Thanx to all you "pilots"

[alapt]

Get a load of this gentlemen...
Have been offered a job with "Air Rum"
Qualified and current L-1011 driver for 2300 USD per month and 50 USD per day flown! Captains get abourt 3300 per month!
The reason being that lots of pilots from the "west" side of Europe are willing to work for almost nothing!
(I am not mentioning any specific country or airline...)
Take this job and s**v* it up your ****!
This is getting very depressing and the future does not look much brighter.
Got to feed the family, pay the rent, (Lost the mortgage from another closure) and drink beer!! Macdonald's here I come, at least I will get a free burger once in a while!!

[MOR]

Well, that is the market rate. What's your problem? Why do you think you are entitled to a high salary?

Those days are pretty much gone, unless you are senior in a larger company.

If you were really so desperate, you would take the job whilst looking for something else.

Welcome to reality. It isn't the fault of anybody, not even the UK pilots you allude to.

Just thought I would get in before 411A... :}

[Spearing Britney]

Uh-oh, duck and cover!

...and I reckon he meant East-side...

[MOR]

Well if he can't tell the difference between east and west... he may be in the wrong job!

[JJflyer]

I can assure y that this is not the market rate. I would strongly recommend not to accept BS conditions like that

JJ

[Airbubba]

Here's a site that gives U.S. pay rates in these depressed times:

http://www.airlinepilotpay.com/

The L-1011 is not exactly a front line plane anymore and there are thousands of other pilots on the streets so that doesn't help with the expat salaries in the case you mentioned.

Hope you find something soon.

[MOR]

JJflyer

Yes, it is the market rate. Why? They seem to have plenty of applicants who are more than happy to work for that much money... which is how you define the market rate in the first place! It isn't fixed by what some established airline pays - ask anybody who deals in ACMI leases.

[Immelmann]

@Alapt

see you are located in Europe. Why don´t you look for another type-rating (even if bonded) combined with better pay?

Some of my friends found still companies paying better combined with better type-rating. (EZY) It´s not all gold what is shining. But you have to try. Complaining is not very helpful.

I had to sell my house, moved quite far, comuted quite a while but finally got more money. Times are tough and you have to be damned flexibel.:ok:

[JJflyer]

So I must ask myself... Well I do... And thats not the going rate. If one is willing underbid and sell oneselves short, Pelase go ahead, I ain't doing that mistake.

Have a look at the payscales at the worlds largest ACMI speacialist... and you c again that this is not the going rate. If we are talking about some c.rap outfits like "rum" or NEA... well there you have it. Pay peanuts and get monkies.

[apaddyinuk]

Think Iv seen Air Rums L1011'S before....arent they the bright pink almost Courtline coloured ones that have been parked for donkeys in Amman Queen Alia Int???????
Not really surprised theyre paying so little but you never know....you could windup working in one of those nice little Iraqi Airways 707's parked beside it!!!! :}

[Ignition Override]

You folks have my sympathy.

For what it is worth, since about 1983, we have experienced this in the US, at many smaller freight and passenger carriers, whether operating recip, propjet and turbofan equipment.

At a small cargo carrier in Kansas City (MO or KS), about six years ago, the owner allowed European/British etc. copilots to fly along in the Twin Commanders, as long as THEY paid the owner about $20/hour, which a number were quite willing to do. Maybe they logged the time as PIC multi-engine?

My brother was a pilot there, and often flew solo all night long.

Unfortunately many other countries are just now learning why this has been such a huge problem here, since many beginning pilots (there) were making mud pies in Kindergarten/nursery school. It is very old news over here. Thousands of careers were destroyed by deregulation and the ruthless "robber barons" whose success was often greatly improved by strong prejudice in our govt's Executive Branch (was very anti-labor: labor was and is still considered by many to be an unwashed, unlettered, ragged peasant mob), or fast growth through greed and ignorance. :ouch:

Check "Splash of Colors", by John Nance. In a secret 'deal' (to avoid libel), his first edition was never released!!-he 'alleged' that certain events concerning AMR's "tinkering" with Braniff's computer reservations systems were not, eh, normal.:hmm:

[hirsute]

Just to get things out of perspective -

Where I am, a jet command (and I mean 737NG/757) gets US$900 per month!!

First Officer? US$600/month.

Where am I? A CIS '-stan.

[White Knight]

hirsute - it's all relative. Cost of living in the west is no doubt far higher than CIS'stan:\

[Jetset320]

I saw an Air Rum L1011 in Tripoli a couple of times where it seems to be based. It seems like it was in former BA or Caledonian colours, and hadn't had a lick of paint since the eighties.

I have never seen an aircraft looking worse for ware, not even in a desert visit to the Mojave where aircraft are in temporay storage!

This aircraft was in absolute shables on the exterior and I'd hate to think of what the inside looked like. She even had large areas (one foot by one foot) of paint missing.

I would definately not allow anyone of my family on that plane and company.

[opsmaneurope]

Alapt,
I cannot recall but did you ever get the DC10 on your licence? If so you might send me a PM.

[GlueBall]

From what's been said earlier about another deadbeat no-pay ACMI outfit StarAir, at least Air Rum, despite its clown livery, pays something, eh. :{

[bugg smasher]

I think a little perspective is required here.

The piloting profession is one that demands dedication, talent, and hard work, but there are no rules I know of in this dog-eat-dog existence that guarantee compensation in proportion to the required discipline.

To be absolutely fair, I have met more than a few experienced physicians who make considerably less than many green copilots. In comparing our trade with such a noble calling, where is the justice in this?

The money managers, with their phalanx of fatted accountants and canine lawyers, have secreted themselves into every aspect of our daily lives, no doubt with the self-righteous claim that nothing would work otherwise. There is some justification to that claim, but not to the wide-eyed extent they would have you believe.

This is the way of the world, ladies and gents, get smart or get poor.

[alapt]

Lets not start comparing Doctors, Lawyers and the rest of the educated masses. What we are talking about is US, and only US! (No not the USA guys!) If I had wanted to be a doctor, I would have attended med school, but no, I wanted challenges, freedom, thrills, travels, sharp uniforms (At the time!) F/A's, big airplanes, the deep voice and good money! All but one of these expectations have changed over the years, the good money part!
Never base your happiness on some one elses misfortune!
And by the way, if you go "eastward" enough you end up on the West side of Europe....get the drift!