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Bumz_Rush
14th Aug 2004, 18:01
Forgive me if this has been aired, and I do remember it has been discussed, but perhaps not the answer to my question.

Just where in the regulations does it state that a N registered corportate pt 91 aircraft operated in the UK or JAA airspace, must have two type rated crew members.

I need a hard copy to demonstrate to my "friend" just what is needed to comply with the regulations.

Lastly just which countries are implementing this regulation.

thanking you all in advance.

Bumz...(in Savannah)

Atlanta-Driver
14th Aug 2004, 18:53
Used to state that on the paper where FAA license was attached to for mailing. It's an ICAO rather than FAA requirement.

AD

Cathar
14th Aug 2004, 20:07
I’m afraid that you have got to look at several requirements to get the answer.

Paragraph 2.1.3.2 of Annex One to the Chicago Convention requires that “type ratings shall be established for: a) each type of aircraft certificated for operation with a minimum crew of at least two pilots;” and paragraph 2.1.4.1 requires that “A Contracting State having issued a pilot licence shall not permit the holder of such licence to act either as pilot- in-command or as co-pilot of an aeroplane or helicopter unless the holder has received authorization as follows:
a) the appropriate class rating specified in 2.1.3.1; or
b) a type rating when required in accordance with the provisions of 2.1.3.2.”

Article 39 b) of the Convention itself states that “Any person holding a license who does not satisfy in full the conditions laid down in the international standard relating to the class of license or certificate which he holds shall have endorsed on or attached to his license a complete enumeration of the particulars in which he does not satisfy such conditions.” and Article 40 states that “No aircraft or personnel having certificates or licenses so endorsed shall participate in international navigation, except with the permission of the State or States whose territory is entered.”

The FAA accept that the licence of a non type rated co-pilot does not meet requirements of Annex and that it should therefore be endorse in accordance with the requirements of Article 39 B0 of the Convention. In response to an audit by ICAO they state that “as of 1 January 2000 ATP certificates will be issued with the following endorsement in Section XIII, Limitations: “ For international operations, ICAO requires the second-n-command of an aircraft requiring more than one pilot to hold a type rating in that aircraft”.

From the point of view of the UK the relevant requirement are in the Air Navigation Order. Article 21 states that

(3) Subject as aforesaid, a person shall not act as a member of the flight crew required by or under this Order to be carried in an aircraft registered in a country other than the
United Kingdom unless:
(a) in the case of an aircraft flying for the purpose of public transport or aerial work, he is the holder of an appropriate licence granted or rendered valid under the law of the country in which the aircraft is registered or the State of the operator; or
(b) in the case of any other aircraft, he is the holder of an appropriate licence granted or rendered valid under the law of the country in which the aircraft is registered or under this Order, and the CAA does not in the particular case give a direction to the contrary.

This is qualified by article 21 (10) which states that:
Notwithstanding anything in this article:
(a)…….
(b) The holder of a licence granted or rendered valid under the law of a Contracting State other than the United Kingdom, being a licence endorsed as aforesaid [ie that it does not meet international standards], shall not act as a member of the flight crew of any aircraft in or over the United Kingdom except in accordance with permission granted by the CAA, whether or not the licence is or is deemed to be rendered valid under this Order.

Of course the situation is not straightforward if the licence does not have the appropriate endorsement. It is my understanding that the CAA have (or intend to) issue a Direction to clarify that non-type rated co-pilots may only operate in the UK with the specific permission of the CAA.

I hope that this is helpful

Bumz_Rush
14th Aug 2004, 21:28
Cathar,

Thank you so much for the answer to my question. I had been looking via google, and was not able to come up with the answer. I got close, but not close enough.

I will print out your response, and pass on to my "man".

Thanks again...

Bumz