We're Low Cost, But High Standard: Jetstar.

[lame]

Saturday, 8th May 2004.

We're low cost, but high standard: Jetstar

Airline ready for Coast take-off


The team behind new low-fare airline Jetstar , which will start flights from the Sunshine Coast on May 25 , yesterday assured Coast tourism representatives that low costs could still mean lofty standards.

Senior Jetstar management met with representatives from tourism groups, councils, resorts and tourist attractions to "knock misinformation about Jetstar on the head''.

Jetstar head of Commercial, Bruce Buchanan, said a common misconception that Jetstar had poor quality meals, seats and service was not true.

But the operation would have several major differences to other airlines.

For example, passenger check-in would close 30 minutes before departure so the aircraft could leave on time, which would minimise delay-related costs for the airline.

Passengers would not have an allocated seat on the plane but would board in the order they checked in.

Jetstar will run two flights a day from Sydney and one from Melbourne from May 25, and was considering direct flights to Cairns, Canberra and Adelaide.

Mr Buchanan said a change in travel patterns, such as flying for long weekends instead of longer holidays, or buying a holiday house far from home, was stimulating the market in places like the Coast.

"The demand has been amazing, our strongest markets have been some of the ones out of the Sunshine Coast,'' he said.

Jetstar will be holding a competition, with a trip to Sydney as a prize, at the Alex Skate Park from midday today to find the Coast's best star-jumper.

Cabin crew will also demonstrate seats from an Airbus A320 , to replace the Boeing 717s in July , and the menu selection.

[Capt Hollywood]

Passengers would not have an allocated seat on the plane but would board in the order they checked in.

Imagine the s**t fight that's going to cause! It's bad enough when pax argue with the check in staff about where they want to sit, let alone having them board the aircraft and then start arguing with each other. :ouch: :} I can see a bottleneck effect when the pax start running down the airbridges in order to get into the plane first and get 'their seat'.

Good luck to the cabin crews. :ok:

Hollywood :cool:

[Stick Pusher]

29 in pitch I hear??

Yeah High Std.

P.S nice one boys on the pay scales

[Capt Fathom]

when the pax start running down the airbridges in order to get into the plane first and get 'their seat'
That's exactly what they want the pax to do!

[lame]

And the pax probably will too. ;)

PSA in the US used to do this, we were flying from Seattle down to LA back in the 1980s, supposed to be on United, but they couldn't get into Seattle due weather, so we were transfered to PSA.

The pax DID literally run to get aboard.

Then before takeoff they handed everyone a cardboard box each, and that was your catering for the flight.

Sounds like Jetstar may be copying them. :rolleyes:

[Wizofoz]

lame,

Correct except you don't even get the cardboard box.

[lame]

That's a pity, the cardboard box, or rather its contents, were great. ;)

I really cannot see JetStar being very popular with the Australian public. :uhoh:

[captain_josh18]

The seats are 30 inch, not 29. Not that one inch is a total lot! hhaha

I think Jetstar will be more popular than virgin, and from what ive heard from people, family, friends, ppl i dont even know say they wont fly virgin again, however i havent flown virgin so i dont know the exact reason why they wont fly them again.

I also know of a few virgin staff who have moved across to Jetstar for various reasons, one i noted was it was an unprofessinal airline... ?? As i say i dont know! Never flown or worked with them.

I dont agree with you lame, when you say it wont be as popular with the australian public. I think JQ will boom over Virgin, and lets hope theres some good competition on the way.

Until then we can only wait and watch!!

GO JQ!!!!

[lame]

I am sad that you disagree with me. :(

It sounds like you may have some connection with JetStar, yes. ;)

I on the other hand, have no connection at all to Virgin Blue, Qantas or JetStar, and never have.

I personally do not like some of the things that happen at Virgin Blue, however I have heard mainly only good things about them, including from my "Other Half" of 35 years, who recently went down to Melbourne on Qantas and back on Virgin Blue. She has flown very extensively all over the World, and was very impressed with Virgin Blue, certainly more than Qantas.

I just honestly believe pax will not take kindly to JetStar, for a variety of reasons, including the leg room, catering and operating out of different Airports.

[captain_josh18]

hey lame!!!

not take offense!! haha! just in the spirit of conversation, dont take it personally!

you sound like a nice guy, just gave my though on things, hehe. Im sure virgin is a good company, just some things ive heard, as they say dont knock it till ya tried it :)

take care man!!

[Buster Hyman]

How long after the launch will it be, before the boarding announcement includes a request for "customers" to not throw their carry on into the seats?:rolleyes:

BTDT!:hmm:

[redsnail]

In Europe easyJet give you a number based on when you checked in. Mind you, there's only 2 check in desks open for your flight so that is easy to organise. Other check ins are used for other flights.
Check in now closes 40 minutes prior to departure for both Ryanair and easyJet.
After you pass through security you then go to the departure gate. Here you're called to board (ie wait in another queue) in order. First 30. Second 31-60 and then the remainder. At Luton (and many others, not Paris though) you then stand in your appropriate queue. Your number is checked, again, and when ok, you board the aircraft via the front or rear steps. The cluey folk go to the rear and head for the over wing emergency seats because there is more room.
If you want food or drink you have to buy it.
bmibaby is more similar to Virgin Blue. You get allocated seats. no inflight entertainment though.
For a real scrum you fly with Ryanair. No allocated seating and it doesn't matter when you check in. Good luck. There's no monthly in flight magazine, only a battered catalogue for drinks/food/"gifts".
In fact, they are talking about removing the seat pockets and putting the safety hand out on the back of the seat. Unlike easyJet, Ryanair fly from secondary airports (exceptions are London Stansted and Dublin). This can mean a lengthy train/bus/taxi journey to your intended destination. (This can be a trap for folks from Dunnunda.)

Average flight in Europe is 1-11/2 hours with the odd one being longer than 2 hours. The loco guys are hitting the full service short haul guys and the charter guys pretty hard. The hardest hit though is pilot conditions. Every one is now jumping on the pay for the rating schemes if you want a job.

[FBD]

redsnail - surely you meant the exception was London Gatwick? London Stansted is well and truly out in the sticks and a nice expensive train ride from Liverpool Street to get there- don't see no BA or BMI flying there. I also believe that Ryanair do give out boarding numbers to passengers at Stansted i.e. board the aircraft in 2 tranches??

In any event, all the talk about people rushing for seats on Jetstar..don't really see it happening if what I have observed with the budget airlines in the UK is anything to go by.

[asterix4816]

Redsnail, Ryanair do give out numbered boarding cards with those holding 1-65 being allowed to board first.

[redsnail]

Stansted isn't too bad if you're already north of London. ie near the M11. Gatwick would be better for those south of London. :D ie near the M23.

I haven't used Ryanair since I left my previous employer. I can't remember the seating details too clearly but I know it isn't as "organised" as easyJet's. I am certainly not knocking them at all.

I was just simply trying to make a comparison with what folks in Oz may be used to with what they are about to receive. If you're used to catching a VB or QF jet at Tullamarine, then going to Avalon is perhaps, a bit different. The folks in the UK are used to travelling from different airports such as Prestwick, instead of Glasgow. London Luton/Stansted/Gatwick instead of Heathrow. Blackpool instead of Liverpool or even Manchester. Sometimes, the secondary airports are more useful but if you're not expecting it or can't speak the language it can be a pain.
If you're used to a seat allocation then no seat allocation will take a little while to adjust. It's not impossible of course. So far, I haven't seen too much of a bun fight regarding the seats.

[lame]

As I said before, I think the Airports that JetStar are planning to use will put people off.

Imagine people who are used to Tullamarine, finding themselves out at Avalon. :sad:

I have also heard a "rumour" from several different people, that if you are travelling from say Brisbane to Melbourne with Qantas, under certain circumstances you may be bumped onto JetStar, IF this is true that would really put people off Qantas as well as JetStar. :sad:

[Watchdog]

Oh such rumours guys and gals!

I've flown virgin and thought they were fine - easy to book, courteous staff and what was really important to me on time departure and arrival! Seat pitch was OK and didnt buy food.

The Jet* in flight food, which you buy if you want - just like virgin, was fresh and tasty ( i was at a trial catering/boarding demo).
I sat in a 717 (converted to 125 pax seats) and had equal legroom to what I had in economy on QF 747-400.

The unallocated seating (but you get a sequence no. on check in) is copied from overseas operators such as JetBlue (USA) and as mentioned above, Easyjet. Jet* will invite first 50, then next 50 etc to board. It's a good motivator for pax to line up at the gate just like opening time at the footy!!

All this aside, the majoity will be drive by price of the ticket and schedule. The winner is..... the travelling public be it Jet*, QF or Virg!

:cool:

[proplever]

Reckon the title of the thread shoulda been:

Were LOW PAID and NO MORALS: Jetstar.

[Animalclub]

As I said in another thread...

Too many people are making much ado about nothing with free seating. It's been going on around the world from the 1970's as I know of. It encourages people to get on board quicker and you get the chance to sit next to a good looker.

There is still pre-boarding for the elderly and people with kids or any other handicap. Don't worry about it.

[captain_josh18]

"were low paid, no moral: jetstar"

what did we get a pay rise?? "were low paid" .......

???????? And you know that we hav no morals how? i dont even know you...




:D

CaptainJosh,

You may have smiled, you may have been joshing, but look in the mirror before you call some one a richard cranium! :uhoh: W

[EPIRB]

Lame, I think you'll find that passengers that use Avalon use it of their own volition. It's actually quicker to get to than Tulla from some of the western burbs of Melbourne.

[Cactus Jack]

Josh, I'm not that clever. But I just don't understand most of the things that you write. You actually write as you if you are talking very quickly. Like, maybe on speed perhaps?

[lame]

EPIRB,

I realise that, however all of Mrs Lame's relatives live in the Eastern Suburbs. ;)

As I indicated before, several Qantas frequent flyers that I know, have been warned by their travel agents that after JetStar begins these flights, they MAY get bumped on to those flights, under certain circumstances. :uhoh:

THAT would be a great inconvenience, if you are planning on arriving at Tulla and end up out at Avalon. :{

Best regards,

Lame.

[EPIRB]

Lame, I understand where you are coming from, however, a ticket is a legal contract and if they have sold you a ticket from say Brisbane to Melbourne, they have a legal obligation to fly you to Melbourne, weather etc. permitting, not to Avalon. If they want the truth they should contact Qantas as the travel agents weren't too happy with Jetstar, not sure if that's the case now. Personally I couldn't see them being bumped as there would be no apparent need to. I would think the only way that this was to happen was if Qantas was no longer operating to a port and Jetstar had taken over from them.

[captain_josh18]

cactus jack

whats so hard about understanding this:

the guys sed "were low paid, have no morals: Jetstar"

ill explain it simply...

were low paid ---> well if we 'were' low paid, what are we now? i mean, whats he implying? that we got a pay rise?

have no morals ----> and how does he know we have no morals? does he know any of us that are employed with JQ?

Cause i dont know him and i have morals...

It seems he is very confussed, and if thats so hard to understand... then maybe you are slow afterall. No offence dude!

lata

[lame]

EPIRB, maybe it is the travel agents, who don't like JetStar, but why would they be also putting people off Qantas by saying this?

The story was, that although these people may be booked on Qantas say from Brisbane to Melbourne, if say the Qantas Aircraft went U/S and there was no spare immediately available, they would be put on JetStar if they had a flight going.

This is no different to what happened for decades with Qantas and Ansett, they used to just sign the tickets over.

[amos2]

Where are you actually coming from Josh?...

I mean, you've got me fooled!

Do you want to try again, so that we at least have a chance to work out what you're on about? :ok:

[Southern handler]

and the transfer of pax from airline to airline still happens between QF and ZL, and to a lesser degree QF to DJ and to an even lesser extent DJ to QF.
and in tassie and I am sure elsewhere in some certain areas it is not unusual to transfer pax to other airlines be it for weather or broken planes

[Animalclub]

EPIRB
You're on thin ice when you say that a ticket is a legal contract. It is just a receipt for monies paid. It is not a guarantee to carry you anywhere, as Southern handler points out, due to any number of reasons.

However, if you are accepted for boarding a different set of rules come in to play (these vary from airline to airline) but it does not stop any airline from transfering you to another carrier to take you to any port so long as you are taken to your destination - even by bus... like Avalon to Tullamarine. Or they can refund monies paid.

[Cactus Jack]

Josh my boy?

Let me explain it you you. Proplever there, has a great deal of angst with Jetstar and he is famous for airing those views on Pprune. He is of the belief that the Jetstar guys and gals have intentionally accepted a pay deal that is substandard, and by so doing undermined all of us as professional pilots. Hence - low paid no morals.

Now, I'm not going to enter a debate about whether or not he is right - just wanted to set you straight about propy's mindset.

Now in future, Josh? Slow your typing down a little. Use correct spelling, grammar, and punctuation. That way old fella's like amos and I can understand you.

Have a good day, kiddo.

[Prop's ????]

EPIRB

a ticket is a legal contract and if they have sold you a ticket from say Brisbane to Melbourne, they have a legal obligation to fly you to Melbourne, weather etc. permitting, not to Avalon

Sorry to say this, but a lot of people have been bumped onto Jetstar after paying a full Qantas fare.

A couple I know are currently fighting this out with the big Q. Guess what, Qantas will not be covering that route after May 25, so its VB or drive.

The fact is the airfare is for passage from MEL to OOL and return, they will still provide this service but via a different name and location.

This is only one case, must be 1,000’s on the books. Keep up the good work Jet*.

[cunninglinguist]

It was mentioned much earlier in this thread that jet* would'nt be popular with the Oz public. Why not? same seat pitch, lack of food and lack of inflight entertainment as VB.

All they have to do is run on schedule ( on flights that are into headwinds ) and they will be in front of VB.
If you have ever had to meet people at PH airport that are travelling from SY, ML or BN , you will know what I mean.
I know that some VB drivers try to maintain schedule, but they are actually going against policy:*

[Southern handler]

In fact QF are still flying the MEL OOL and i'm pretty sure that with all the start up routes QF will be flying (apart from one or two), me thinks dont hold your breath for QF to stay on these routes long term.
those pax whose need to be transferred of the QF to JQ cant travel on the QF flight but if the flight does not suit they can go via SYD. I also know of pax who have had a refund paid for hte difference between the QF and JQ pricing

[ditzyboy]

Would just like to clear up a misconception. Filghts to or from AVV will not connect to other flights or be sold as a connection by QF or JQ. The only people flying into AVV will be those who CHOOSE to do so! Not sure about QF bumping BNE-MEL pax on a JQ flight to AVV. Firstly there is many other flights BNE-MEL and QF could route them via SYD also. I think it would be highly unlikely for QF to bump people onto JQ when there is only two BNE-AVV flights a day and they are already full by all accounts. Not to mention it is a different destination. You can markert an airfeild as whatever city you like (ie. Melbourne/Avalon or Ballina/Byron). At the end of the day AVV is a different destination to MEL.

The only flights into AVV are from SYD and BNE. ALL other JQ flights will depart from Tulla!

I have operated over 20 sectors on the re configed a/c with 125 seats. Like Watchdog said the legroom is similar to standards elsewhere. I felt it was the same as down the back on a QF 737. Out of the 2000 or so customers on the flights I have worked with the 125 config NOT ONE has complained. Not one customer has made any remark re. the seats. Other crew say the same. These a/c have the TWA Slimline seats though. Will be interesting to see if the use the older Impulse seats on the a/c that have them. They are really bulky and have a HUGE recline - won't be too popular with 30" pitch if that's the way they go.

I am sure JQ will go back on it's seating policy but who knows? Australians might love it. we just don't know yet. People sit wherever they want now anyway. As cabin crew it is very frustrating trying to explain to someone they can't just sit wherever.

Australians. They complain about checking in two hours before and being allocated the last row. Now they are complaining they can check in two hours before, board first and sit where they like!

[ditzyboy]

Props -
MEL-OOL flights ops into Tullamarine NOT AVV. Your friend is wrong.

Also QF (2 flights non stop) and JQ (four flights) ops together on the route until July 21. If it was after this date your friend must have booked REALLY FAR in advance - highly unlikely. Your friend would also have the chance to fly QF the whole way through via SYD (on flights after July 21). Especially if they paid full fare - highly unlikely.

Any person bumped onto a JQ flight, regardless of fare paid receives $20 refund. $20 could buy you two sandwiches, a chocolate bar and whatever drink. More than your friend would have recieved on QF. Having tested the JQ on board product it beats any cold QF meal hand down.

If your friend paid full fare on QF he could refund the ticket and buy a full fare on JQ for 40% less. He could use the $150 ($300 return) odd he saves to buy himself a clue. Or is a $300 saving not worth forgoeing the boxed refreshment (he would whinge about anyway), one inch legroom (yep a WHOLE inch) and surly FAs (for the most part - there is always lovely exceptions)?

Never let the facts get in the way of a good story, hey.

[Cactus Jack]

Never really been a problem for myself, however I am told that every inch counts.:ooh: :ooh: :ooh:

[ditzyboy]

CJ -
I wasn't going to go there! ;)

[Allan Partridge]

So how do you send your kid's away if they dont take UM'S????

:confused:

[Capt Claret]

Probably pay for an F/A to travel solely to supervise kids.

or

Send granny/gramps a ticket to come gett'em. :eek:

[ditzyboy]

Alan -
Put them on QF or DJ services.

In the US they charge for 'UM service' and it is more when a connection is involved. I am surprised JQ didn't explore the charging thing further.

Still if you have an 8 year old and a 10 year old doing one sector it wouldn't be a problem under normal circumstances. (The parent is there to meet them at the other end and there is no diversion enroute) The actual JQ policy is they don't carry children who need to be looked after. So if a parent decides their child/ren is OK to get on and off a plane themselves then so be it. Just hope and pray there is no diversion and granny is at the airport to meet them!

[TurbTool]

What's all this about accepted a lower pay deal than .....???

I understood that they insisted on it, in order to cut out all the wanabies. Good move too as it turns out.

I suggest that those who feel they have been hard done by sit back, relax and find out the facts before passing judgement on a group who have made it happen for them and their company.

Or maybe I missed the bit about .....???