Stuck mic on MAN frequency yesterday

[No_Speed_Restriction]

Thank you to the crew with a stuck mic on Man frequency yesterday morning for the interesting in-flight conversation. It helped uplift what would of been a boring sector.

P.S. Did you finally manage to remember what the squawk code was for a radio failure?

[Avionic_Adonis]

7600- loss of comms, 7700 emergency (non-specific), 7500 Hijack.

C'mon you guys should know that! Come to think of it why should Engineers know!?

Look here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transponder_code

[Onan the Clumsy]

7800 - transponder broken

[SleekMover]

Ok - that made me laugh!

[egbt]

N-S-R

re our PS

To quote the man “You cannot be serious!” :confused:

[No_Speed_Restriction]

bet they never found those C.B.s did they?!?

[Squealing Pig]

Would any curruptable ATCO at MAN care to release a tape for those of us that missed it ?? No ? okay then, worth a try !

[chiglet]

"Over the Years", at Manch
We have had:-
A "very" senior captain giving a pax brief during the taxi from gate 29, to the hold 24.
A "Groundops" guy telling his oppo that he didn't "F" know what snow was. [I was in ATC mobile, "Apron" got there first...... "Oy, yer F*kin mikes' stuck!"....."Ahhh, shoot"] :ok: It was a "barrel mike, and the tx key was the "wrong wat 'round"
Also a guy "tried" to input his Slot time as his transponder.... then tried to fly "non txponder"
I haven't got a tape long enuff.....:ok:
watp,iktch

[L337]

What do you squawk for transponder failure?

[No_Speed_Restriction]

Part of the conversation was something along the lines of:
"Whats the code for radio failure again?"

[flower]

N-S-R you should have been closer to home, I had a stuck Mike yesterday blocked my frequency twice, second time for over 5 minutes, with the Pilot exclaiming how he "couldn't bloody hear anything now" Shame we could, the culprit also bust the Zone, don't you just love them :ooh:

[Alex Whittingham]

L337, you maka da joke, but that is an ATPL exam question.......and the answer?

0000

[Gary Lager]

If Mode C is unreliable, and you can't deselect it, yes; if the actual transponder is broken, 7800 ought to be the international standard - works for me, anyway!

Once couldn't read my own notes when reading back dep clearance - announced "Confirm squawk 7296?", and got the reply: "Well, it wouldn't be, would it?"

Took me a few seconds to work out why :\

[fmgc]

Some guy had a stuck mic in Brest FIR yesterday for ages.

A Topjet chap valiantly tried to get Brest to take account of it but to no avail.

[L337]

L337, you maka da joke, but that is an ATPL exam question.......and the answer?

0000

Get outa here!

ROFLMAO

[qcode]

Please can somebody explain to me how you put 8 into a transponder and how it is recognised by the ground station. I thought all transponding equipment worked using the octal code, therefore nothing higher than a 7 could be entered and recognised. Also the only way of knowing that you had a transponder failure would be when you are told so by a controller. Then you would be told to squawk 0000 or switch it off. If it only the mode c which is innacurate and independant switching of mode a and c is available then just the mode c can be switched off. I do not think that 7800 is recognised in any books as transponder failure.

[smallfry]

oh dear. Irony lost on some.

[fireflybob]

The issue of stuck transmit keys can be mitigated by the fitting of "Contran" which automatically deselects the transmitter after (I think) 30 secs.

This system also prevents crossed transmissions by inhibiting your ability to transmit should you begin to key the transmit button and another station is transmitting.

I believe Britannia have this system fitted to most of their fleet and it is arguably true that if the aircraft at Tenerife had been fitted with such a system the worlds worst air disaster might not have happened.

[Check 6]

7888 is for visible contrail above FL390

Check 6

:E :E :E

[Ransman]

I don't think 0000 would be a good one in the States, something to do with target practice I believe!

[click]

This system also prevents crossed transmissions by inhibiting your ability to transmit should you begin to key the transmit button and another station is transmitting.

That's not exactly the greatest thing in about half the destinations we fly to. Might makes right and the stronger radio wins:}

Years ago, I remember a stuck mike in one of our rental cessna's...starting with the take off call and ending with the engine shut off about an hour later. In between was an endless flow of F@#% this and F@#$5 that you effin useless F@#$...we all waited for this guy to pull in....only to find that he was in the cockpit by himself. That was his pep talk. Go figure

[FLCH]

I like the code 7734, if you look at it upside down with the display as it is on the transponder it reads HELL....OK I guess I had a little time on my hands.

[As I See It]

Got the T shirt with this one.

Stuck PTT on the control wheel, all was heard including expletives used to describe my thoughts about the MD. Fortunately I was only positioning the a/c to the other side of the airport, a phone call to the hangar and the SATCO advised me of the maintenance action required, DOH!

[IFixPlanes]

Please can somebody explain to me how you put 8 into a transponder and how it is recognised by the ground station. I thought all transponding equipment worked using the octal code, therefore nothing higher than a 7 could be entered and recognised.
To get 7800 just enter 17170 :} http://www.cheesebuerger.de/images/smilie/froehlich/c040.gif

[forget]

Click, Not surprisingly, this had been thought of in design. Contran Pilot Notes, below.

1. Prevention of Conflicting VHF Transmissions.

A. A press to transmit action, inadvertently made with existing radio traffic, will be inhibited. Receiver audio is maintained, at an increased level, to allow reception of the existing transmission.

B. Should a transmission attempt be made with unmodulated radio traffic, for example with an external stuck-mic, then a brief burst of audio noise is heard at ptt + 1 second.

C. A deliberate transmission may be made, at any time during channel activity, by two rapid ptt actions, the second ptt causing transmitter operation.

D. The threshold of the ptt inhibit system is set to operate at RF signal levels greater than those required to lift squelch. Weak reception signals, such as those from extreme range transmitters, will be ignored by the system.

E. Continuous channel activity extending beyond 60 seconds, as may be caused by an external ‘stuck-mic’ or monitoring ATIS, disables the conflict prevention circuitry until a period of channel inactivity when normal operation is resumed.

2. Warning and Termination of Unintentional VHF Transmissions.

A. An onboard transmission of greater than 20 seconds operates (optionally) a visual advisory, ‘VHF. Momentarily releasing the ptt will reset this advisory.

B. An onboard transmission of greater than 30 seconds will switch the advisory to flash, disconnect the ptt signal from the VHF, and restore receiver audio. Removing the cause of the transmission, for example a badly stowed hand microphone, will restore normal VHF operation.

[Minty Fresh]

There are only 10 types of people in this world......

Those that understand binery and those that don't!!

(Ok tenuous link i know)

[LGB]

... yet Contran is not smart enough to also inhibit transmissions interrupting other communication, like when a readback is required, or when it is obvious otherwise that a reply is expected by another station.

Otherwise Contran seems like a good system. Could make some pilots get a habit of "doubleclicking" every time they transmit, that is, if these pilots already have the habit of interrupting on routine basis.

If you know you have a stuck mike - on a multi pilot aircraft - you should have two audio selector panels, and thus be able to switch to the other box in either side (until fault goes away). Did this myself a long time ago, when we got a stuck mike on tower frequency when were number two for take-off. It was my side that was blocked, so I selected box two, turned off box two and let the captain do the comms, until we could make my tx switch "un-stick".

A more simple system than Contran could be a simple light that comes on when transmitting. Already exists on many radios, mainly certain King/Bendix radios, but a light somewhere in the field of vision would quickly alert you that you should not be transmitting at this time.

[Bengerman]

Last time I had a stuck mic was during an initial approach, having heard nothing from the controller for a few minutes I turned to my oppo and said "looks like the ****'s trying to get us high and fast again!!!!!!!!!"

[Squawk7777]

... just use this one and see what happens! :E :rolleyes:

[captplaystation]

Among all the usual pax P.A's on VHF 1 and assorted muffled mutterings with jammed mikes the very best I ever heard was Capt Nigel in the early 90's when his Shuttle 757 had to make a go-around at GLA due to slightly tight vectoring by Glasgow Approach "well ladies and gentlemen I think we all owe a vote of thanks to Glasgow ATC this evening for this lovely unexpected tour of Strathclyde that they have kindly given us,they do usually get it right and they have apologised so we will forgive them this little lapse just this once" There followed a second of loaded silence then "glad you enjoyed the view Captain would it help if we apologised again";I would have paid good money to see his expression as he watched his own-goal hit centre net.

[JJflyer]

There are two types of pilots flying around. Those who have transmitted on the wrong frequency, ATC instead of PA or vice versa and those who will do it.

Me belongs to the former group:\ Easy enough to do eh?

JJ

[belowMDA]

yep, did it twice yesterday!:{
once a ground contact call on PA and the other a clearance request on service interphone. luckily on the second no one else was listening but the captain did spot the mistake. Word of advice to you all: if it doesn't quite sound right when you transmit ie louder or clearer than normal then stop and check things out because it probably isn't!!!

[Self Loading Freight]

Most of the (non-aviation) radios I've seen have a little light that lights up red when you're transmitting, and doesn't when you're not. I know there are a lot of lights up front and that in general one lighting up is not a welcome event - especially as periods with lots of ATC are times when you are most likely not to welcome the distraction. You probably wouldn't want to go adding that as a third function to the ground config/cabin altitude horn...

Still, something that said "you are now preventing everybody else within a 50 mile radius from using this very congested frequency" or alternatively "You have just asked the bloke in 54B for clearance" might be an idea. Wouldn't people learn to associate a non-obtrusive light that twinkled on and off again with their transmissions, and be alerted by their peripheral vision when it didn't work in sync?

Or perhaps one of those electrical dancing sunflowers that jog about in their pot in time to the music. If that went off for thirty seconds when nobody was talking on the blower, you'd be aware all right. For those old crusties who say that the modern cockpit is more like a Fisher-Price Activity Centre, that could be the last straw.

R

[G-CPTN]

Aw come on! Pilots receive extensive (and expensive) training to prepare them for the complex task of managing a piece of intricate machinery, and you're suggesting that they can't handle a two-way radio? Every child (well at least those that ultimately fly airplanes) goes through the 'Roger Wilco, over and out' scenario. Or are these superhumans also incapable of texting with their mobile phones?

Wake up and smell the coffee and if you can't handle the heat, get out of the kitchen.

BTW this is NOT meant to be a vicious attack on aircrew, merely an attempt to point out that a little discipline in (simple) procedures would preclude embarrassment.
Doh!


:\

[L Peacock]

G-CPTN

On second thoughts I can't even be bothered replying....

[Flintstone]

There are only 10 types of people in this world...... Those who understand binery and those who don't.

Plus two other types of people. Those who can spell 'binary' and those who can't :p


Most of the (non-aviation) radios I've seen.... .......are non-aviation and therefore not relevant to the conversation. Nothing I've flown yet (up to medium biz-jet size and very new) gives any indication of transmission within the pilots field of view when 'heads up'. The tuning head on my current type for example is down by my right knee, not somewhere I expect to find conflicting traffic or primary information so not part of my usual scan especially during taxi-ing.

[cactusbusdrvr]

OK, slightly off topic and verbose but maybe you'll enjoy this story.

Years ago I was bumped back to the RHS of a 737 due to the company reducing flying. We were flying from Las Vegas to San Diego, about a 55 minute flight during the day and even less at the 0010 local departure time. The Captain was fairly senior and a great guy. I was PNF and for some reason I was stricken with the desire to have us pop up to FL 370 for the hop to SAN, saving fuel or some such nonsense. He looked at me a little funny but told me to go ahead and ask ATC. The controller agreed, and we had a delightful night at 370 for all of 5 minutes before it was time to start down. SAN had the usual "marine layer" overcast at 1000' with 6 miles vis.

I was off getting ATIS and calling company and talking to the back end and by the time I came back up on #1 radio I noticed we hadn't started down and we were now about 80 miles out. I kind of felt stupid for asking him to fly high and I thought I should now keep my mouth shut and just be a good F/O. We had a discretion clearance to descend to 10,000' and we were going to fly the localiser only approach to 27.

About 65 miles out he finally says "time to start down" (Yeah, about 20 miles late, thinks I) and we merrily amble down to 10000. We are in a EFIS 300 so we have the map and the VNAV doughnut and I have the prog page 2 up which says we are about 9000' high on the profile.

We get turned over to approach who, naturally, asks us if we can get down. "No problem", says the skipper and I dutifully relay that bit of fiction to approach. We cross the FAF about 600 feet high and are plummeting down to MDA with everything hanging out. We hit the MDA and I am staring at the numbers about to pass under the nose. I ask for a right 360, and the tower says "unable" as he should with a 900 foot ceiling and apartment buildings on the hills around us. Skipper says "OK - Go around". We go around and fly our missed approach. Tower switches us back to apprach and before I check on with him I make a PA to the back telling the folks that ATC kept us high and we had to go around.

I check in with Approach and after giving us heading and altitudes for the next approach he says "what did you tell the passengers?" I ask "What do you mean?" He says "the last time I was on a flight the crew blamed the go-around on ATC when they were way too high for the approach."

Thinking fast I said "Well we would never do that, I blamed it on a Southwest flight that didn't clear the runway fast enough for us". The controller said "OK" and turned us in to the fix for the approach. We checked in with tower, the skipper made a nice approach and landing and all was well. As we turned off the runway at 0130 hours, nothing but the mice moving on the field, the tower guy said "Taxi to the gate, give way to Southwest on the ramp." Looking around, I couldn't see anything else stirring. I said "What Southwest?" He said "You know, the one you went around for".

Just goes to show you should never lie to ATC.

[PPRuNe Radar]

Nice story .. and one we see quite often throughout the world ;)

Normally the reply is ... and would you like to tell the pax too ??

[L337]

G-CPTN:

I have in round numbers. 16,000 hours flying. On average I have probably made a radio transmission, or PA address, once every 5 minutes. So in the course of my 30 year career as a pilot I have made about, 192,000 transmissions. At a conservative estimate.

Pardon me if just every now and again, if I transmit on box two instead of box one.

G-CPTN, It must be so difficult being perfect. How do you cope?

L337

[G-CPTN]

>G-CPTN:
I have in round numbers. 16,000 hours flying. On average I have probably made a radio transmission, or PA address, once every 5 minutes. So in the course of my 30 year career as a pilot I have made about, 192,000 transmissions. At a conservative estimate.
Pardon me if just every now and again, if I transmit on box two instead of box one.
G-CPTN, It must be so difficult being perfect. How do you cope?
L337

*************************************

Hey - lighten up!
The trouble with e-mails is that you don't hear the tone or see the face . . .

I set the wrong channel on the video recorder now and then.
On the other hand I haven't been trained by NASA to set the video.
Do you think the astronauts press the wrong tit?

"I was wrong ONCE - I thought I'd made a mistake, but when I checked I hadn't . . . "
;)

[FLCH]

I have to admit after 20+ years in airline flying, I've made a mistake or two on the PA or center freq. However one of my colleagues was flying a commuter into ATL, the tower controller told him to make the next high-speed turn-off, he picked up the mike and said "We're not gonna make it".......unfortunately he picked up the PA mike by mistake !!

G-CPTN, we all make mistakes especially if you are tired, hungry, distracted or in the heat of battle, we all try to make our flights perfect, but after all we are all human.

[G-CPTN]

>one of my colleagues was flying a commuter into ATL, the tower controller told him to make the next high-speed turn-off, he picked up the mike and said "We're not gonna make it".......unfortunately he picked up the PA mike by mistake !!

*********************************

LOL!

[Eh Hello?]

taken alive - seventy five
radio nix - seventy six
going to heaven - seventy seven

Look on the controller's face when you switch from 7000 to 4700 without selecting SBY starting from the right - priceless