Crown Indemnity Insurance

[WorkingHard]

I have done a search but not found the answer. can anyone please tell us where to apply for the insurance waiver? A url would be nice but any info welcome.

[Chilli Monster]

I don't think there's a 'waiver' as such to apply for.

You get the cover listed on your insurance certificate and then when you book into an MoD airfield you fax the policy document which shows the cover to them beforehand or show it to them when it comes to paying the landing fees.

[WorkingHard]

Thanks CM but it has to be "pre-approved" otherwise they will not waive the additional charge. Problem is the MOD website is so utterly useless to find anything or navigate.

[jayteeto]

You don't need the website. As CM says, the crown indemnity is something you take up with your insurance company. A fax of the certificate is the preapproval required. The MOD do not issue the certificate.

[ShyTorque]

There IS an address to apply to and obtain an MOD insurance waiver certificate, which is subsequently carried on board the aircraft to be presented at the time of landing at a government aerodrome. It doesn't cost anything for issue, but copies of your insurance documents need to be sent for their prior approval. I recall it's a department of RAF Strike Command but I don't have the actual address to hand just at the moment.

[WorkingHard]

Thanks ST - Just the info I was looking for. For others that may read this post, your insurer, of course, will issue the requisite certificate which then has to be "approved" by MOD before any waiver of insurance will be granted when landing at a government airfield.

[stiknruda]

Chaps, I'm very much with Chilli here.

I often pop into a local fighter base. On the first couple of times (in different aircraft) , the bods in the tower would phone the squadron where I'd parked my "jet" and ask about Crown Indemnity.

On the first occasion it took a bit of phoning around and maneouvering before I could categoricaly quote the waiver number. That number, was my policy number. Nowadays I just carry a photocopy of the policy, which states "Crown Indemnity £xM" and Robert is your mother's brother.

In general, I fear it's safe to say that, they (scope-dopes in the twr) have no more of a clue what to look for than you!

[ShyTorque]

I should add that we do actually have reference numbered waiver certificates for all our company aircraft as we do use military airfields quite often. We renew them annually and they are carried in the aircraft.

If no-one else can come up with the contact details I will look it up next week. :ok:

[WorkingHard]

Shy Torque - That would be most helpful. This simple question I posed does perhaps illustrate the confusion that exists on this (and no doubt many other) issue. It is also perhaps indicative of a general confusion in aviation here in the UK about so many things. We fly in very crowded skies, with rules and regulations more akin to another age and even the people who fly/control for a living cannot agree on so many things. What chance has average PPL to know what he can/cannot do without spending so much time researching before every flight?

[Squadgy]

A month or so back I was asked to fax a Crown Indemnity Certificate to a UK mil airfield we wanted to operate in to - they advised us to contact our insurer to obtain this - which I did - reply was 'Contact the MoD, they'll issue it on seeing a copy of your insurance certificate'.

So I too would be interested in the contact details,( our insurers didn't have them!)

[A and C]

As stated above the guys on the ground dont know what to look for when looking at insurance documents and the MoD reqire the wording to be exact so a copy of your insurance has to go off to the MoD ( Strike command at High Wycombe administer this ) and a cirtificate is issued for the life of your insurance policy.

The cirtificate number is usualy asked for when ever requesting to use a military airfield

I think that the system was put in place with the aim of keeping civil aircraft out of military airfields wile telling MP's that the RAF are trying to recover money for the tax payer, it is a bit of a pain to get the paperwork done but I have found the RAF very helpfull to work with as long as you understand there funny little habits like QFE !.

[Yorks.ppl]

fascinating stuff this !
I am planing a trip to see some friends who live on the airfielf at lyneham, I have never flown into an RAF aerodrome so this whole crown indemnity thing is new to me,
Question: is it mandatory? and if not do they charge you an insurance premium when you land?
Any advice most welcome.

thanks

[ShyTorque]

Yorks.ppl,

Yes, the indemnity waiver certificate is so you won't get charged for crown indemnity each time you visit.

[Chilli Monster]

Question: is it mandatory? and if not do they charge you an insurance premium when you land?
Any advice most welcome.

Not mandatory - if you don't have it they will charge you a supplement every time you land. Used to be GBP 8.50. don't know if that's changed.

Might be worth having a chat to your insurers - they may add it for no extra charge, or at least a nominal admin fee.

(I've operated into Lyneham - all Ops wanted to do was see an insurance certificate with the words "Crown indemnity" and "GBP 7,500,000" clearly visible).

[BossEyed]

The relevant address is (or was, in 2002):

Sec (Civil Use & PC) 1b
Room 1E08/16
E Block
Headquarters Strike Command
RAF High Wycombe
Bucks HP14 4UE

Directory enquiries will give you the HW swicthboard, who will min turn be able to pass you on to the relevant extension if you quote the desk as above.

[ShyTorque]

That's the one!

[Fuji Abound]

BossEyed - wrong address, from 4/1/2005 the address is:

Wider Markets Support
Building 1406
Room 3
RAF Daws Hill
High Wyecombe
Bucks
HP11 1SH

Civil use is now the responsibility of HQSTC Wider Markets Team.

Most RAF sations will charge you the supplement even if you have Crown indeminity insurance.

The Crown indemnity waiver certificate enables use of MOD bases without paying the supplement. In order to get the certificate you need Crown indemnity insurance cover and undergo a security clearance check.

[WorkingHard]

" undergo a security clearance check" Fuji I am sure you are probably correct but does anyone know what this has to do with insurance cover and what happens if one fails such a check? Have the MOD gone completely mad or is this just another ruse to restrict the use of mod airfields?

[Fuji Abound]

Working hard - it doesnt have anything to do with insurance but a waiver entitles you to use a particular MOD base on more than three occasions. If you are going to be a more frequent visitor it is not a bad idea that the MOD "know" who you are!

[WorkingHard]

Thanks Fuji, it is now clear and I misunderstood the intent

[TheOddOne]

The lady at Wider Markets Support is very helpful but don't expect a final answer any time quickly. We've been in the system now for a couple of months, waiting patiently.
We only use RAF Benson for ILS and SRA approaches for IMC initial training/renewals and have never touched there, but still get charged the supplement as well as the approach fee (discount for training, which is very useful!) I think it works out at £17.50 for an ILS.

We can still benefit from the waiver by having reduced fees, so we're going through the system.

Originally we had to complete security clearance forms. These are no longer necessary but we did have to provide some data about pilots for clearance. Instead of putting down all the pilots who might fly the a/c, we put down the names of the instructors who will be in charge of the a/c. This is apparently quite acceptable.

TheOddOne

[Squadgy]

Do tou have to obtain as application form to go through this process or will just a letter suffice? Is there a fee for issuing the certificate.

I guess if the MoD are vetting pilots using their airfields then it could be seen as a positive for operators of grouped owned - it's often the case that you know very little about new group members. If the MoD's vetting clears them for regular access to bases then it would be a fairly good indicator that they didn't have any 'nasty' hidden past!

Obviously I'm not suggesting jamming up MoD with applications, but if you have to do it anyway.......

[TheOddOne]

Squadgy,

Try giving the lady at Wider Markets a ring. She e-mailed me the form and helped me fill it in. Still haven't had a reply back though, apprently it does take some time...

Cheers,
TheOddOne

[WorkingHard]

I have just recieved the forms from the MOD and I have to say that for a casual user it is probably worth paying the £20.00 insurance charge. The form was NOT designed for the casual user and until the form is completed an insurance waiver certificate will not be granted. Enquiries reveal that the form MUST be completed in all respects or it will not be actioned.