JAR-FCL PPL(A) vs NPPL

[FiiS]

I posted this in another forum and got a mixed response ... it was suggested by many I put it here!

Posted - 09 August 2004 : 12:23:47
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In case I've got the abbrevaitions wrong, what I'm talking about is the full Private Pilot's Licence and the new National PPL for use in the UK only.

At the moment I'm crossing everything I have two of in the hope that I'll eventually get a Flying Scholarship from the Air League pending selection next week, and join the Cambridge University Air Squadron to eventually get my license. I've only got about four hours powered, so I'm basically starting from scratch (although I do have my BGA "A" cert, with over 18 hrs in gliders so that should help a lot)

At the moment, it would seem I'm eligible to apply for scholarships until I'm about 25 (for GAPAN and Air League). Can anyone tell me what licence is worth going for, with or without support?? Tuition, exams and medical for the JAR PPL will cost about £5000 I think (anyone with a better figure, please say) but the NPPL will be a lot cheaper. But how much?? I'm aware of the restrictions for NPPL... how can you progress from NPPL to full PPL.

I have tried to find the answers, honest! but I'd like to hear from people who are either working towards and licence, or hold one- which in your opinion is better?

Thanx

Fii S

[LondonJ]

I did my PPL before the NPPL was an option, but given the choice again I would have stuck with what I've got. The NPPL is cheaper but if you are already contemplating upgrading to the full PPL later then I would advise forgetting about the NPPL and going straight for the PPL as on the whole you will spend a lot more money by doing both.

I was under the illusion that my PPL would cost about £7000 but despite doing 45hrs it all came to about £10000 as there were a lot of 'hidden' extras such as landing fees, exams and test fees, medical, equipment etc. All be it that the school I trained at wasn't the cheapest.


From LASORS, if you wish to upgrade then:

The holder of a NPPL with SEP aircraft rating
wishing to obtain a JAR-FCL PPL(A) shall :-a)
Complete at least 45 hours flight time, of which
at least 35 hours must have been as a pilot of
SEP aeroplanes. A maximum of 5 hours may
be completed in an approved FNPT or flight
simulator. This flight time must include :-

1) 20 hours dual instruction of SEP
aeroplanes with a JAR qualified instructor;

2) 10 hours supervised solo flight time on
SEP aeroplanes which must include 5
hours solo cross country flight time
including one cross country flight of at
least 270 km (150 nm), during which full
stop landings at two different aerodromes
different from the aerodrome of departure
shall be made as per JAR-FCL 1.125.

b) Pass the JAR-FCL PPL(A) Theoretical
Knowledge Examinations (unless previously
passed for the NPPL (SSEA).

c) Hold a valid JAR-FCL Class 1 or 2 medical
certificate.

d) Pass the JAR-FCL PPL(A) Skill Test as detailed
in Section C1.4.ch includes operational limitations).

[IO540]

£10k in 45 hours - that frankly sounds like you got taken to the cleaners. Did you do it in a twin?

I agree the NPPL is a waste of time. One cannot fly abroad, which takes out what are arguably the most interesting and rewarding trips.

Most people that do the NPPL are people who cannot get the CAA Class 2 medical.

[LondonJ]

I did it all on PA28 Warriors. But there were lots of things that weren't mentioned when I started on the course, for example, at the field I trained at all aircraft based there did not have to pay a landing fee but said school would charge £11.75 a pop (a third per t&g) for a landing irrespective. Add that to various things like the £200/yr membership (for the privelige of training there) and you start to get the picture.

[BEagle]

The NPPL is NOT a waste of time! If you want to have a licence which permits you to carry passangers for a while and then 'upgrade' to the JAR-FCL PPL(A) later when you can more easily afford it, nowadays you can. Incidentally, having drafted the LASORS NPPL entry for the Belgrano, I would like to point out that the hours totals are NOT additional to the 35-ish hours you will have by the time you get your NPPL as any flying for the NPPL will count towards the total needed for the JAR-FCL PPL(A) - as will the exams you will have passed for the NPPL.

Who on earth charges the extortionate level of fess you quoted? They should be named and shamed!

[IO540]

While I agree that anything that makes flying more accessible is worth doing, I would suggest that if the difference between the costs is enough to make all the difference between flying and not flying, the pilot will likely have difficulty financing the minimum PPL(A) hours requirements (12 over two years), never mind maintaining any sort of currency.

Anyway, it appears that a lot of other people have come to the same conclusion.

[bookworm]

BEagle

I'm a bit of a skeptic when it comes to the NPPL. I certainly salute any attempt to make flying more accessible, but I need to be convinced that the NPPL really achieved it.

Undoubtedly, if you can't pass a JAR-FCL class 2 medical, the NPPL is the way to go. But for those students who can, the arguments in favour of the NPPL should be that:

a) the training course is shorter and

b) the training is cheaper because the requirements for FTOs are more relaxed.

It would help me to see some evidence that these advantags are real. For example:

a) what proportion of candidates actually obtain their NPPL in fewer hours than the JAR-FCL PPL 45 hour minimum?

b) what is the availability of more cost-effective training for NPPL vs the JAR-FCL PPL (i.e. a survey of training rates)?

Given the upgrade path, I'm not sure that anyone should ever contemplate training for the NPPL with a non-JAR-FCL instructor if they have any intention of obtaining a JAR-FCL PPL later, so perhaps b) is less relevant.

Do you know of any data that might convert me to a fan of the NPPL?

[englishal]

45hrs it all came to about £10000
Sheeeet.....

I paid about $5000 for a JAA PPL, and 63 Hrs, all but 15 hrs in a 172. I paid about another $5000 for an IR (FAA). I paid about another $12000 for FAA ME & SE CPL with about 50 hrs multi.....

[LondonJ]

3 years on and I am now aware that the US is a cheap option but when I first started I didn't have a clue that things like this forum existed so I just showed up to my local airfield and pointed myself towards the largest building that had flying school written across it.