VFR in Ireland

[tomcs]

Hi guys and gals,

I did a search but it didn't turf out anything useful. I am looking for any information with regards to VFR procedures and general flying in Ireland. I've had conflicting reports from various sources, some saying that a flightplan is required for every flight and some saying its exactly like the UK in many respects.

What is the ATC like?

Has anyone with experience got any tips?

Cheers

Tom

[dublinpilot]

:{ ewww...second time posting this as pprune wouldn't let me first time!!

Anyway...

Tom,

VFR in Ireland is pretty easy.

You will need a flight plan when comming into Ireland for the first time, and when leaving as you are crossing an FIR. You will also need one if you are crossing the FIR into Northern Ireland. Will will need one whenever any part of your flight goes through controlled airspace. Other than crossing an FIR, and for controlled airspace you won't need one (unless planning long over water trips!!).

All the controlled airspace you will encounter for VFR will be Class C. I think you need a transponder to enter controlled a/s here, but not 100% sure....it changed a year or two ago. I'll check it out for you, if it's an issue.

If flying over 3000ft, we use the semi-circular rule. Tracks 000-179 = odd flight level +500. Tracks 180-359=even flight levels +500.

No VFR at night.

R/t is pretty relaxed.

If flying to Dublin, then I'd suggest Weston, rather than Dublin Int. Dublin can be quiet expensive for non based a/c, or so I'm told!

Need any info, let me know.

dp

[IO540]

Will will need one whenever any part of your flight goes through controlled airspace

This I believe is also the case in the UK but in practice few people do it. The filing of the flight plan takes place implicitly when you call up the ATC unit and ask for transit.

Is that the same in Ireland, or does one really have to file the full ICAO written flight plan to enter CAS?

[PhilD]

For the internal flights can the flightplan be filed while airborne?

[dublinpilot]

The flight plan can be filed while airborne.

However having said that, I've never been refused a transit through Dublin a/s, and I always file a ICAO plan while on the ground. I've often heard of people who tried to file on the radio being refused, as ATC was too busy to take the details over the radio.

I'd suggest you you file a paper one.

edited to add. If you are departing a controlled airfield, they will not accept a f/p over the radio. It must be filed with AIS in Shannon at least 1 hour prior to departure. The new number is in the notams.

[TonyR]

We have some very grumpy ATC just like everywhere, but most very good

VFR is just the same as the UK, but you will need a flight plan & transponder for Class "C"

Let me know what type of aircraft and where you want to go and I will give you the info you require.

There are some really good private strips.

Tony

[FNG]

Although flying across the Irish Sea (with survival suit, raft, beacon, and Flipper's mobile number) is on my flying "to do" list, in the short term I might settle for RyanAir. Once safely returned to my ancestral homeland, is there anywhere north or south of the border (sorry, nearly said "imperialist prison-line of the captive counties") where I can I rent a taildragger (even better if aerobatic)? Any tips from DP or any of the other Irish ppruners gratefully received, and eventually repaid in a pint of plain.

[VP959]

Just a quick tip. If you intend to fly within Eire on an NPPL or PPL(M), then you will need to hold at least a Class 2 medical. The IAA has just released an AIC banning any form of aviation, including paramotors, foot launched microlights, microlights and light aircraft unless the pilot holds a Class 2 medical chit.

This effectively prevents any UK NPPL or PPL (M) holder from even crossing the border from the North, let alone flying over from the UK mainland.

[aiglon]

DP said:

It must be filed with AIS in Shannon at least 1 hour prior to departure

And in my experience, they actually make you wait the full 60 minutes :*

Had to postpone, then cancel a FP from Kerry to Haverfordwest a couple of years back because of a tech problem. Almost predictably, shortly after cancelling the FP, I managed to resolve the problem but then had to refile and wait..... :{

By the way, tomcs, flying in Ireland is very enjoyable and hassle free (once your FP is accepted).

Aiglon

[TonyR]

I have never had to wait an hour for a flight plan to be accepted, although I usually flie the night before anyway.

If you phone Shannon AIS on 00353 61471233, very often they will let you go in about 15 min, Unless you intend to transit Dublin, Cork or Shannon CTR or TMA.

You can file airborne quite legally at least 10 min before crossing the FIR.

If your really "bad" and your in a private airfield you can take off, call Dublin and ask them to open your flight plan, (the one you "should" have filed with Shannon), They will take your details.

I must tell you that I have NEVER done that myself but I know a few who have.

Also when crossing the Irish sea give D&D a call on 121.5 just to say hello, they will be glad to hear from you.

Have fun and stay safe

Tony

[dublinpilot]

Tony,

There is a new number for AIS (listed in the notams). It's 061-703750 (from UK +353-61-703750).


FNG

National Flight Centre in Weston (Dublin) have a Super Cub I believe. NFC (http://www.nfc.ie)

There are no a/c available for rent from Dublin Airport. (Other than clubs which require you to be a member, and still, they don't have tail draggers.)

Unfortunately I don't know much about the clubs on other fields. However you might be able to find out more at the forum on Flying in Ireland (http://www.flyinginireland.com/)

Hope that helps.

dp

[FNG]

Thanks Dublin Pilot, I shall visit the forum, and thanks also Tony for the PM.

[IO540]

dublinpilot

I am sorry to labour this point but it interests me because I want to go there again someday (been to Waterford a few times, VFR)

If you file an ICAO FP from A to B, and there is some CAS between the two (but not overlapping either of A or B) then the ATCU for the CAS will not get a copy of the FP. The FP will (by default) go to A, to B, and perhaps to the regional Flight Info service (London Info here in England). This is my understanding. I believe that if one is smart one can dig up the 8-character addresses for other places and get it addressed to additional units.

So I cannot see how the filing of a FP helps with Class C/D transit, unless the ATCU for that CAS is one of the addressees for the FP.

[FNG]

Blimey, NFC do have a Supercub, but they also have a Grumman Goose! That's the way to cross the Irish Sea in style. Engine failure? No problem, start rowing.

[dublinpilot]

IO,

I wouldn't be very famalier where my flight plan goes when I lodge it, so I'll bow to your knowledge on that one;)

Having said that all I can say is that in my experience I've never been refused a transit, and I allways lodge a flight plan in advance. Others have been refused who tried to lodge it while airborne. Maybe I'm just lucky.

In practice transits are not a big deal, as it's very easy to avoid controlled airspace here, with the exception of eastbound departures from Weston. Unless you need to fly closer than 10 miles to one of the regionals you can usually decend below controlled airspace without much hassle.

Most of Ireland is covered by Class G, so I wouldn't get too hung up on transits.

As for arrivals & departures from controlled fields, just don't bother trying to do it without lodging your flight plan 60 minutes in advance. You're only creating hassle for yourself and everyone else on frequency. You're unlikely to be allowed to depart. You might get someone nice, and be able to talk your way into an arrival claiming you'd already lodged it, but I wouldn't bank on it.

I know this doesn't answer your specific question, but it's as much as I can tell you.

So don't get hung up on transits. They aren't particularly important given all that Class G. But always file 60 minutes before take off for departures/arrivals to controlled files.


FNG,

The goose is severly underused! Rarely moves!

Let me know when you guys come over, and we might try meet up for a drink.


dp

ps. FNG.....what is FNG an acronym for?

[pbloore]

Hi All,

I've read all the comments with interest because we were planning to fly into Weston from the UK last Friday for the Bank holiday weekend. This was to meet some friends. WHen I checked the Notams I found that special airspace 25 Nm in diameter had been put in place for an EU summit (guess I should have read the papers!) so I phoned up Dublin ATC for some guidance. My original plan was to route through the Dublin zone straight to Weston, but after reading the Notam I wasn't sure of the best approach. I have to say that the Manager of the Dublin ATC was very helpful indeed and I'm most grateful for him spending so much of his valuable time with me. I've never flown outside of the UK yet so am a bit green at this.

Anyhow, due to awful weather we never even got off the ground, but I was interested to read a comment about eastbound departures from Weston, because the plan is to try the trip in a couple of weeks or so. Can anyone give me some advice?

[dublinpilot]

Pbloore,

I'm just running out of the office now, for a nice weekend down the country, so this will have to be short!

My point about eastbound departures form Weston, was that in general you'll have to go through Dublin airspace, and hence will need your flight plan.

As for the TRA, is will be there until 30-6-04. If you are comming after that, it won't be an issue.

The TRA goes up to 1700ft. If you are lucky you might get a clearance at 2000ft. You could also ask to be routed out at Kiliney, and follow the M50 motorway around the city, which is easy enough to find! (The TRA mainly covers the north of the city, not the south.)

Hope that helps!

dp

[david viewing]

Just to add that last year we forgot to file the FP one time for a departure from Galway and they made us wait the hour and then some, requiring phone calls from the tower to Shannon, before we could go, resulting in a fairly late arrival at an unlit field in UK. Nothing to do with the tower who were very helpful.

[FNG]

DP, FNG is an acronym which has, I think, a military origin, although I am just a fat civilian. It refers to someone new (that's the N, you can now guess the F and the G), and therefore is no longer very appropriate, as I have been spouting rubbish here since shortly after I obtained my PPL. The personal title for which I shelled out reflects this, albeit that it could be misinterpreted as a description of my domestic arrangements (Guy sends hugs, by the way). Perhaps I should "Re-brand" as FOG?

[holyflyer]

On the two trips I have made to Ireland I can honestly say that the welcome by ATC and Airfields was great.

Heading to Weston, I was given a routeing direct down the Liffey from the power station chimneys at 1000feet. Try doing that in London.

Last year heading for Kilkenny I had been listening into London Info as I routed to STU then SLANEY. It was non stop chatter. The transfer to a much quieter Shannon was bliss. A warm welcome to Ireland was given and when I asked to vary the flight plan so we could orbit the home town of a passenger, it was suggested I make a couple of orbits, take me time its a nice part of Ireland, and let them know when I am resuming.

If you haven't flown to Ireland, I recommend it.

Looking forward to visiting Kinair this year at Kilkenny, (a lovely airfield with great people running it) with a possible side trip to see friends near Carrickfinn. Looking forward to the "craic".

[pbloore]

Thanks for all the suggestions/advice.

We're a bit busy fro the next week or two, but will certainly make a point of flying into Weston if nowhere else.

Thanks

Paul :-)