Getting a job as an instructor.

[Si]

Hi all,

Well I am currently 19 and just about to start my ATPL's. I have my PPL with 160 hours total,, therefore once my ATPL's are done i can move straight onto further training...Now the problem I am facing at the moment is this: I can do my IR or FI but not both, is it worth me doing my Ir straight away and going for the airlines, or should i get my FI without the IR and try and get a job instructing and then do my IR at a later date. I figure with my age being quite young I may be able to get on with an airline. open to opinions and thanks for your time.

Cheers

[Hugh Jampton]

Si
It really depends on whether you fancy instructing for a period or whether your ambition is to get into the right seat of a larger machine asap. If you want to take your chances with the airline jobs market do the IR - you won't get a job without it. If you become an instructor you will exist for a while on poor pay but you will get some hours in and become a more experienced and well-rounded pilot. If you ever get to a CPL/ATPL type school, some schools will take you on and give you an IR after a while - OATS did this for some guys recently - but you will need about 500 hours instructional time to get into such a school. Time is on your side so it is really up to you. Work out where you see yourself in a year or two and go for it...

[Kermit 180]

Consider also the cost of keeping your IR current. Can you afford to do that AND pay for a FI course? If not, and you really want to instruct, I suggest you look at doing the FI course first, then doing your IR.

Kermie http://www.stopstart.fsnet.co.uk/aircraft/stuka2.gif

[flaps to 60]

Si

I have to dissagree with kermit...sorry old chap!

An airline will not look at you without an IR if this is where you are heading.

I know many people who have been hearded into instruction before the IR and have watched people some of whom they trained, walk into airlines with only a couple hundred hours. How annoying is that.

Put all the ticks in the boxes for recruitment then add the icing after.

Good luck and i hope your decision suits you.

[Token Bird]

flaps to 60,

I have to disagree. The chances of walking into an airline job straight out of school are slim. Therefore, Si, you may find yourself having to work in a normal job for a couple of years, without the option of instructing for a living.

Yes, it's true that an airline won't look at you if you don't have an IR (I don't think Kermit was suggesting that they would), but getting the money from the bank to do an IR may be easier if the person has been instructing for a while, hence showing commitment. Also it means you don't have the horror of completing training then having to go back to an office job. Urgh!

[Airprox]

Si, I was in the same boat as you 8 years ago. Its a hard decision you've got to make. I decided to become an instructor and do the IR the next year. I loved instructing. Ok the pay is cr@p but you so much benefit from improving your own skills. The airline market is showing signs of slowing down. If you did the IR you might be lucky and get a job with a regional. But if your unlucky like so many you're left with a licence and no money or hours coming in.

When I reached the airlines I found I got a lot more respect from the Captains I flew with because of my background.

I instructed full time for 2 1/2 years, flew frieght on a F406 6 months, Saab 340 7 months, Embraer 145 1 1/2 years and now fly B757.

I still instruct and examine a part time. So it must be worth it. I wouldn't change a thing.

Good Luck ;)

[Si]

Airprox,

Cheers, thats the kind of thing i was looking for, i think thats what i am going to do, plus i can hopefully save money from my Instructing to able to do the IR without having to get a huge bank loan.

Thanks to everyone else who contributed!

[flaps to 60]

Sorry Token Bird I'm going to have to disagree again.

Just to give you a little of my history I did an intergrated course and came away with all the ticks in the right boxes. I had one or two interviews but was unsuccesful. Then I started instructing and now have the benefit of the basic qualifications and 1000 hours which puts me way ahead of someone with same hours but no IR.

Surely a bank will lend you £3-4000 with a chance of getting a job with your IR to do a FI course rather than on an instructors salary (if you could call it that) asking for
£8-10,000.

Dont forget the weather plays a big part. Will you make enough money to cover your payments? Look at how bad this summer was and as for winter.....

I have seen many friends get into the airlines doing instruction after getting thier IR but not the other way.

As Aiprox says things are not entirely rosey on the horizon so be prepared have all you need to get that job.

I would suggest that you speak to as many instructors as you can and see how they did it and if that suits you go with it.

Good Luck

[Token Bird]

Fair point, flaps to 60, unfortunately I only have enough cash for the CPL and FI. That would mean I would have to take out just as big a loan, as the total I would spend on a CPL/IR/FI will remain the same regardless of the order I do them in.

Plus, when I come back from SA, where I'll be studying for the ATPLs and getting some hours, I will be completely jobless so may not be able to get a loan at all!
But it's worth considering - I have a few months to decide.

[flaps to 60]

Token Bird and Si

have you looked at doing your IR's and FI at a foreign JAR approved school.

With the strength of the pound this may work to your advantage.

What ever way either of you choose I can say that an IR is immensly satisfying and instructing a lot of fun.

I wish both of you the very best of luck and hope that the decisions you make work for you.

[Si]

Whats the job front like for an instructor without an IR, I realise that I'd have more chance of getting a FI position than an FO if i did decide to go for the IR, but is there a shortage of instructors????

Thanks again

[flaps to 60]

Si

If you believe the papers, then a recession is on the way. This may have an effect on the airline market but will be tempered by the predicted retirement of hundreds of pilots.

But as an instructor you depend on people having dissposable income to be able to fly either for fun or career choice.

So once again I can only advise you to have all the ticks in the right boxes and be ready for that call that is more likely to happen if you have an IR than if not!

At my school I can see on the near horizon that things are going to change very soon and there will be a surplus of instructors many without IR's...think about it.

You are not alone in wondering which way to go, I spent 18 months trying to decide Ab Initio or Self Improver.

You are doing the right thing by seeking other peoples opinions. Dont only take mine as my decisions worked for me but may not for you and dont be cajoled into anything your not comfortable with.

You have youth in your favour and can afford to both take your time and make one or two ***** ups along the way.

Good luck in making the right decision
:) :) :)