Handling The Big Jets

[QCM]

HELLO... COULD SOMEONE HELP ME TO PURCHASE THAT D.P DAVIES REFERENCE BOOK " HANDLING THE BIG JETS" BY GIVING ME DOWNHERE SOME INTERNET ADRESS WHERE I CAN BUY IT ON LINE?
THANKS FOR YOUR HELP!:D :D

[Notso Fantastic]

http://shop.pilotwarehouse.co.uk or just type Handling the Big Jets into Google and there will be your answer.

Now:
1- it's unpleasant to have to read capitals like that- why do it?
2- there is a Questions forum where you should have posted this. It is etiquette to learn how to use a forum before posting on it.

[full length required]

Notso Fantastic, you sure know how to win friends and influence people! Give QCM a break - after all it is their first post!


QCM - welcome to the boards!

[BlueEagle]

Some second hand at varying prices here (http://dogbert.abebooks.com/servlet/SearchResults?&cm_re=A*Search+Box*Form&ph=2&imageField.y=7&imageField.x=33&tn=Handling+The+Big+Jets&an=D.P.Davies&sts=t) . Best of luck.

[Paracab]

Notso,

Surely you could have been more gentle with a brand new poster ?

I respect a lot of what you say, its a shame you let yourself down now and then with such strong views, especially with the new chaps on prune.

[hifive11]

Hi QCM

Got my copy from www.transair.co.uk excellent service and excellent book. They will send to France if that is where you are.

hi5

[Notso Fantastic]

What was unpleasant or 'not nice'? I just pointed out in simple language so a furriner can understand that it is manners to get to know a forum before posting to prevent posting in the wrong place, and capitals ain't nice. I answered his query which took 0.24 seconds on Google. Sometimes people have a duty to educate themselves on how to use the internet, and if they are going to venture into forums, they should take the trouble to learn how to use them-it's only manners. That was my nice face!

[L_T]

I thought it was just a French thing..

[keithl]

NotSo - If you don't learn to relax and cool down you're going to burst something!

Now tell me I should have posted this on "Medical & Health"

[FE Hoppy]

Keithl
Bravo!

[Notso Fantastic]

SO, YOU'RE HAPPY TO HAVE PEOPLE POST QUERIES (IN CAPITALS) IN THE WRONG FORUM FOR SOMETHING THEY COULD HAVE ANSWERED FOR THEMSELVES IN 1/4 SECOND WITHOUT ANYONE GUIDING THEM GENTLY (for me) TO THE RIGHT PLACE?

[FE Hoppy]

For a first or second post I have no problems at all. My mother has just discovered the "interweb" as she calls it and I wouldn't expect her to know the etiquette of forum posting before she started but she will learn quickly like most other people.

QCM could be anyone so why not encourage and assist.

I remember BA being pretty big on CRM have things changed that much?

[QCM]

Hello all of you and Notso F. ...Thank's to all of you for book references...my purpose was not to put such a nice forum on fire, it's not worth the polemic! In fact some din't seem to appreciate my way of... HANDLING THE BIG LETTERS!:p ;)

[Notso Fantastic]

You're welcome! Enjoy the book. It is a brilliant read.

[Global Pilot]

So many threads on this forum turn into discussions on the correctness where and how a post was put up. If you take offence to the way something is posted, click on the x up on the right hand of the window.

Address the question or move on. Attacks on new comers and deviations of the topic lessen the usefulness of this great website. I hate to do this because I am in a way posting here and not addressing the original question.

Don't like the reference to 'furriner' very much either. I believe this forum was started by an Aussie so Not so might be considered a furriner round those parts. In short I find your contribution NOT SO FANTASTIC and I capitalise to say this because I feel like shouting.

Enjoy HTBJs..great book and welcome to the site!

[Clogmaster]

I THINK NOT SO FANTASTIC HAS TOO MUCH TIME ON HIS HANDS...

:mad: !!!

[126.9]

I'm sure it's a "brilliant read" if you've been stuck in a French jail for 20 years with nothing else to read!

[keithl]

Are you saying that NotSo has too much time on his hands because he's been stuck in a French jail for 20 years, reading HTBJ?

How do you know?

He should have finished it by now, so he could take it round to QCM himself when he gets out...

What was he in for??

[Firestorm]

Aside from the petty squabbling, does anyone who handles big jets, especially someone who has recently converted to one, have an opinion about how relevant HTBJ is in the first decade of the 21st century. I ask the question bearing in mind that it was written at about the time the 747 was coming into service, but in it's -200, analogue cockpit guise, rather than the FBW, EFIS/EICAM/FADEC Airbus and newer Boeing products of today. I am a 3000 hour turbo-prop guy who wants to move on: I think I can pick the useful matterial out of HTBJ, but would appreciate anyone elses views. And jet job offers.

[Notso Fantastic]

Goodness me don't we have some prima donnas on this board? What a waste of data throwing tantrums against someone gently showing a complete newbie how to correctly post, in the right place, without needing to use capitals, and moreover, how to answer his own question! Dare I say I have been rather busy flying to Australia and now, I have a small window to catch up on pprune from a sunny (and cold) Ozland? What's this crud about French jails? They're worse than a bunch of gossiping 20 year old stewardesses! When I see 'censored' on someone's post here, it makes me think perhaps Clogmeister had better clue himself up on the latest firm rules of Pprune, and precisely what is your qualification Clogmeister) to pontificate so? (Decency please!)

So, to stop wasting bandwidth and get back to the subject:
no job offers, but after 17 years flying 747s of 3 models, I can say that the book is enthralling. I believe it is almost completely relevant to modern day aircraft- instrumentation doesn't change what the book is about. It is written so a well educated layman or a flyer of smaller aeroplanes can follow and appreciate the differences. I think you will enjoy his inspired writing and see why people are still talking about the book after over 30 years.

[411A]

Moreover, new(er) guys, unless they actually read HTBJ, will have absolutely no appreciation for how the first generation jet transports operated.
Even better that reading about it, a much better idea would be to strap their backside into an 'older' model...say an 'ole B707 water wagon, and watch the expression on their face when the water runs out after takeoff.
Even better to have the yaw damper switched off (as it had to be) for takeoff and landing, strong gusty crosswinds included.

Only then would they begin to appreciate the technology present in modern types.

[NZLeardriver]

Has anyone else noticed that while Transair or Pilot Warehouse are selling HTBJ for about 25 quid new, Amazon US is selling it secondhand for anything between $131 and $221?

I find it very hard to believe that someone involved in as distinguished a field as aviation would be overcharging and simply trying to make a quick buck off others.
Maybe the crafty fellow selling his copy for $221 knows something I dont know.

Can anyone help explain this?

[JW411]

Firestorm actually has a very valid point. How relevent is HTBJ today in today's modern aircraft?

I knew the author (who is sadly no longer with us) and I am sure that he would be the first to admit that the new generation of jet aircraft have had most of the horror stories designed out of them. For example, it is extremely difficult to get my present aeroplane to Dutch Roll.

However, any true aviation person should be a constant information seeker and I agree totally with 411A that this book is a MUST read, even although you are unlikely to fly an old water-wagon 707.

The fact of the matter is that it is always the bizarre and the unexpected that kills people so, if you have read Dai's book and your "perfectly designed flying machine" starts to do unusual things, then you might just know what to do next!

[OverRun]

FIRST EDITION April 1967
SECOND EDITION May 1968
Reprint Jan 1969, April 1970
THIRD EDITION Dec 1971
Reprinted April 1973, Dec 1975, Dec 1977, Nov 1979 (that's my copy - maybe later ones exist).

The third edition added the detailed discussion on the Very Big aircraft (aka 747).

Thanks everyone for letting us know where one can buy it new. Some of the second hand (often North American) booksellers have an inflated idea of the value of their books on ALL topic - or maybe they are just charging what their local market will pay.

[August]

The pertinence of Handling the Big Jets today is as strong as it ever was, as is Fly the Wing. Both of these books are excellent recources to that information required to pass most of today's technical interviews.

Claims of HTBJ's "excellent reading" are highly over-stated. It's as boring as the author ever was! If you want a better read, try Jim Webb's Fly the Wing

[keithl]

Claims of HTBJ's "excellent reading" are highly over-stated. It's as boring as the author ever was!
I can't let that pass - and I relish the novelty of agreeing with NotSoFantastic! It is an excellent read, one of the most readable technical books I've ever enjoyed. As NotSo says, it's the quality of the writing that sets it apart. What is a "Good Read" is a matter of taste, but I must defend HTBJ against August's remarks.

[Notso Fantastic]

Steady now! Life's not got so sad you've come to that now surely! I read that comment with surprise. If HTBJ is a boring read, then aviation is giving you a message. I found it enthralling- opening up a whole new area of aviation to me and the new problems encountered. But I can perfectly accept some people don't take to it- but if you want a good explanation of the problems and characteristics of high altitude heavy flight, this is a damn good read even for (educated) non-pilots.

[readbackcorrect]

For what its worth i agree with Notsofantastic
Aviation is all about critique. U dont want posters to get into bad habits. Get em early is what i say.

[keithl]

RBC - don't know why you've revived this thread after 2weeks, but I would query yourAviation is all about critique. Critique is a large part of learning the job and improving, but Aviation is "ALL about" much more positive and fun things.