Travel affecting NATS application

[ontherivet]

I'm thinking about applying to NATS for an ATCO position. I'm 25 and worked in IT for 5 years as a UNIX sysadmin. Last year I quit my job, let my house out and went backpacking in Asia. I came back a couple of months ago but haven't really settled - I've decided that I don't want to go back into IT and would like to apply to pursue a career as an ATCO. It's been in the back of my mind for a few years and I feel that I have the right capabilities for the job, so it's not a spur-of-the-moment thought.

However, I still have money left over and tenants in my house so I'm thinking about going travelling again before I apply while I have the chance (no job, kids, house); probably not a situation I'll find myself in again for a while. If I do go it'll be something like cycling Japan to Singapore, not drinking my way down the east coast of Australia.

I'm a bit worried this might affect my application to NATS, though I'd hope that as long as I could explain my decision and what I learned from it they wouldn't look on it badly. I don't expect anyone here could give me a yes/no answer to the question but I'd be interested to know what you think. Has anyone managed to get a position with NATS after a few years of not really knowing which direction to take, or are they very picky about your past?

Lastly, I'm sorry if this is the wrong forum to ask this in. If there is a more appropriate board on PPRuNe, let me know!

[LGW15]

I havn't got a reply to the previous message, however, I am looking to be an ATCO and I want to know whether they are picky about where you live in relation to where they position you.

[Lock n' Load]

2 questions, so two answers...

1. As long as you have a good answer at interview as to what you've been doing during a gap in your CV, it's unlikely to affect your assessment. I had been unemployed for 6 months when I applied to NATS, but I got myself into a postgrad course just before submitting the application and it worked for me.

2. Where you live now has no bearing on where NATS will post you. ATCOs are in a mobile grade, and the stories of people asking for "anywhere but Aberdeen" and being posted there are legion. In reality, you have probably a 70-80% chance (if successful) of being posted to Swanwick.

[LGW15]

Do you get any preference at all when being positioned?

[Carbide Finger]

You can state a preference, but that's all it is. The company will put you wherever they need you. If you go Area (and that's extremely likely) expect to go to LACC or TC.

[HEATHROW DIRECTOR]

I know all the stories about being posted 1,000 miles from where you ask for... BUT, just to give you hope.. It was always my burning ambition to work at Heathrow. When I was told that I had been accepted I wrote back thanking them and, not daring to suggest Heathrow, said "I would appreciate being posted somewhere in Southern England (I suppose now I'd better learn to play the bagpipes)." That's truly what I said...... a week later I received a phone call asking if I wanted to go to Heathrow....

[Jerricho]

I know all the stories about being posted 1,000 miles from where you ask for

I didn't think the UK was that big Bren ;) :}

[LGW15]

Thank you for the tip Heathrow Director. Will do that myself.

If anyone is under 18 or 18 and is looking to apply for ATCO training with NATS then they say that you now have to be 20 to hold a radar license but you can still apply at 18.

[rodan]

Thank you for the tip Heathrow Director. Will do that myself.
Whoah thar!

What might have been a good idea a few decades ago isn't a good one now, I'm afraid, at least during the recruitment process. Unless you give the impression at every stage of selection and training that you will be deliriously happy to go wheresoever the company may post you, then you could be storing trouble up for yourself. Wait until you have passed your courses, and then put your request in.

Whilst on this theme, does anyone else think that in order to avoid having disgruntled employees at opposite ends of the country to where they wanted to be, that NATS airports could recruit trainees locally, leaving area to recruit nationally? Just an idea.

[Jerricho]

Funny you should mention that Rodan (sorry for the slight drift here Mr Rivet), but that is exactly what Nav Canada have started doing. The regional IFR Centres are now recruiting and training locally. Personally, I think it's a great idea.

[Standard Noise]

Yes, indeed, it's funny you should mention that rodan, we asked a similar question of the NATS peeps when they came to see us about the takeover.
BRS has a bit of a tradition of training up the ATSA's when possible, and I get the feeling that most of our lot (including me), want that to continue even after we get dragged into the asylum. Remains to be seen if the NATS management will let that sort of thing continue.
I fear they won't, more than likely they will parachute in a load of eejits who suffer from arse/elbow syndrome and only decided on Bristol cos that's the way the wind was blowing when they got up in the morning.

[foghorn]

anywhere but Aberdeen

currently referred to as "the Scottish airport"... if you mention its name the hidden microphones detect who you are and you are instantly posted there :}

[Vampy]

anywhere but Aberdeen

I never understood this. I'm not in NATS anymore but I would have loved to have gone up to Aberdeen. Nice part of the world, cracking nightlife in the city (it's a university town!), friendly people. I found that the large majority of people who looked down on Aberdeen had never actually been there in their lives!

[Dances with Boffins]

ABZ is cold. And dark in the winter. And the footie team is crap. And no-one can understand the locals [including the rest of Scotland]. And there are too many speed cameras on the road to Dundee. And expensive.

This from someone who actually likes the place.

[Richard Taylor]

Yesterday sunny,+24C,75F...yup,freezing!!

It gets dark in winter...funnily enough so does everywhere else!

Least we get longer days in summer.

Agree about the damn speed cameras though :(

[Lock n' Load]

Ignoring the merits or otherwise of Ice Station Zebra (EGPD), it's a bit much for people to complain about postings away from home. ATCOs are in mobile grades, get used to it! RAF controllers don't whinge about being posted away from home, and they get paid a pittance.
If this is the job you wish to do, it'll be the job you wish to do wherever you go and you should be damn grateful to have such a great career. Heck, Canadian tower controllers can end up in Yellowknife or in various inductrial sh*tholes around Ontario.
Back in Blighty, we had a trainee who was local and who didn't make the grade. Among his problems was a maturity issue, not helped by living in his parents' house and often driving their car to work. When chopped, he asked for a posting to the next closest NATS airport. The recommendation from his watch was "by all means give him another chance but only if he is made to leave home." When offered a posting 300 miles away, he actually asked for time to think about it. Most of us would have been thankful for the opportunity.
If you get through the testing, and if you get through the College or whatever they're calling these days, just be damn glad to get whatever posting you're given. If you want to be elsewhere, do a few years after validation then apply for a transfer.

[055166k]

In order to answer your question may I ask you to reflect on whether you actually want to grace our profession with your talents. You show no hunger or yearning for the job, but prefer to mull over the options of another work-avoidance jaunt.
Out of 4763 applications which are successively whittled down through various tests and selection processes over many months, there may be 24 selected to begin a course.....just over half will finish the course. Of those remaining there may be barely a dozen who will successfully validate after a couple of years intense training at their unit.....massive respect to them!
Over to you buddy.....how hungry are you?....impress me with your credentials.....if you were the "right stuff" you would not even have to consider an alternative....there wouldn't be one.

[MartinInTheMiddle]

Firstly - many people join NATS after having a year travelling or studing a course in Medieval Embroidery - a lot of plane spotters make it but there are many good controllers who never had an interest in aviation till they joined NATS. Like the chap said above it is all down to how you "spin" it at interview.

Second - about postings: very dodgy to compare UK to Canada. Canada is a continent, UK is a tiny Island... I agree with the geezer who says you "put up or shut up" about it - I'd understand if you were being posted to Bagdad but Aberdeen is not a bad place... it's not about location, its about attitude - if you go to a place and make the most of it, chances are that you will get a lot out of it.

[Jerricho]

UK is a tiny Island

....that is actually spread over more than one island. Hi EGAA tower guys and gals.

[Odi]

And what's wrong with the Ice Station?

[REVOLUTION]

There are people with wife and kids in Scotland who were posted to L.T.C.C. (West Drayton).
It is very likely that if you do area you will work at Swanwick, if you do approach you will work at Swanwick (Heathrow, Gatwick, Stansted, Luton, London City approach as TC is being relocated)

[Dances with Boffins]

I think he's gone away. One less application to sift then. NATS HR should be paying us.

DwB:cool:

[JJJ3]

Just a few interesting points from reading the above thread
-i wouldnt start whinging about postings until i passed the college !
-If so few make it then why have some of them undeservedly got through with extra attemepts and others binned at first chance
-spotters etc have an aviation background and a lot of people dont until they get to bournemouth, and subsequently make good ATCOs (if only they were given that extra chance eh?)

[fly bhoy]

JJJ3

If so few make it then why have some of them undeservedly got through with extra attemepts and others binned at first chance

Sometimes it can be a case of the people on the Training Review board feel that even with another chance, they still wouldn't make it, so why waste a spot for another potential candidate, so they get chopped at the first failure. Also, and it possibly shouldn't be the case, but sometimes its a question of whether your face fits at the college or not, which is why you frequently see advice of "remain grey" or "keep your head down and don't attract attention to yourself". Some people can be seen to have an attitude problem which would make them less than perfect team players, hence if you rub the instructors up the wrong way and subsequently fail something, there's not going to much to back up your claim for a recourse.

spotters etc have an aviation background and a lot of people dont until they get to bournemouth, and subsequently make good ATCOs

I'm not too sure if you mean spotters make good atco's or the people without an aviation background make good atco's, but assuming you mean the previous (and apologies if you meant the latter!!!), I would have to say that's not true. Just because people like spotting planes, doesn't automatically mean they'll be good controllers. In fact, I know of many very good controllers who have no interest in plane spotting, or indeed aviation, other than the interest required to perform their duties, and its never been a hindrance for them. Now, I know this doesn't sit very well with quite a few of the old guard (and even some of the new guard!!;) ) who seem to be of the opinion that you must have a serious interest in most things aviation, but its a fact that it doesn't have any major bearing on the ability to do the job or not!!

FB:ok: