View Full Version : Thomas Cook Airlines (Brussels)

12th Dec 2001, 19:42
So, it is confirmed. Thomas Cook are starting a new airline, based at BRU using 5 ex jmc Air A320's.

2 Condor 757's will be brought in to help in the summer months.

It will be called Thomas Cook Airlines.

200 jobs to be created. At last some good news!

12th Dec 2001, 21:06
where does your good news come from.........
100's of jmc redundancies in the UK to make 200 jobs in BRU !!!! :confused: :confused: :confused: :confused: :confused: :confused:

12th Dec 2001, 21:37
Golden Lion,

Don't shoot me down. It is quite obvious really....

Yeah we are losing jobs here in the UK, but surely if some of us ...as we are led to believe....are offered positions in BRU then that must be good news????

Or is your head so far in the sand that you cannot see that? Surely a job within the parent umbrella of TC is better than no job at all?

Whilst I know we are cutting jobs here, it may be a good time to think of the future.

Long gone are your days of "The Golden Lion" at Caledonian. We are being forced to realise that and as unpalateable as it is, I for one would be happy to go to BRU if that were all that were available.

There may be something to be said for being near the top of a new seniority list as opposed to the bottom of a contracting one. That is my view.

So, all things considered, in my position I think this is a chink of good news. I am young,free and single. The world is my oyster!

Anyhow, glad to chat with you......see you on the line.

[ 12 December 2001: Message edited by: tailscrape ]

12th Dec 2001, 23:02
So you guys think belgium law is gonna allow you to continue to work there on an indefinate basis? When They got all those Belgian citizens out of work? Even if the EU says you are entitled to work, I am sure that corrupt government can come up with special taxes and licenses to keep Johny JMCer from working there.

And the flight deck would be able to do what? Steadfast refusal to implement jumpseat agreements would sure make it hard for some poor guy to commute from Manchester to Brussles inorder to work this job.

I hope it works out for you, but this screams of "upstreaming." Take the assets and profits out of one company, and spread em around the corporation with no regard for the people, blood, sweat, and tears that went into creating those assets in the first place.

Good luck, I hope it works out for you. First step is a reciprical jumpseat agreement.


The Guvnor
13th Dec 2001, 00:31
Apparently 60 Belgian pilots are going to be hired, according to this evening's news on VRT. No jobs for the Brits, then - but JMC will need to watch out that they aren't infected by any of those BeCA militants - ask the people at VEX what that was like! :rolleyes: :eek: :rolleyes:

Eff Oh
13th Dec 2001, 01:47
As a matter of fact, we have all been offered a position at Thomas Cook Airlines. The package is yet to be drawn up, but a Flight Crew Vacancy came out last week, for anyone interested in a permanent contract. You have to leave JMC, and join TCA. It also says that the company will meet the cost of any B757 pilot who wishes to convert to the A320!
Eff Oh

13th Dec 2001, 01:56
So you gotta give up all rights to JMC?

How is that fair? atleast its work, but what happens when JMC spools up again? You get to move away from your family etc.

Seams to me that TC should have a company wide seniority list.


13th Dec 2001, 02:25
The Guvnor,

You are a nonsense t*t mate. When you have the same access to information that we the current JMC pilots have, please feel free to talk. Again until then, wind it in please mate! You are just talking horse [email protected] again I am afraid.


I know what you are saying. But for me:

Less than a year at JMC

+/- 500 hours on the 757

+/- 750 hours total time

Single, no ties, no commitments...

This is a GOOD move for me. I don't care if it only last SIX months. At the end of the day I am due to be made redundant from jmc, so if I can get a free A320 rating, 6 months work and a hard summers graft under my belt (+/- 500 hours) on the minibus, well I couldn't give a stuff what happens then.

It would put me in a better position than the one i am in now.Because I would have +/- 1000 hours on 2 different and very desirable jets WITHIN ONE YEAR OF STARTING MY FIRST EVER FLYING JOB. I call that lucky.....

I am lucky to be unencumbered enough to not give a sh?t and am even more lucky to have Belgian "in laws" thru a siblings marriage.Who coincidentally live in Brussels....quel dommage!

I couldn't be happier really. I just hope I get offered a place.

13th Dec 2001, 02:46
A question for the UK boys:

Isn't it kinda normal that the biggest part of these positions are awarded to Belgian pilots as it is going to be called Thomas Cook Belgian Airlines, operating from Brussels with a Belgian operating license and mostly Belgian tourists?

I would think so!

13th Dec 2001, 02:52
tailscrape. be careful. do not give up jmc lightly. out of the frying pan...... :rolleyes:

13th Dec 2001, 03:07

You are correct in saying that. In my situation (I won't give you my exact seniority Position to maintain anonimity) I am most likely to be out the door soon anyhow unless things change a lot.

I have expressed my interest in BRU, because if I don't I wont have a leg to stand on.

However, I stand by my previous comment. This could be a good move...it may not be too, but who knows?!?

I have also said before and to the company that this is a last resort option.

I like being in jmc. Top crews and genuinely good line and pilot management people. I want to stay, because jmc gave me my chance. However, if i have to i will move.

The Guvnor
13th Dec 2001, 03:19
Hey, tailscrape - I'm just reporting what Belgian TV says, ok? Perhaps you might like to tell them that they got it wrong? :rolleyes:

13th Dec 2001, 04:25
Thomas Cook Airlines eh?.Funny how after the big expensive launch of JMC when everyone went "WTF???"The official line was Thomas Cook was too "In House".Only the marketing gurus could get away with this bollox.The Germans have exposed the JMC "Brand" for what it is,a worthless collection of core values and mission statements and promtly adopted the TC name euro-wide.JMC are now being deliberately sunk by a combination of infighting,divide and conquer,management fatwas and surely the most inept commercial operation in the trade.(A sub-charter is an achievement considered worthy of a news letter).Make no mistake, the very isolation of the JMC brand from TC in the public psyche makes it easier to ditch without any front page headlines.Stand by for the quiet and unmourned death of JMC and the re-birth of some form of "Thomas Cook"low cost operation with pisspoor pay+conditions.The pilots of course will have been the cause of the downfall by their selfish refusal of pay cuts.Oh, and its all a result of Sep 11 of course 'cause we all know the Brits will not be on the Costas this summer.
The whole TC Belgium thing is a Judas Goat and makes about as much sense as starting up "JMC Luxemburg Airlines"These are the same people who harp on about "Synergies" and wasteful duplication of resources etc.The industry is apparently in such dire straits that TC have no other option than start a new operation in one of the smallest markets in Europe with the worst record of financial failure you can think of.
Three cheers for the House of Stewart and Osama bin Borai!! :mad:

[ 13 December 2001: Message edited by: HOMER SIMPSONS LOVECHILD ]

13th Dec 2001, 05:24
As our UK buddies are getting upset because they won't get a job at TCA, think about this:

An Ierish company, Ryanair, flys daily from Charleroi (near EBBR). And they have not a single Belgian pilot at hire. Better, they just hired 30 chees-heads a few months ago.

And maybe TCA will hire only Belgian pilots, maybe only because we have about 1500 unemployed pilots in Belgium, of wich 250 fresh from flight school.


The Guvnor
13th Dec 2001, 14:42
TopFly - considering the damage that BeCA did at Sabena, EAT/DHL and VEX (to name but three) do you really think FR wants to be infected with those morons? Furthermore, the social costs of employing Belgians prices them out of the market - get your government to change the tax and social security laws and you might have a better chance of success.

13th Dec 2001, 15:42
I think really good news.
Does anybody know if they are hiring new pilots or only ex JMC :eek:

13th Dec 2001, 17:50
One has to remember that when there was the big launch of JMC referred to above, JMC was 50.1% owned by Preussag. The name (and delighful colour scheme) were chosen in conjunction with Preussag too.

Since then of course, JMC have been purchased 100% by what was Condor Neckermann, who I guess rightly have recognised the well known brand is actually better than the new one!

Now that Thomson/Britannia is owned by Preussag, we have the fun of a new (naff?) colour scheme and living in The World of Tui (yes TWOT for short!) so it will be all change for both Thomson and JMC in the next year.

Rumour has it the JMC name could go altogether and all the TC group airlines will be Thomas Cook Airlines, give it 3 years and the Britannia/Hapag/Corsair names will probably have gone the same way! and we'll all end up as Tui Airways.

The Guvnor
13th Dec 2001, 22:49
At least their new livery is light-years better than jmc's!


14th Dec 2001, 04:21
oups Guys, always talking about Sabena pilots.....don't forget we are 70 Capt and Co fully ready to fly for TC.....Remember those City-Bird Pilots.

:mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

14th Dec 2001, 13:22
Not to forget Belgian ex-City Bird cabin crew is fully ready to work for TC in cooperation with BELGIAN pilots

The Guvnor
14th Dec 2001, 13:31
fly737 - was CTB also infected by BeCA?

14th Dec 2001, 20:00
Have to agree with the Guvnor, the BeCA are probably able to screw up the whole thing within a year. Also to be fair this is the EU we are talking about, and any EU member has a right to work in any other EU member state. Just one thing for the Brits though, Belgian Social Security, Taxes etc are a nightmare. Better off to work through one of those non-Belgian Interim companies that have licences to place Crews there.

;) ;)

Mr Angry from Purley
14th Dec 2001, 22:02
Should it not be Thomas Cook Airlines - State
Airline of Belguim - as the way its going only EAT will be left and can't see the Top Nobs wanting to go on a 727F...
Why is everyone so anti Belgian Pilots, or is it just the Union that are the problem?. Do you have to have a Union by Belgian Law?

:mad: :mad:

15th Dec 2001, 16:08
Mr Angry, you don`t have to be in the Union in Belgium, except that companies with more than 50 employees should have a Union representative. The BeCA are not a recognised Union, only think they are, and its not that anyone is against Belgian Pilots its just that nearly all of them with SN and DAT were members of the BeCA. I`m afraid it kind of leaves a bitter taste. Shame for all those good guys out there getting 'tarred with the same brush'. Anyway
not to worry the Belgians want an EU peacekeeping force to send to Afghanistan send all the BeCA members and then perhaps some normality can return to Belgian aviation.

Good idea or what ??

;) ;)

15th Dec 2001, 18:47
I happen to think that the Gov is right and the new livery is excellent.

Wouldn't it be interesting to see how the airline goes and if Thomas cook AG adopt it for the entire fleet? Condor, JMC etc. It would certainly cut costs and provide an interchangeable fleet. As I understand it, the 5 A320's to be used are coming from JMC anyway. :eek: :eek: :eek:

16th Dec 2001, 14:26
Shame that bmi, my travel and TWOT appear to have adopted the jmc style of livery :D

The new TC livery is a BIG improvement. Lets hope that those awful uniforms get changed as well ;) :D