Best route to FI(R)

[Richie Coulson]

As a PPL with 55hrs, my intention in the next few years is to gain my ATPL and get a job with an airline.

In the mean time, I intend to instruct to gain more experience as I would question the chances of a minimally qualified pilot getting a job.
Therefore, which is the best route to this??:

ATPL Theory Exams
Hrs building (in US)
CPL
FI Course

Would I be better off doing an IMC (or FAA I/R). Im not bothered when I do the I/R element (I suppose it would be better later as the costs will be offset) but would I struggle to keep an I/R current before I go to the airlines?
What about doing a Multi rating??

Any comments would be greatly asppreciated,

Many Thanks

Richie

[juswonnafly]

Ritchie......

Sounds good to me. You don't need the twin rating or I/R however the IMC can be useful when instructing incase the weather goes t*ts up while you are out with a student.

Are you aware that under JAA rules you can do ALL the training you need in the States?

Good luck

JWF

[Richie Coulson]

Justwannafly,

Thanks for the reply, I reckon Ill prob get an IMC.

Im also considering doing the whole lot out there, but Ive spoken to a club over here and they have said they usually give preference to people who have trained (CPL/FI Course) with them. Is this the norm and would I be 'shooting myself in the foot' by doing all my training stateside (at a no doubt cheaper cost though!)

Regards

Richie

[juswonnafly]

Ritchie....

Is this club offering you a well paid secure job with a contract? (I doubt it)

Flying clubs are users of people. If they have a need for you as an instructor they will give you a job regardless of where you have trained.

Best advice I can give is get it all done ready for the summer training season or you will miss the boat for a whole year.

Flying clubs have a greater need for instructors when the good weather and new students arrive.

Have a look at www.intlflight.com (http://www.intlflight.com)

Cheers

JWF :)

[Richie Coulson]

OK, Im convinced!!

Thanks again JWF

Rich

[Noggin]

One thing you have to remember if you take the ATPL exams is that they are only valid for 36 months for the issue of an IR. If you intend to wait, then you should consider taking the CPL exams then do the IR or ATPL exams later.

The JAA have recently change the 36 month rule to run from passing the last exam in preference to passing the first exam.

[TooHotToFly]

If you're only planning on instructing as a route to the airlines then I reckon this is your best route:

ATPL exams.

Hour building.

CPL course (combined with a Multi-rating is probably the best route).

FI course

Instruct for a while and eventually get a job at an approved IR training organisation.

Get your IR course done (they should give you the sim time for practically nothing except the instructor and the rest of the course at preferential rates).

If you're still instructing 3 years after sitting your ATPL's then you'll have been instructing longer than most so don't worry about the time limit for passing your IR. Just do the IR when you feel the time is right - too early and you'll have to keep renewing it, too late and you might miss out on an airline job.

Whether the IMC rating is worth doing is questionable. (Assuming you're now on the JAA system) it won't get you any hours off the approved course but for peace of mind or if you want to be able to teach the IMC rating it's worth doing.

Best of luck.

[Richie Coulson]

THTF

Cheers for that, sounds like useful advice to me.

I see the point about the CPL exams as opposed to the ATPLs but are these still in operation? (til June???) If so, how long are they valid or is it not a concern. Also who does them by distance learning or am I going to be going over old ground.

Regards

Richie

[DB6]

As Too Hot says but I wouldn't bother with the multi rating until you do the IR. You can't instruct on multis until you have a fair bit of P1 (I think 30 hrs but not sure) so you'll only be paying to keep it current. Most IR courses are done on multi engined engine anyway so I'd do it just before or during the IR (just before as you may end up paying IR training rates for a simple multi rating).

[AirScream]

Richie Coulson- You asked who is doing the JAA CPL exams by distance. Only one company at the moment 4-forces. However they are charging £2.5k when the ATPL course "only" costs £1900! despite 4 forces claiming that it is half as involved as the ATPL. If you were destined for an ATPL I think you would have to start all over again as there is no upgrade from JAA CPL to JAA ATPL writtens.

[rolling circle]

So only one company is offering JAA CPL exams by distance learning and are charging 25% more than the going rate for the ATPL exams.

Good old Frode may be many things but he certainly ain't nobody's fool. Which is more than can be said for those who pay for the CPL course - allegedly!

[mickypitch]

this is an interesting topic, I have been considering doing the cpl with four forces, but I have been advised by others that I might as well do the full ATPLs and be done with it.
I take it that the Cpl exams have no time limit, once you have got them thats it but the ATPLs are only valid for 36 months by which time you must have a valid IR rating? Is this correct?
What if you pass the ATPLs,pass the CPL flying test and then get an instructors rating and go no further? Will the lapsing of the ATPL exam affect your ability to be paid as an instructor.......
If it sounds like I am confused by all this it is because I am!!
Cheers

[mickypitch]

apologies if this post has come out twice as something wierd is going on with my computer...
This is an interesting thread, I am considering doing the cpl and have looked at four forces. I have also been advised that I might as well do the ATPL exams.
How I understand it is that the ATPL exams last for 36mths by which time you must have passed the IR.
So if I did the ATPL exams, passed the CPL flight test and instructors rating could I still continue instructing and get paid for it if the ATPL exams had lapsed after 36mths?
If this sound as if I am confused then it is because I am confused.
What I am trying to do is keep my options open and not opt for the CPL exams and then wish I had done the ATPLs if I decided to go further?
Cheers

[Blackshift]

Noggin,

Are you sure the 36 month rule applies to the IR as well as CPL qualifying time?

I have been told by the CAA that I have 5 years from my first ATPL passes (under the dissapearing CAA exam system) to obtain an IR, whereas the CPL(R) (having missed the boat for BCPL issue) must be obtained within 36 months of that time.

Hopefully I have not been misinformed, otherwise my plans for FI(R) training will have to be put on the back burner in order to crack on with IR/Twin training this year.

Tell me you're wrong for gawdssakes!

[AirScream]

Mickypitch, you are on the same wavelength as me at the moment. I hope that with the ATPL writtens passed and a CPL fg course complete you get a CPL to keep. If things are going well, ie lottery win etc if you get an IR within 36 months of the last ATPL pass, you get a frozen ATPL.

If CPL is where you set your sights it cannot be upgraded like the old system. Thanks Brussels!

If you fancy being paid as an instructor ATPL writtens seems to be the best option currently.
Don't forget the ATPL exam fee is £700 - cpl £450ish so thje gap closes slightly.

4-forces claim the CPL is half as involved, so why do they charge more. Probably because they are the only ones in the market for what will be a quicker course.