Pan European Licences?

[I Have No Suitable Name]

I have heard something about this in the past - are we to get new licences under JARs which will enable us to work anywhere in Europe? Any timescale? Personally I hope so - NATS/TAG could do with some serious competition from other employers of ATC staff and I'm getting quite "fed up" at the erosion of our terms and conditions - privatisation, pensions, NSC, pay, and yes the new tubes in SCACC are a complete joke! Oops slipped into moan mode there - any info on JARs, and just who does have the best conditions in Europe? I'll bet the French have a decent deal - they refuse to be pushed around, sums it up really.....
:confused:

[HEATHROW DIRECTOR]

If you are that dissatisfied what the hell are you doing in the job? There are plenty of jobs out there driving lorries, cleaning lavatories, serving in shops, etc..... Maybe those workers have better conditions than us? I think not - DEFINITELY not. If you think we have bad conditions you simply don't know which side your bread is buttered on..

[Nogbad the Bad]

Mine's buttered on the reverse side HD.....well, it always seems to be when I drop it (hehehe)

:p :p :p

[I Have No Suitable Name]

Heathrow Director, if your lavvy cleaners etc want better conditions then I suggest they pull their finger out and get a better job. Get off your high horse before your saddle slips - I was looking for a comparison between ATC providers in Europe so if and when any JAR licence came in, I
could give serious consideration to working for a better employer.
Im sorry I keep forgetting we must not moan about our lot, so I take it all back, my pension is absolutely top-class, my salary outstanding, I'm firmly behind PPP/Privatisation, I totally understand the requirement for NSC cancellation, I won't be requiring a pay rise this year, and after looking again the new Skyline display is an excellent piece of kit. Aye b*ll*cks.
:mad:

[GroundBound]

I don't think pan-european licences are imminent, but there is some movement to try to get standardisation in training etc. The Safety Regulation Committee has put forward an ESARR (Eurocontrol Safety Regulatory Requirement) requiring all members of Eurocontrol (and ECAC) to "licence" their controllers. It defines new rating and training standards, as well as a proposed new format. However, it must be implemented through national regulations. There is no definition that it is cross-border compliant. Each country will make its own rules about acceptance. Details on http://www.eurocontrol.int/src/index.html
Note that it proposes new ratings which deviate from the present ICAO ratings.

[HEATHROW DIRECTOR]

Crikey if I ever got on a horse I'd definitely fall off!! I'm sorry if I upset Mr No-name but, seriously, we do have pretty good working conditions compared to many, many workers. I've worked abroad too - nothing like working with a gun sticking in your ear... or 12-hr watch systems (all day, followed by all night, followed by one day off) with minimal leave and no public holidays. These little things tend to focus one's mind you understand. I'm very, very contented with the 33 hour week I've been working for the last 28-odd years... and if you spread your leave you'll find you only work about 180 days a year. Mention this to the poor devils who work real 40+ hour weeks and get two weeks holiday. Of course, if it's a professional job you want you could try being a hospital doctor.. about 4 times the work we do for half the pay..

[hatsoff]

HD (P),
You are clearly a happy bunny having been a one unit ATCO and you probably enjoy a good life style having taken out a mortgage many years ago.
Your level of disposable income may lead you to your conclusions about pay but for many of us it is a different story.

Many of us are fed up earning less than a B&Q manager , travelling miles to work , jumping through examination hoops and living miles from our family roots , while knowing that our European Colleagues are having a far better time? .
Your initial response to the poster was both smug and rude. The points he makes are valid.

Any opportunity to provide European Job Flexability would be very welcome.

[Spoonbill]

It's a long long way away.
Until the UK CAA SRG are convinced that the rest of Europe conforms to the UK standard, they will continue to oppose such measures.

Those with asperations to work outside the UK, (unless it's with Eurocontrol), should remember that the cost of living in many European countries, especially in the major towns and cities (where most atc facilities happen to be), are at least on a par with the UK, and often overall life improvements are negligible.
Salary levels vary enormously throughout Europe for our trade, and if a pan european licence was introduced, there would be more atco's chasing the same job, so why would employers make conditions any better?
At the end of the day, (it gets dark), this is the syndrome of us all talking about moving elsewhere, but very few of us actually doing it. :rolleyes: