What do you mean by, "Resume own navigation"

[Hermie]

Hi,

I've got a scanner and everytime I heard the ATC says this to the pilot.

EG:
Singapore 6 resume own navigation direct to Anito<this is a fix/vor/ndb>

So what do they actually mean by resume own navigation ? Can the ATC still give the pilot vectors direct ?

Thank you !!

Cheers,
Herman :)




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Ad Astra Per Aspera

[niteflite01]

Someone more qualified than me will probably answer this - but in the meantime :

"Resume Own Navigation" means the pilot will do literally that - resume totally his own navigation to the fix/beacon/whatever. This usually means direct but cannot be assumed to be so.

Therefore, if there is some sort of conflicting or opposite direction traffic, the aircraft will be "locked" onto a "radar heading". This is usually issued by the ATCO and will then ensure the aircraft does not stray in any way, from it's given course, thus ensuring separation.

Hmmmmm make sense?

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"Go around..I say again...go around"

[HEATHROW DIRECTOR]

It's totally self-explanatory - it's what happens after ATC has been vectoring an aircraft and the pilot is then cleared to resume his planned route.

[Hermie]

Hey fellas,

Thanx for the reply !!

Take for example:

Plane flying to Point E. Starts from point A. Planned route, b,c,d. That would mean the pilot would then resume own navigation direct to b,c,d. I hope I'm correct.

Anyway if there is an aircraft flying close to this particular plane, the ATCO will be able to tell the pilot to fly a different heading, am I correct ?

So, is there a need to plan a route if ATCO can give vectors direct !

I hope this make sense. Do correct me if I'm wrong !

Thank you

Cheers,
Herman :-)




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[TheLizard]

Hermie,
So you're suggesting that we (ATC) do the steering, and the pilots... do what? Put the gear and flaps down, and remember to return the stewardess to the upright position?

I issue headings when I HAVE to, not because I want to. Issuing headings increases your workload - in your scenario I would have to make sure I turned every aircraft left or right at a particular point - some concentration required. What if I have 10 or even 20 such points in my bit of airspace? And lots of aeroplanes all wanting to go different directions? S***loads of concentration required.

The primary task of ATC is to keep them apart and there is more than enough work to do in achieving that. But steering as well? No thanks.

The Lizard
=========
Do the dance and become a lizard

[eyeinthesky]

I hope Hermie was just joking...

What he seems to miss is that the "Resume own navigation" usually includes a point to go to. Therefore if he was past B on his trip it would usually be a "Resume own navigation to C" (or D if that suited ATC better). Only an idiot would turn back to B...

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"Take-off is optional, Landing is mandatory"

[Hermie]

Hi,

Thanx for the reply. My apologies if I wasn't clear in explaining ! Nevertheless, I seem to get the point.

Thanks for all the replies !

Another example:
What does Alpha, Gold, Quebec, Mike and all the others mean during ATIS.

ATIS readout: ....... report info Juliet with ATC.

5-10 mins later it changes, WHAT DOES it MEAN and Why does it change ?

Cheers,
Herman



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[HEATHROW DIRECTOR]

I've never heard a "Gold" ATIS. Us Heathrow chaps are, of course, used to the word "Gold" when ordering bathroom fittings, car ashtrays, etc.....

The ATIs provides, among other things, information about the weather. Weather reports at airfields are updated usually once every 30 mins - more frequently if the weather is bad. Each ATIS broadcast is given a code letter which, as you may have tumbled, follows alphabetical sequence. Hence the first broadcast of the day is "A", next is "B", etc. I would have thought that this would have been obvious if you listened regularly..

The ATIS broadcasts change as often as is required to update the information but once every 30 mins is about the norm.

[Hermie]

Hi,

Thank you for your reply !

My apologies, Golf not Gold ! The letter <f & d> are just beside each other therefore must be typo error !

Sorry but Thanks for the information !

Thanx for the replies mates !

Cheers,
Herman :)




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[karrank]

All information presented so far is accurate.
Our (Oz) book says pass "tracking instructions". This mostly means we say "track direct (insert waypoint here)" but could also be "continue heading 240 for pilot intercept of the 240 radial of the *****nuckles VOR" or somesuch.

Flights are generally planned via routes that (theoretically) provide some sort of separation during high workload (when an ATC should not be pushing the track shortening) or during radar failure. When its quiet & everything is working you can relax it a little.

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"Station calling Centre, grow a head..."

[Code Blue]

Would I be safe in assuming that while vectoring flights either under IFR or VFR, ATC takes responsibility for terrain/obstacle clearance? I also presume that vectoring only occurs within controlled airspace

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[divingduck]

In Oz and the middle East, we can only vector inside controlled airspace as we can (usually) guarantee that there is no one else there. Not so in uncontrolled airspace.
I'm not sure about anyone else, but vectoring VFR aircraft is fraught...we can't see the clouds, terrain etc.
I agree with one of the earlier posts...you don't vector for controller amusement, sometimes for punative measures (heh heh heh ) it is an extremely labour intensive excercise.
Cheers

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turn the plane! turn the plane!

[5milesbaby]

Here in the UK, we can give vectors in any airspace, as long as the aircraft is receiving a radar control, radar advisory, or radar info service, the latter two being ouside Class A airspace. However we aren't likely to see any VFR in Class B in the UK. If an a/c cannot take the vector due to cloud(vfr only) or terrain, then it is up to the pilot to state this and the radar service will probably be cancelled.

[This message has been edited by 5milesbaby (edited 03 June 2001).]

[Hermie]

Hi,

Thank you all for your replies !!

Here's one more !

Say I'm a Private Pilot doing my cross-country flights. Am I allowed to ask ATC for radar vectors to the airport I'll be landing ! I heard you have to navigate using landmarks, they call it 'dead-reckoning' ! My point is, are we allowed to ask for radar vectors to our intended destination !

If your answer is NO, please explain ! Thank you very much !

Cheers,
Herman



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[Super G]

Hermie, Yes you can ask for vectors to your point of destination but depending on what kind of airspace you are in and how busy the controller is ATC is under no obligation to give you that vector. If you are outside controlled airspace and the reason you are asking for a vector is because you are "geographically unsure of position" then obviously ATC will do everything possible to assist you if they can. Remembering of course that cloud and terrain clearance will always be the responsibility of the VFR pilot.
Keep in mind also that if you are considering using vectors to make it easier to get around the countryside on your VFR Nav exercises instead of using the DR techniques your flying instructor has taught you then that can be fraught with danger. Remember, not all the airspace that you fly in will be under radar coverage and the best controller in the world will be unable to help you if he can't see your paint on a radar. DR, 1 in 60 and your ever present whiz wheel will keep you out of more trouble than ATC can ever get you out of.
Not to say that ATC won't help when they can, just remember the only person you can truly rely upon when you're the PIC.

[Hermie]

Super G,

Thank you very much !

And Thanx to :

niteflite01
HEATHROW DIRECTOR
TheLizard
eyeinthesky
karrank
Code Blue
divingduck
5milesbaby


Thanx mates for making this Topic fully understandable by me and hopefully to others !

God Bless

Cheers,
Herman :)




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Ad Astra Per Aspera

[Hermie]

Hi again,

WHat is the difference between;

Proceed Direct to .....

Cleared to ......

Resume own navigation to ......

Thanx, I'm just curious !!

Cherrios,
Herman :)



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[eyeinthesky]

What a lot of listening to scanners you seem to do!! :) :)

My tuppenceworth:

Proceed direct to: A clearance to go direct to a point, maybe missing some intermediate ones out on the way.

Resume own navigation to: As already discussed, releasing someone off a radar heading. The point named may or may not mean missing out some intermediate ones.

Cleared to: General clearance, which can replace both of the above (in lose phraseology!) but could also take the form of a routing clearance given before departure. (E.g, Cleared to XXX via Airways YYY and ZZZ, climb FL AA, when instructed by radar FL BB, Squawk 1234".)

I'm sure others will have something to say as well.



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"Take-off is optional, Landing is mandatory"

[Hermie]

Thank You Very Much eyeinthesky!!

Yes, I listen to the scanner 24/7. While doing my projects, passing motion, having my 3 meals, on the road, in the train and before I go to sleep. I can't live without it !

My parents and friends call me :mad:

With or Without You
[i]YOU refers to the scanner ! :)

Ciao Bello,
Herman http://www.pprune.org/ubb/NonCGI/cool.gif




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