First Call ?

[Capt. Vilo]

Not sure im in the wright place but hear goes...On an initial call to a station would you ....
1) Address the station and pass your call sign wait for a "pass your message reply"
or
2)Address the station and pass your call sign and your request e.g G-ABCD request flight information/zone transit etc etc...

Thanx

[K-SIMM]

Speaking as an ATCO in the UK, although it's not in CAP413 (at least last time I read the book but I really wish it was though) it helps no end if on inital contact you say;

a) Who you're calling,
b) Your full callsign,
c) What you want ie, if you're on the ground, outbound, local, circuits etc, or if you're in the air; inbound, transit etc.

If you say what you want in your very first call, we know which colour strip to use.

"Somewhere Tower G-ABCD Local" means that out of the choice of 3 coloured strips we know which one to start writing on!

"Somewhere Tower G-ABCD" who knows what colour to use!

After 10 years of ATCOing I still manage to get the wrong strip, proably 80% of the time!

It's really annoying those people who insist on giving their details without being told to "pass your message", do you think you are too special to be invited to pass your message?!

[ADIS5000]

K-SIMM

Although I'm mil and as such wouldn't even consider getting into a CAP413 debate!...............found this:

CAP413, chapter 3, page 6, para 1.5.2 states -

1.5.2 The service that an enroute flight requires should be identified in the initial call to an ATS unit.
eg. " xxxx approach, G-ABCD request flight information service"

1.5.3 When instructed by the ATS Unit to ‘Pass Your Message’ the reply should contain the following information, whenever possible in the order specified:
a) Aircraft Callsign / Type
b) Departure Point and Destination
c) Present Position
d) Level
e) Additional details / Intention (e.g. Flight Rules, Next route point)

Happened to be reading it in work last week, hope it's of some use to Capt. Vilo? If not, please feel free to ignore!!

Regards, ADIS

[K-SIMM]

CAP413, chapter 3, page 6, para 1.5.2 states - 1.5.2 The service that an enroute flight requires should be identified in the initial call to an ATS unit.
eg. " xxxx approach, G-ABCD request flight information service"


Well that's the RT for en-route sorted then! Perhaps the CAP413 editor forgot about the RT for outbound and inbound phraseology!

ADIS5000 You say you are Military, I don't know what discipline you're in (or how you guys and gals do things!) but does it benefit you if an aircraft calls you and says what he wants in the first call (assuming no prior co-ordination or PPR etc)??

[ADIS5000]

K-SIMM,

I'm a FC and the nature of our business is slightly different to most other ATS providers. However, for unexpected freecalls we prefer the initial call to be just our station name and the name of the callsign calling us. (We can be working and / or monitoring 2 or 3 other freqs, so we don't really want the full request until we're focused on the right freq.)

I take it the CAP413 reference is only a partial help then?!

Regards, ADIS

[K-SIMM]

ADIS5000

Excuse my ignorance but what is a FC? Like I said, I don't really know what you guys and gals do in the Mil!

I get the idea about monitoring/working 2 or even 3 frequencies, I do that and those other frequencies are not even mine!

Re the CAP413 reference, I think I had better download the latest version to see whats new!

[Gonzo]

Fighter Controller.......

[K-SIMM]

Ahh, should have thought about it really! Maybe I should do my next TRUCE visit to a Military gaff.

Cheers Gonzo!

[Capt. Vilo]

Thanx guys for your help ... from now on station address, call sign and service required. Ta...............