up so promptly in their shiny new aircraft.

But, as is obviously the case, they break them - deliberately - control the spares procurement process, and the budget, and government policy on which ac go where just so they can have a few unplanned days in the desert, again, get home late to an empty house as the missus has knobbed off with the postman, and get it in the neck from 200 pi$$ed off squaddies in the process. If they haven't left them behind, for a bit of a laugh, that is.

Right, bed.

[Data-Lynx]

scpc. Try Northwood as rumour suggests that the damage to TF-ARG has left a sprinkling of 'stars' and a HQ at MPA with no home to go to after an exercise. RAF transport could also help to patch up the snag that, as it was a mover that split the skin, Air Atlanta Icelandic may be in no hurry to fix it. Fairford movers were having a bad day already after allegedly dropping a TF-ARG stores pallet off the back of a lorry.

[FOMere2eternity]

Rocket

The tone of your initial post implied a lack of awareness of the differences and I don't tend to run background checks on people before replying, hence my reply. Although addressed to you it did say 'visitors to BZN...' presume one white plane is the same as another - something I think exacerbates the problem - ignorance of the masses, including those who fund us!

It is human nature to imagine nothing is wrong if a line of a/c are still sat at home base despite 'bleaters' claiming overstretch. Closer investigation would reveal they are either incapable of the task, waiting spares or waiting manpower. Until we lose our armed forces won't be seriously overhauled to meet the task.

[monkeybumhead]

It ain't just at Fairford where holes are getting punched into the poor old knackered 747 (apparently due to retire in Jan 06). I can remember an occurance of a water bowser getting a little too close for comfort and extending a few peoples stay at the open prison for a few hours.
Speed tape saved the day again.:p :p

[L1011GE]

Just to make it simple all C2's which can go to Basra will be painted British Racing Green.

All K1's will be Grey.

All KC1's will be Blue.

I hope that helps,

In our spare time(joke) we will be forming a Tristar Air display team to rival the red arrows,

That is of course if we can get shifties away from Painting the Hanger at BZN when they whould be working at FFD servicing the A/C.

Looking foward to returnig to Asi, makes a nice change from Basra.. thanks movers!

[Logistics Loader]

Data Lynx,

If a load fell from the lorry it was down to the driver not the movers...!!!

Drivers responsibility for the load, no matter what vehicle it is...!!!

L1011GE....

LYE no different, the masses dont know the diff between a MK1 or MK3 Herc let alone chucking a J into the equation...
How many times have the uneducated said

"well there are loads more aircraft out there".....!!!!

Not realising the bigger picture or the fact the aircraft need to be re-roled etc etc....

[Safety_Helmut]

So, Mr Logistics Loader, you have the big picture do you ?

I for one have not got a clue what the "big picture" is, so could you share it with us all ?

Oh yes, and if you know of the whereabouts of the RAF's "lost plot" could you also please let us know where that is too.

Cheers

Safety_Helmut

[Data-Lynx]

Dear Log & Load. I stand corrected for being flippant. The grumble should have been better focused at the fork-lift driver who appeared to practice the withdrawal method faster than a squaddie round the back of the Naafi. His forks were out of the pallet before it was safely onboard the lorry. Not sure if the lorry driver is guilty.

[Logistics Loader]

SH,
Not everyone will have the inside knowledge as to why several "spare" aircraft are sat in a row...
Various reasons could be,
broken,
wrong fit inside the aircraft for the task reqd...
a/c reqd for standby for "special" duties ie Submarine recovery..
the list could go on...

I dont know about the RAF losing the plot, maybe the MOD has...!!

DL,
To my mind it was the Forklift driver at fault to a point, however as most military forklift ops tend to use a marshaller/safety man, it could be argued he is to blame.....!!!

[The Rocket]

If a load fell from the lorry it was down to the driver not the movers...!!!

the fork-lift driver who appeared to practice the withdrawal method faster than a squaddie round the back of the Naafi

Hmmmm...... Not wanting to seem like I'm mover bashing, but this has "Cowboy Mover" written all over it!!;)

And come on, for somebody who has supposed to have been in the RAF for 20+ years, with an anecdote for every occasion, are you really suggesting for one minute that the forklift driver was using a marshaller/banksman? Seriously!!:confused:

According to the orders we sign every year for our FMT600, we are supposed to have a marshaller every time we reverse a service vehicle:8

And of course we all do that don't we?

Don't we??...................:rolleyes: :ok:

[Logistics Loader]

TR....
Cant vouch for this incident as i was not there...

But we all know rules are broken and its not always practical is it...get help to reverse,, cant see many rodneys going to SHQ and asking a passing airman to assist in reverse parking....

Makes me chuckle thinking about it though

[SARREMF]

Did some one mention the 'Big Picture'?

I have it on good authority its away for framing at the moment!

[Jobza Guddun]

Away for DOWNSIZING and framing, surely?:rolleyes:

[Logistics Loader]

Is it due back soon???
Guess due to downsizing it'll be a 6x4 print then !!!

[Safety_Helmut]

I am led to believe that when it does come back it will be in a green frame, with a dark blue border.

Safety_Helmut

[diginagain]

In sepia tones, so that people can get all nostalgic.

[Maple 01]

Behind frosted glass?

[the aged aviator]

and in a darkened room

[diginagain]

Hanging on the back of the toilet cubicle door?

[gator bait]

No door- gone to mend 747!:*

[Logistics Loader]

I've heard the T* sat in ASI for 3days as there is 4ft of snow on ground in MPN....

The waiting continues.........

[Logistics Loader]

I forgot it dont snow in the summer !!

[Mobile Muppet]

movawhatchmacalled

Looking at this thread and your other posts you need to calm down or you will be having a turn for the worse old man.

Chumping on about it here does no good !

MM

P.S T* means tristar you nitwit (you must be a civvy !)

[Mobile Muppet]

Is that time of the month again moverwhaysyaface..

Teddys well out of the cot :-)

MM

[Data-Lynx]

Time to splice this thread. I seem to remember Flight Safety demands a look for the sequence of events when investigating failure. Contract 747 is punctured by GFE (Govt funished emmet) so no hurry to fix it. Revert to Tristar but higher priority to clear backlog in Middle East. One aircraft and one crew only available for FI run so crew duty dictates a safe but sendentary pace for one return trip. Some SNCOs and contractors left behind so second trip needed. Gales, snow and ice leave T* at ASI then hot ecu complicates things. In short, a week - or two - in the life of insufficient and aged AT for current tasking to an island that is resisting the onset of Spring. This will be resolved safely, but with teeth grinding and much disappointment by families - again.

[enicalyth]

Hi and G'day

The enicalyth (who is a Saint by the way) has taken the opportunity. Travelled down on the Air Atlanta 747 which looked and felt old and tired but clipped along nicely. Bituva hard landing but that steep upslope and all.... but you do have to get her down and make that turn-off with cool brakes.

The travel to Fairford bit was appallingly managed both going down and coming back up and travelling with a Serco guy who was mate in mutual days of light blue... well. But hey, it'll get slicker and the hitches we experienced are all avoidable and lessons will be learnt.

The 747 ding came on top of a series of unfortunate delays and at least 4 runs were pencilled in for KC1. The pax who moaned at the Obsidian "why can't the RAF" were put in the picture by me quite civilly and they shut up. At least within my arms' swing. Either they accepted what I said or thought the better of disputing matters with an ex-air force, ex-airline but nevertheless not ex-90kg Saint.

To the RAF at FI who worked wonders to get the KC1 back up without having to have had spares flown down of Friday many thanks. No names no pack drill but if your surname begins with K then I'll buy the beers. Same to for H who skilfully brought us up via the outer oceanic in 8+15 and must've had 50kts on the tail off LND. I was the last man to board so natch got the worst seat but no complaints.

It's very tough when these things happen, re-surfacing, reliability problems, a ground incident and consequent re-scheduling of the available effort with at least one a/c in deep maintenance. The military suffer and the FI chaps are worthy of great praise for doing everything to minimise the knock-on effects and get us back to normal.

I would like to think too that the pax I spoke to now understand that we can't go to the Arizona desert and say "I'll take that one please, start her up"; also that there is a reason why MoD aircraft go to ASI and the FI and not that nice Mr Branson; also that Andrew Weir does say s**t happens and you might be inconvenienced, delayed and even bumped for whatever exigency; also that a lot more people were inconvenienced by us having to use a KC1, people in stripey clothes getting shot at in a far away country for one. At least I volunteered to be the last man aboard and get the shi**iest seat. Proud to say I got it so the twonk I was going to belt seven bells out of if he didn't shut up is a very lucky man on at least two counts. a) he didn't come back on a stretcher and b) he wasn't middle seat just aft of the tanks.

I'm very happy to have flown with 216 again. I'm sorry it had to be this way and I do hope that the ASI holiday makers more fully understand the realities. I mean that. I did my best and they did say that now they appreciated.

Finally to the courteous pilot who circled the island before taking Graham home for the last time - we saluted you from Two Boats' terrace having turned out at the airhead (some visitors too). If the piper had not already turned on the waterworks you certainly did by that extremely moving gesture. Before I return to Oz I would like to come out and personally shake you by the hand, buy the beers and stand you a meal at the Chequers. A pm would be very nice.

Best rgds

the E and KO Sally

[monkeybumhead]

Movertit, or whatever it is.

I have seen no mention anywhere of an FCU in this thread, guess I haven't been looking hard enough. For those less educated than the bitching muppets, FCU (in my line of work) stands for Fuel Control Unit. The thing that lets the right amount of fuel make the engine go round for the given throttle input, engine intake air temperature and atmospheric pressure.

Any how, if said T* had a dodgy FCU then yes a delay would be the outcome as these things don't fix themselves by magic. It will no doubt cause a fair amount of work for the already overstretched technical wizzards, spares permitting.

Now stop bitching and get lives the pair of you.:}

[monkeybumhead]

Just to join in the fun and games.

bagcrusherwith747fettish,
I do have a bit of a life beyond t'interweb but when someone who is obviously technically challenged asks dumbass questions I feel obliged to give some sort of undignified response. At least when you are told that whatever you are supposed to be flying on has a tits FCU you now have some idea of said items role in the production of noise from the dangly things below the wings.

I'm sure LL now knows what an FCU is as well so you won't have to ask him/her again.

As for the name "MONKEYBUMHEAD" it is down to the fact I have a head that looks a bit, if not a lot, like a monkeys ar$e.:uhoh: