FAA IR Currency

[drauk]

I've always assumed that the instrument approaches for the currency of the FAA IR (6 approaches in the last 6 months) could be undertaken in a G-registered plane. Is this in fact the case?

If it is I can see a slightly strange scenario developing, assuming you fly a G-registered plane and have a UK IMC rating.

Imagine you'd let your FAA IR currency lapse by not having done the approaches in the last 6 months. By FAA rules you now have to do those approaches (and en-route work) under the hood with a safety pilot to become current again. But with your IMC rating in a G-reg you can do the approaches without that safety pilot.

Presumably, following the letter of the FAA law, even if you'd done dozens of approaches on your IMC rating after your FAA-definition currency had expired, you'd still have to do further approaches with a safety pilot to become FAA current, no matter how silly it seems?

[Aim Far]

I don't think this is particularly strange really. The way I see it, when I am flying in IMC in a G-Reg, I am doing so on the basis of my IMC. The fact that the IMC was issued on the back of the FAA IR is not important and its validity is not dependent on the IR. All the FAA IR did was exempt me from the IMC test - I paid my £67 and got a standalone rating on my JAA PPL.

When flying on my IMC, I am subject to its validity requirements, which don't require a safety pilot after 6 months.

And AFAIK, all approaches anywhere in anything SEL count for FAA IR SEL purposes. So each time I did an approach, it would count towards my 6 approaches currency.

That said, last time I went for more than a few months without an approach, I got a lesson before I went up in IMC again. Its the safe option.

[Flyin'Dutch']

Uh, of course they count.

As do any hours you do in any registered aircraft for the issue of a license [sic]

FD

[IO540]

However, you can fly IFR in UK Class G, G-reg plane, on an FAA PPL/IR.

So, an ILS into Biggin Hill or Exeter for example (Class G) should qualify.

[drauk]

Okay, so the approaches in a G-reg do count towards currency, but I guess the second part of my question wasn't very clear. Let me try again.

Take this scenario:

1) Do 6 solo approaches on 1st January (thus am FAA IR current for the next 6 months)
2) Do no approaches until:
3) 1st September do 6 solo approaches in a G-reg plane (valid because pilot holds a valid IMC rating)

On 2nd September is the pilot FAA IR current or not? I am assuming not, because the FAA regulations state that if you've not done 6 approaches in the last 6 months you have to do them with a safety pilot.

[Aim Far]

I am assuming not, because the FAA regulations state that if you've not done 6 approaches in the last 6 months you have to do them with a safety pilot.

I can see where you're coming from but I don't agree. On 2 September, you've done 6 approaches in the last 6 months so you don't get as far as looking to the safety pilot bit of the FARs. Your FAA IR is current.

[Flyin'Dutch']

There are of course another zillion scenarios you can dream up for which the FARs or ANO will not have a bitesize fitting answer.

After all the feds don't care about your IMC rating nor can be reasonably expected to regulate those of us who have multiple licences.

If you take the practical view that the FARS state that you have had to do 6 approaches (and holds etc) in the 6 months before you want to exercise the privileges of your FAA IR then you are OK.

If you are neurotic you best comply with all the rules and throw practicality overboard.

Why would you want to do less than 6 approaches in 6 months anyway? After that it would only make sense to take a safety pilot, or not?

FD

[S-Works]

I hope you can becaUse thats how I have been doing it! My interpretation has been that the reg of the aircraft is irrelevant for the the FAA.

Now going through the nutache of converting to a JAR IR, how much bloomin groundschool!!!!!!

[mixture pull]

bose-x, why would you convert your FAA IR to a JAA one when you've already got an IR?

[2close]

I hope I've got hold of the right end of the stick here but it seems to me that:

On 01/01 you do 6 approaches in G-Reg a/c - FAA IR current for next 6 months.

Assuming no further approaches done, on 02/07 FAA IR no longer current.

However, on 03/07, you do 6 approaches in G-Reg a/c, whilst exercising privileges of UK IMC with no safety pilot. However, 6 approaches have now been completed so FAA IR current again for further 6 months.

Have I got this right? :confused: :confused:

2close

[Chilli Monster]

bose-x, why would you convert your FAA IR to a JAA one when you've already got an IR?
So that you can fly 'G' reg aircraft outside UK airspace IFR.

[S-Works]

Converting to JAR becuase I own a couple of G-Reg aircraft. All of the twins that I fly are G-reg and I am fed up of being excluded from Class A when IFR.

It really gets my goat having to fly down the side of the N866 airway when going on my frequent trips to the channel islands just because the aircraft reg is wrong!

There are a whole multitude or reasons for changing but in a nutshell the FAA while brilliant, more logical to achieve etc is not much use unless you own or have EASY access to a well equipped aircraft on the N-reg.

I have access to an N-reg aircraft but it is a long way from home and so when needed for trips has to be collected and staged ready for the trip which loses some of the spontanuity of a last minute trip.

I have looked to buy an N-reg but did not find anything that I liked at the right price!

A lot of people do the FAA IR for a number of reasons:
A) the experiance,
B) to tell other people they have an IR
C) to get an IMC rating on the back of it.
D) they percieve it is easier than the JAR (depends on your view)

But it does have a limitations.

There are no doubt a few more

[mixture pull]

Bose-X, sorry my mistake. I read what you wrote in another thread about having got an IR over and above your IMC to allow flight in class A and assumed you had a JAA IR.

[IO540]

The FAA IR does practically require you to own an N-reg plane, or be in a group operating one.

But one could make a similar argument for IFR/airways flight generally; to get a plane of an adequate standard you probably either need to buy one (£100k +) or find a group of not-too-skint people who all have IRs.

If you can rent a plane in which everything always works, in which you would be happy to sit in IMC for hours if necessary, for less than about £250/hour, then you are lucky :O

For an owner, the FAA regime is excellent. You can do all the trivial maintenance yourself, for example. So if you go away for a few weeks around Europe, you don't need to go looking for a JAR145 maintenance shop when the 50-hr mark comes up. One could get around that particular one with a Private CofA but that brings other problems (no renting to anybody, not even to one's own business).

[englishal]

The FAA IR does practically require you to own an N-reg plane, or be in a group operating one
....or go to the USA a lot and take advantage of their free, and excellent IFR system ;)

What has been said is correct regarding IMC and FAA IR. One other point some people may have missed, is that if your IMC rating is due to lapse, do an FAA IPC with an FAA CFII (can be done in a sim in this country). This revalidates your FAA IR as well as the IMC rating for a further two years....

EA

[IO540]

I think you still have to send that form off to the CAA, with a cheque for £67 or so, to get the IMCR extended. I don't think renewing your FAA IR automatically extends your IMCR validity.

This is a useful privilege though, for anyone wishing to continue flying G-reg planes. It comes at a price: need to keep up the UK PPL and the CAA medical!

[Cusco]

As English al says the FAA/IR allows use of excellent IR facilities and certainly takes the pain out of renting a complex a/c in USA.


Still need a Instrument checkride though.

However I don't think the FAA checkride revalidates the IMC automatically:

I got my IMC donkeys years before the FAA/IR and treat it as an entirely separate rating.

Reval due next month, which with a bit of IMC revision will help keep FAA/IR aproaches up to numbers.

I personally find any IMC/IR validity maintenence a complete pain, flying as I do out of an isolated airstrip:I fly for pleasure only and if the strip's below minima I don't go.

Much easier to do if you're based at an a/d with ILS etc.

However I consider I worked bl**dy hard to get my FAA/IR and I'm not going to let it slip away by default.

There was a thread some time ago about doing ILS approaches solo, but under ATC control: Ie in VMC conditions., and whether these were valid in terms of the 6 approaches per 6 months rule, bearing in mind how easy it would be to take a peep , and the risk of VFR bimblers not under ATC control bimbling up your chuff.

Any views?

[englishal]

I think you still have to send that form off to the CAA, with a cheque for £67 or so, to get the IMCR extended
Correct....;)

[Flyin'Dutch']

Maybe I am a bit odd but rather than forking out £67 for a stamp wihtout any added value I rather spend that on availing the services of a quality IR/IMC instructor and do some further IF work, and get signed off on my IMC ticket as a result.

FD

[S-Works]

I agree using the FAA IR in the USA us 7th heaven. But this is restricted to a couple of trips a year for me and probably most other people as well.

My G-Reg aircraft are fully IFR equipped (apart from icing) and everything works. There enough photos of the cockpit here! They cost me around £60 an hour to run and meet my needs.

I am not knocking the N-reg or the FAA system, I think it is superb and practical for a number of reasons which was why I did the CPL/IR stuff in the first place. But self maintanance is something I would never do on an aircraft the same as I wont do on a car. I have a swollen thumb from stabbing myself with a corkscrew, imagine the damage I could do trying maintain an aircraft!! So there are no cost savings for me to put them on the N-reg and rather a lot of costs involved in transferring them!

The N-reg aircraft I will is extremely well equipped with GNS530/430 mode S, stormscope, ADF DME etc all brand new and tip top condition but it costs me around £250 an hour to fly.

So it was bite the bullet time and convert. Nothing hard about the JAR IR it is just padded it with excessive time wasting material that goes way to far into details that are uneeded. It is all ATPL stuff and the exams are just drawn from the ATPL pool. Why, why, why????

But I have to say very impressed with Atlantic Flight Training at Coventry so far.