Run! It's the Spotter Police

[FNG]

If you thought that Monocock's disagreeable experience at Popham was bad, just wait until you get your collar felt by the Official Spotter Police:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/3682329.stm

Imagine spotters armed with ID cards and licensed to commit jobsworthery. All they need now is for someone to give them hats. They've already got the clipboards.

I'm not really sure why spotters are referred to as "aviation enthusiasts", as in my, thankfully limited, experience of them, they are interested only in the letters/numbers and have zero interest in the machines themselves.

[Evo]

I'm not really sure why spotters are referred to as "aviation enthusiasts", as in my, thankfully limited, experience of them, they are interested only in the letters/numbers and have zero interest in the machines themselves.


I had a very odd experience with an "aviation enthusiast" at Goodwood on Sunday morning. He said that he had filmed my landing (thanks, mate - so watch out on You've Been Framed for the film of the idiot trying to land a taildragger) and asked what kind of Jodel it was. I explained that it wasn't a Jodel, it just looks a bit like one, at which point he gave me the sort of pitying smile usually reserved for the retarded and wandered off to talk to his mate. I guess they had a good chuckle at the pilot who didn't know what he was flying. Right...

[MikeJeff]

I know their is a tolerance of spotters in the GA community! I disagree however. How anyone can make a day out of sitting on the perimiter road at Shoreham airport, with a radio/flask and notebook is beyond me!

I pay £14 for the privelege of @rsing up my landings there, I should be allowed to do it in private!

[robin]

Strange they aren't asking pilots??

I'd be happy to rat on some of my fellows for a decent fee!!!!!

[Reichman]

I had a similar experience with a militant fundamentalist spotter many years ago.

I'd flown a JP Mk5 to an airshow at Brize Norton for a static display. I'm leaning agaist the railing with my student, answering the same questions of: "How fast does it go mister?" "How high will it go?" etc, etc. When some middle aged fat bloke in a combat jacket covered wit badges sidles up and leans on the opposite side of the fence. Alfter listening to a few of the kids' questions he gives me a knowing look and says, "Of course I remember these when they were camouflaged."
"Sorry mate," I reply, "your thinking of the Strikemaster. This is a Jet Provost Mk5"
"Yes son," he says, "they used to be called Strikemasters. The Jet Provost is what the RAF calls them."
"I think you'll find it's the other way round."
"No, I think you'll find I'm right."
I turn to my stude and ask him to bring the F700 over. He does, and I show it to the spotter.
"Look, it says here JET PROVOST T Mk5. Satisfied?"
He wasn't.
"They've obviously issued a new log book when it was converted."
I'm losing this one. "The Strikemaster is basically the same airframe but with a bigger engine and hard points on the wing." I say with an air of resignation.
"I think you'll find that this has got the attachment holes for the hard points." Says the spotter with an air of authority.
I turn to my stude, "Rich, let this gentleman over the fence and go and show him the underside of the wing." This he does whilst I entertain the now groing crowd that has formed to watch the argument unfold. Suddenly, from under the wing I here my normally placid stude shout, "Oh f*** off you annoying ****!"
The spotter hurries past me, climbs over the fence and disappears into the throng.
"What's up Rich?" I ask, Didn't that prove it to him?"
"Nah," he said, "The **** said we've painted over them."

Much laughter from the crowd.

Reichman

[Monocock]

I don't believe it.......(said in a Victor Meldrew voice).

What's going on? These guys are actually being given the ear of an anti-terrorism group?

It'll be a matter of days before the poor bloke on the receiving end of their calls jumps from the nearest tall building.

Evo and Reichman's experiences of these "Malcolms" only go to prove that these people could not be further from being considered "responsible". Yeah, they might know whether or not an important bolt has come loose on the wing of a passing jet through their super-zoom bino's, but human behaviour????

They all live with their Mum's. What do they know about human behaviour? They all eat cucumber sanwiches and drink Ribena diluted at no more than 5 parts concentrate and 23 parts water from their Star Wars flasks.

I mean honestly. They're "aviation enthusiasts". All it'll take is a poor innocent bloke of Asian origin to decide to go for a jog around the Heathrow perimeter fence one morning and all hell will break loose when they spot him throught their bino's.





:ugh:

[FNG]

Cucumber? Naaah: Shippam's Fish Paste on Mother's Pride, I think you'll find.

You're right though: how long before they try a "Spotter's Arrest" on one of the many Sikh employees of the Airport? (as a colleague of mine who is a Sikh has found out, assorted dickheads, and even real policemen, classify him on sight as a beardy rag-head terrorist).

[Evo]

OK, the other thing about spotters - why do they pick the most awkward places to stand and spot?

At Goodwood you can get yourself a cuppa and sit outside the clubhouse. It's a great place to be on a sunny day, and unless they're using 24 you will get just about the best view of the aerodome. But do you go there if you're spotting? No. You either hide behind the main hangar or, more often it seems, park in a lay-by outside the perimeter fence and stand on a box to try and see over the bl**dy great earth banks around the racing circuit. If that wasn't bad enough, your location also seems to be carefully planned to put you as far away from the active runway as possible. If you're lucky you'll see the occasional glimpse of someone hot'n'high and en-route to a go-around, but you'll miss most of the aeroplanes using the place. Why?

I guess it's one of the strange hobbies like model railways and pigeon fancying that i'll never understand. They all probably think the same about us. Pay 100 quid an hour to do what ?!? :)

[englishal]

Oh for forks sake, what will they think of next?

Jeeze, I got a bollocking from a "silly old fart" the other day for riding my bike too close to him. As I rode past he started giving me abuse so I stopped and I did point out that he was walking down the middle of what is classed as a road, and that he watched me come around the corner and when he saw me he started walking slap bang in the middle. Nope, he wasn't having it, I was wrong, blah blah blah. I must admit I was very restrained, until I couldn't handle it any more and called him a "silly old fart" (the C word did spring to mind) and rode off....

Anyway, I digress....my point being that this would be the sort of interested party who would willingly sign up to police the airports and ensure the homeland security of Britian.....

[MichaelJP59]

Not sure if I can offer any insight into the spotter's world, but I have been guilty of occasionally parking at the approach of MAN's 24R runway and watching the jets' approaches, especially on gusty crosswind days.

I've also been to the occasional airshow!

Does that make me an aviation enthusiast?

- Michael
PPL Student
(checks for flask and sandwich contents nervously...)

[Evo]

my point being that this would be the sort of interested party who would willingly sign up to police the airports and ensure the homeland security of Britian.....


At the risk of departing from spotter-abuse, that sounds like the fine chap who was photographed flying his aeroplane up and down the seafront at Portsmouth looking for terrorists, drug runners and drowning nuns. Or whatever it was that he claimed to be looking for. I wonder what happened about all that? The aeroplane in question is still sat on the ground at an aerodrome not far away, so I guess he isn't flying it...

[paulc]

Evo,

not all spotters / enthusiasts have no interest in the aircraft they observe/photograph. Some are even pilots as well or work in aviation.

yes you do get the odd ecentric idiot but you can say that about any interest or hobby

[Evo]

PaulC - I didn't say that. For some reason I just decided to quote it.

My views on spotters are limited to occasional irritation when the "odd eccentric idiot" decides to argue with me about what type of aeroplane i'm flying, and bafflement when I see someone that way inclined making things so difficult for himself. Apart from that I see it as one of a number of harmless, if eccentric, English pastimes*, and I have no doubt that most of them know far more about the aeroplanes that they observe than I do - with the exception of types I've flown, it isn't difficult :)

*unlike pigeon fancying, which seems like a good way to get a nasty disease or three.

(edit: I just pasted the above into Word to check my spelling :O and the annoying paperclip told me off for using gender-specific terms. Are there female spotters out there? AerBabe? :suspect: )

[FNG]

It was me that said it, and I based my observation on a visit, by air, to the North Weald Aerofair (big Spotter gathering) and to conversations with spotters eager to obtain the civilian registrations of aircraft I've flown which have military paintjobs.

I still think that we should have stuck to the "You keep the spotters, we'll keep the Elgin Marbles" deal a year or two back.

Edit: the annoying paperclip chappie is a born spotter. Why not replace him with Earl the Cat?

[eharding]

A few minutes Googling came up with this....

http://www.laasdata.com/taess.html

Top notch stuff:

" - Are there ‘strange’ individuals viewing that are not Enthusiasts? "

(Should stick out like a sore thumb then)

" - Is there someone watching movements of people and vehicles?"

(Yeees....isn't that the point?)

"- The Police encourage everyone, but particularly those who know the workings of an airport and can therefore spot something out of the ordinary, to contact them if they believe something they see or hear is suspicious. "

(i.e. the Old Bill have had a hard time recently stopping armed robbers whooping it up airside at LHR, and could do with a bloke with a clipboard to spot the villains for them)

" - Never touch an aircraft, no smoking and keep a look out AT ALL TIMES. "

(No Colin - never touch *anything* - it'll send you blind)

" - Remember that PROPELLERS can KILL!"

(Yes, from a range of at least 4 miles - best stay well clear)

[Monocock]

Michael JP59

Don't fret old chap. I think we're all guilty of watching them skew it in on a blustery day once in our lives. I was once passing through Hatton Cross with a mate when there was a 50 kt Northerly. We did stop and watch a few go over. Great stuff.

I would like to add that my shirt was not tucked into my pants. I did not have a beard with bits of old food entwined within, I don't even own a pair of binoculars and the last time I used a clipboard it was 20 years ago when I did a school project about the colour of cars passing the school gate. We didn't take sarnies and we didn't take flasks.

:8

[FNG]

eharding,
Hoot! Roar! Howl! Blow coffee through nose! Too wonderful for words: the look on the face of Inspector Plod in the photo says it all.

[Dop]

If someone does turn up with a Stinger missile you'll get all the spotters going:
"Is that the mark 2 or the mark 3?"
"It's the mark 2, I think you'll find the mark three has a different gizmo flange on the doohicky. Oh look, there's the serial number!"
and spilling their flasks of weak lemon drink.

Edit: I just looked at that website eharding posted, and wished I hadn't.. They can't even spell 'Enthusiast' on their website, for crying out loud. Check out the menu banner at the top, where it says:-
"Enthusisats Security Scheme"

[Mike Cross]

At the risk of departing from spotter-abuse, that sounds like the fine chap who was photographed flying his aeroplane up and down the seafront at Portsmouth looking for terrorists, drug runners and drowning nuns. Or whatever it was that he claimed to be looking for. I wonder what happened about all that? The aeroplane in question is still sat on the ground at an aerodrome not far away, so I guess he isn't flying it...
On a point of information:- He was fined 1500 quid with 500 costs I believe at Portsmouth Magistrates Court last month.

Strangely the EB seem to have no interest in letting anyone know the result so only the culprit learns from his mistake.

Mike

[eharding]

I didn't actually scroll down to see the photo until I'd posted the message above. Magnificent.

Notice how spotter mate has his binos at the ready.

Ed.

[Irv]

Are these cards going to be multi-lingual? I'd suggest Greek would be useful as it might cut court translation costs :rolleyes:

Evo- Spotters with video cameras near thresholds are excellent turbulence indicators - on any approach to 08 at Compton Abbas with the wind from the SE, examine the sidelines for cameras. If there are any, expect massive shear and turbulence in the last 50 feet - they don't waste time filming on calm days! :D

[BEagle]

Well, I think that it's a pretty harmless hobby. Apart from in Greece, North Korea - and probably the USA these days.

It gets them out into the fresh air - OK, air and kerosene - and if that's their bag, baby, then why not let them just get on with it. One takes the mickey of those with camo'd tabards, little aluminium stepladders and all the kit at airshows, but hey, it's better than being some saddo who spends too much time on the Internet with 5006 posts on an aviation website......ahh, bug ger! ;)

[bar shaker]

I'm sure that copper is saying "f*** off you annoying ****!" from the corner of his mouth :p

[Evo]

"I told you it was a f**cking Jodel" :p

[mad_jock]

Spotters can be a danger to air safety.

I was at the end of a IR training trip and just on approach at LBA.

Next to the airport there is a hill which I think is a grade 1 spotter camp, there was even a burger van from what i can remember.

Just as I turn finals at about 3 miles a really fat bloke over balances and starts to tumble down the hill towards the gourse bushes at the bottom. Then precedes to thrash about at the bottom when he stopped. I nearly forgot to flare!!!!.

And some of the chaps you saw in the spotter shop near LBA needed there names taken for the Uncle Fester list.

MJ

[locksmith]

I have taken my aircraft to the PFA rally for about the last 5 years,

Last year this big "spotter" came over and said. Its a long time since this a/c has been here.

I said yes I have never been here but I have been to Cranfield for the last 4 years.

"No you have not, this aircraft was not at Cranfield since 1994"

I said I was here last year and the 3 or 4 previous years.

"You must be mistaken" the spotter said.

"It is my F...ING aircraft and I should know"

The bas...d upset me so much I almost hit him

And I am not normally easy upset.

What is it about them??

Ken

[MikeeB]

He said that he had filmed my landing


Did he have a notice up saying he was filming, and appropriate contact details to comply with the Data Protection Act? ;)

Something like that anyway......

[vintage ATCO]

Hey, lay off spotters, I were one once . . . . . :O

But I have turned out to be normal (I think := ) and an enthusiast.

It must be a dying hobby though, you don't see any kids doing it (as I was). Did once see a female spotter at a PFA Rally at Cranfield but I think it turned out to be someone's Mum. ;)


VA

[Aussie Andy]

I'm loving this thread - especially locksmith and mad_jock's contributions above! :ok: The image of the fat-bloke losing it down the hill will stay with me..!

On a point of order: I were one once . . . . . Well, no shame in it depending on what was going on in your heard at the time I guess... If what was motivating you was the chance to marvel at the miracle of flight, the ingenuity of man, the grace and beauty of the aircraft, and the skill of the Sky Gods piloting the aircraft, then I think it is OK. When I was a young boy - pre-teen aged - I am not ashamed to admit clinging to the cyclone fencing surrounding Sydney's Kingsford Smith airport to do these things. And later, as an avionics engineer in the service, I am not ashamed to admit enjoying the spectacle of rehearsals for airshows at RAAF Richmond and elsewhere: not to mention recent enjoyment of Farnborough airshows in this country especially! So I imagine these early experiences may have merely been a sign of your keenness in regard to aviation, motivating you to take up an aviation-linked career.

If, on the other hand, what was in your head was the prospect of having more "knowledge" of serial numbers than the other blokes, enabling you to engage in the kind of mind-w*nk involved in having made-up a bigger list of numbers than the others and to engage in BS conversations about things you don't really know, then I would feel differently and pray for your speedy recovery :}

Still, each to his own...

Andy :ok:

[PPRuNe Towers]

Favourite quote:

'So why not bird spotting then?'

Resigned talking to imbecile voice, 'Well, they don't have numbers do they.'

Rob

PS - I was, Danny was but only until we could do it for real.

[Man-on-the-fence]

Vintage ATCO saidBut I have turned out to be normal

yeah right!! :E

You guys are missing the point. Yep there are some really stange miss-breeds amongst them and its usually these who will argue that black is white. However they are spotters, they observe things, the see the most minute of changes (and not just to the aircraft). Nearly all of them are very patriotic and they want to help.

What this has done is provide a vehicle for a few thousand willing eyes and ears around the airports of all sizes in the UK. No problem with that.

Its the ones who take themselves seriously that you have to watch out forhttp://www.stopstart.freeserve.co.uk/smilie/spotter.gif

(I was one but I can take a photo better than I can write :8 )

[Monocock]

Man-On-The_Fence

(I was one but I can take a photo better than I can write )

Are you the bloke who takes all the pics of a/c and sells them to the CAA for the G-INFO website?

If so, thanks for posting between your sauna and your poolside lunch in your Mediterranean retreat....!!!:cool:

[Man-on-the-fence]

Monocock

None of mine are on G-INFO and in any case do you really think the CAA would PAY for them!!! :}

[AerBabe]

Are there female spotters out there? AerBabe? Hey... why are you asking me? :8
Somewhere, I have a great photo I took at the PFA rally a couple of years ago. There is a gaggle of spotters, all with their pac-a-macs on, clutching clipboards with pencils attached on string and all looking in different directions. I'll post it if I can find it!

[Reichman]

Took my little biplane to the PFA rally at Wroughton many moons ago. Fantastic weather all weekend so me and my mate kipped under the wings in our sleeping bags. Woken up at 4am by a bunch of spotters walking around the parked aircraft collecting regs. One says to the other, "Look there's something under this one."
To which I reply, "Yes and it's trying to sleep so p*** off."

Reichman

[LowNSlow]

I remember seeing a program about Davis-Monthan Air Base (the USAF aeroplane graveyard) once. There were a bunch of Brit spotters with their wives on the bus tour. Most of the spotters never looked out of the windows, they were far too busy writing down the tail numbers as their wives read them out. Mind boggling................. :hmm: :hmm:

[locksmith]

I've got it.

The Pfa EC must be full of spotters.

Thats why they can't agree, and try to tell me they know best

Ken

[BRL]

Ace thread this :ok:

Makes me slightly confused though about my identity at the moment. You see, I love watching planes(aircraft/aeroplanes/*delete as necessary.) anything that flies really, have spent a lot of time watching a few seriously spectacular crosswind landings when going past Gatwick and also a few at Shoreham when I am there. Also worth noting is my habbit of looking up whenever anything flies over be it a helicopter, plane or whatever, can't help myself really, it's just natural isn't it. Anyway, point being, I don't collect numbers so that makes me alright, doesn't it? :confused: Nothing wrong with just looking is there...:uhoh:

[AerBabe]

Here's a particularly mean way of dealing with spotters... If the grass has recently been mown, turn the aircraft round and do your power checks right in front of them. :oh:

[TonyR]

Sometimes I wonder what the Government will do next. This is one hell of a country to live in, plane spotters as policemen.

Most of us as kids spent time looking over the fence at an airfield, I did and I managed to get a flight in a glider tug and in a glider when I was 8.

Most of us then became obsessed with learning to fly.

I had one (a spotter) here a couple of years ago, he was spending time touring Ireland's farm strips.

I offered him a flight, but he said "sorry I don't like flying"

Strange or what?

Tony

[Unwell_Raptor]

It's easy to take the pi55 but if you have a regular group of unpaid people hanging around your airport, why not utilise their local knowledge?

I know how many police officers are on duty at LHR on a normal day, and I am not going to post it here for obvious reasons. More pairs of eyes can only help. Terrorism makes us all auxiliary security people doesn't it?

And what's wrong with spotters anyway? I was a London Airport spotter from the age of about 11 to about 13. I learnt a lot, and I developed a lifelong interest in aviation.

What's wrong with that?

[pilotwolf]

Well I could never be classed as a spotter as I can just about tell a 747 from the others but not much else... Also could record numbers as being a helo pilot I struggle with letters and numbers! :)

BUT, I have to say it is nice to be able to sit alongside the threshold and watch them take off and land, especially when its a bit windy!

Or take a drive around the perimeter track at LGW and watch the spotters struggle to see over the fence!

And get PAID for it! Hey thats the wnd perk Ive found working for the NHS in the last few days... :\

Also this sounds rather like the new inititive at LGW to encourage airport workers to be more observant to suspicious things...

PW

[Man-on-the-fence]

AerBabe

That is the spotter equivalent of the female cat shoving her bum in the male cats face to get his attention

They'll stalk you for it :}

[ShyTorque]

I was manning a static green heli at a military open day in about 1979.

A spotter came up, notebook in hand and asked in a loud voice: "Ah - is this the aircraft that was on exercise ****** in Germany in February 1974?"

"I don't know" I replied, "It might be".

"But surely you know the history of your aircraft!" came the belittling reply.

"Look mate, there are 15 more on the squadron. If you think I've got the past history of all of them from the last 7 or 8 years in my head, then think again!"

"But why not? It's very important" he retorted.

I replied "Look. I just fly them and to be honest I've got better things to think about".

He stormed off, most disgruntled, tucking his shirt in his underpants. :\

[BEagle]

On one of our Vulcans (can't remember which one - possibly XH538?) there was a prominent dayglo stripe around the defunct AAR probe. It was a legacy of some bombing competition, positioned to be co-incident with the SFOM sight solution and used as a last resort visual bombsight.

Up came an airshow spotter - "What is the significance of the day glo marking on the probe?"

Crew chief looked him up and down and merely replied "Lipstick. But you probably won't understand that!"


First time I ever did a static with the VC10K, first question asked by first spotter - "I collect aircraft safety instruction leaflets. Can I have one of yours?" :rolleyes:

The beggars will poke their cameras through any available window to get some inside information if the aerodrome is open to the genpub at a Battle of Britain At Home Day. But I once heard tell that a bunch of groundies concocted a spoof 'Modification Schedule' board with lots of a/c details, dates etc for a mythical Sidewinder mod programme for the Hunter. They then carefully positioned it in an office which would be an obvious spotter magnet and listened with glee to the excited jabberings going on outside!

[TonyR]

Look here (http://www.planespotting.com/)

Lets try to understand them!!

[BRL]

Link doesn't work for me........

[Fly Stimulator]

Try this version. (http://www.planespotting.com)

As it says, "Plane spotting is a strange hobby..."

[bar shaker]

I took my daughter up to Cromer in September last year. She is 14 and very "with it" like most of her age.

It was quite busy but there were only a few aircraft there. She was strutting around for ages wearing her flying suit and the sun was burning down, so I suggested she take it off.

She said "Well I kept it on for a while so that people didn't think I was a spotter's kid, but we've been here a while so I guess I could take it off now". :uhoh:

I shudder to think what her future holds for me.

I must confess though. I did go and "spot" the three Concordes come into LHR on that sad day. I was surrounded by professional spotters and it was quite some experience to watch them. Between a group of four that were close to me, they had all the frequencies on scanner and worked like a military operation. As one said something about a particular Concorde, another spouted a fact about that specific one. All most strange.

Shortly afterwards I got totally w**kered with BRL :}

[Fly Stimulator]

The last flight of the Concordes was a special case and a nationwide special exemption from accusations of spotterism was in force.

Practically everybody in the building I work in, most of whom otherwise had no known interest in aircraft, was lined up on the pavement or had made their way onto the (strictly out of bounds) roof to watch the three of them go past into Heathrow that day. :{

[Monocock]

A thumbs up from "The Lads" ....:ok:
http://nuespotter.free.fr/spaw/group/spaw02.jpg

And this girl got so pissed off with her man spending all his money on a new step-ladder and not enough on her ............
http://nuespotter.free.fr/spaw/group/spaw10.jpg
.....that she whipped it away just at the gravy click:}

[TonyR]

try doing that in Greece

[Boing_737]

Confess to being a spotter in my teens........Best place ever, the main road than runs round Lakenheath. You can park at the end of the runway (practically) and watch the jets taking off and landing. Nothing like watch an F-111 take off with afterburner with the heat haze and such. If you timed it towards the end of the day when they were recovering the F-111s used to do lots of rollers and you were parked up right under the final if the wind was right - it was great. The Shermans used to send a Hummer round with a big camera on it to see who was spying on them:rolleyes:

Anyway, past that now. Still can't understand why anyone would want to watch PA28s and such - sometimes theres the odd interesting plane, but on the whole, just PA28s, C172s etc....

[Wycombe]

The anorak-wearing, know-it-all, number-crunching gimps who use dentists mirrors to see through gaps in hangar doors (I kid you not!) are well worthy of ridicule IMHO, but the spotting fraternity pervades the UK aviation industry at all-levels.

One of the UK spotting bulletin boards (membership by invitation only!) has many airline and aviation industry Management and Ops staff, Air Traffickers, and even pilots :D amongst it's membership.

It's run by a guy who works for BA, who puts a lot of his personal time into it (bit like Danny and Pprune).

Less likely to be the sort of people who would be so open to such ridicule .... not a stereotypical anorak or stepladder in sight.

More likely to be the sort of people (ie, lots of them also work in and around Airports) that this initiative is aimed at.

[Fly Stimulator]

Just noticed something truly alarming on that planespotting.com site. Part of their mission is to "Connect plane spotters with each other."

Does this means they breed? :ooh: :uhoh: :yuk:

[TonyR]

I've just emailed them an invitation to view this thread.

I suggested that they might like to defend their "sport"

[Fly Stimulator]

TonyR

No need to go very far afield - there's a whole forum for spotters here (http://www.pprune.org/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=52) on PPRuNe already.

[TonyR]

My dear wife has suggested that "spotting" might be a more healthier pastime than sitting in front of the PC spouting off with the rest of you bad sastards.

It might be time for a change. (the wife I mean)

[paulo]

Hmmm... I think I must join a few others in defending spotters. My revelation was the pointy nose bird. I followed like a true notepad & binos supporter in the last month.

They are wide and varied bunch. There's anoraks, there's people that still live with their mum, there's allsorts really. People that work the ramp, right through to ex pilots. And hey, as PPLs we're not exactly a uniform makup either. This forum's members are liquorice allsorts. But no liquorice consistency either. :p

In the end I've stayed in touch with the bunch I met. They are genuinely passionate about aviation. In the last six months I've seen about 30 grand raised to help preserve a couple of aircraft, from a bunch of 50 or so spotters. I've so far chucked a few hundred of philanthropic cash at stuff I'd never have dreamed about from reading dry articles in pilot or whatever.

In short, they love aeroplanes. I can't argue too much with that. :ok:

[Monocock]

Ooerr,I can see this getting out of hand.

:uhoh:

[paulo]

[And in proper response to the original post... the use of "familiar locals" for potential threat reporting was identified a good a year or so ago in US airport management texts. Has the same imperfections as neighbourhood watch, but doesn't mean it's fundamentally flawed]

[TonyR]

Perhaps it's the school boy in us all, but it is funny how when it comes to us giving the "spotters" a bit of a doing, thread, we have 4 times as many posts as, the thread about the person who is learning to land.

[SATCO Biggin]

Yep, I used to be a spotter as well in my younger years. At least I didnt walk the streets vandalising phone boxes or graffittiing walls.

Any one who has an interest in aviation needs to be encouraged if we are to combat the growing tide of Nimby-ism in this country. I do, however, consider it a past time for the younger generation who may well convert their hobby into a future occupation.

Few go on to become psuedo professional spotters supplying photos and data to magazines for financial reward, and I do generally have a personal problem with the 'older' spotter types who should be doing something more productive with their lives.

What is apparent is that the internet has provided them with a communication network that makes them aware of potential planned aircraft movements before they occur. I can see the logic in the recent moves to 'enlist' them in airport security measures, but would caution that most are not suitable for such a task. A selection process needs to be defined to weed out the sort of geeks that other forumites have experienced.

Encourage aviation enthusiasm in the younger generation....yes, weed out the saddo's whose only point in life is to 'out spot' other spotters....yes, select the balanced few to report the comings and goings they observe....yes, blanket all spotters as part time security watchdogs...no way.

[bar shaker]

I'm pretty certain that there is a "spectator" in all of us. If I haven't got a trip on, one of my favourite ways to spend a warm Sunday morning is to fly to somewhere local, like North Weald, and sit on the terrace with a bacon sarnie and a big mug of coffee, watching the comings and goings.

I also love going to the big airshows as nothing can ever beat a Tornado with the burners on, passing at almost a mach, 200ft away from you.

But I would be sneered at by a spotter. No binos or telescope, no spiral bound pad, no scanner, pockets that are not full of pencils in a Harry Hill style? "You've been that close to the aircraft and you haven't made any notes??"

I suspect that this plan is one that that the spotters have negotiated to increase the status of shirts-in-pants-man everywhere, rather than something that the Police/inteligence agencies have sort to put into place. My main concern is that the more argumentative ones will now be walking around looking like Harry Hill, but acting like Harry Callahan, and will think that they have the 'right' to question us on where we have been etc.

[MichaelJP59]

Quite a few people "coming out" then and admitting a bit of spotting, nothing wrong with it once in a while:)

I think the types we have least understanding of are the spotters who are there just to collect reg numbers and track movements, and have no particular interest in the flying part of it. These guys could just have easily been train or bus spotters. Still, I have no complaints - each to their own!

The hardest-core must be the "space" spotters, who go to Florida to watch rocket and space-shuttle launches. This lot can stand about in a Florida swamp for weeks as the launch is delayed or cancelled!

- Michael

[IO540]

The types I have the least understanding of are those who collect aircraft and movement details and enter them into the various spotter websites, occassionally accompanied by the personal details of the owner obtained from G-INFO.

[bar shaker]

"Can I have your registration please?"

"F.. O.. Y.. A.. C.."

:p

[Genghis the Engineer]

There is a new version that I've come across recently.

Apparently when new PFA or BMAA homebuilt projects are registered, and their details appear on G-INFO, some spotters are phoning the registered owner demanding the right to go and see the just started project (=pile of bits of metal) in their garage. The purpose is the kudos of being the first spotter in the whole world to see this particular aeroplane.

The fact that it isn't actually an aeroplane yet, and may not be for some time (or, in some cases, ever), is apparently lost on them!

G

[FNG]

I've just popped in to the Spotter's Forum (using a forged ID and out of date copy of the reggie book), and extended to them a friendly invitation to come and play with us.

http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=1324795#post1324795

[Man-on-the-fence]

And you lot wonder why some people think pilots are arseholes:rolleyes:
I totally agree that the more extreme elements deserve to be treated with contempt (and if what Genghis says is true reported for stalking)

However have any of you actually stopped to think that this may help. Not all spotters are extreme wierdos not all pilots are arseholes, its the large number of people in the middle of the extremes that this will be aimed at.

If any nutcase abuses it then he really deserves all he gets.

[Windy Militant]

Genhgis,
This is not a new phenomenon about ten years or so ago a fellow PFAer made the mistake of registering his home built as soon as he started the build. As stated the details appeared on the new rego list and as he explained to us at a strut night he was raided by a bunch of fanatics from a midlands spotter club.
These numpties walked across a field and clambered over his garden fence, in so doing trampling over his wifes precious flower beds destroying a number of cherished plants. They then repeated this procedure outside his shed and his garage whilst trying to find the Aircraft. At this point his wife arrived home saw the damage threw a complete wobbler and set the dog on these idiots.

What pissed my mate off was the fact that he'd had enough of a struggle convincing the missus to let him build the thing in the first place, after this little escapade domestic relations were on a par to the cold war during the Cuban missile crisis.
And as he said if they'd have rung up and asked he'd have shown them the pile of wing ribs as his friends and family were all sick to the back teeth of him going on about the thing and he was looking for people to share in the dream! ;)

[mad_jock]

What gets me is that fact that people presume that just because your a pilot you should be able to tell every type of aircraft in circulation. And ATC are the worst for this.

"After the 767 taxi A1" and there is a line of 757 767 and airbuses all coming towards where your holding. And the tone of voice when you ask "err is that the one with the blue tail" "negative its a A330".

I don't have a bloody clue spotting between the different types unless I have flown them. You get big ones, little ones, 2 engines and 4 engines, high wing, low wing and biz jets and light aircraft. All other references should be company based or colour based.

I don't really have a problem with people watching hairy landings. But learning all the tech crap and taking numbers when they don't even fly them!!!!

MJ

[Kolibear]

Having once been a twitcher, the bird-watching equivalent of a plane spotter , I'm not sure that I dare contribute to this thread with inviting ridicule.

I wonder how the spotter I once saw desperately trying to prise open the doors of a locker hangar would react if he found someone doing exactly the same to his garage?

On a lighter note - last year, our group aircraft was the subject of a flight test in a national magazine and alongside the article was an advert for the same type of aircraft. Unfortunately, the printer had mirrored the registration while keeping the aircraft picture correct. A week later at Aerofair, all day, we had Reggie S. Potter & his mates coming up & saying 'ere mate, where's the blue one with the reg back to front?' They didn't seem to want to believe it was a printing error.

And then there were the two transvestites. It was the telescope that gave it away I think., it clashed with the handbag.

[PPRuNe Towers]

A long day working on the site but bar shaker 'made my day':

walking around looking like Harry Hill, but acting like Harry Callahan

'This is a .357 Steepletone Airband - the most powerful radio under 11 quid at Tandy Punk.'

Thanks for the grin :p :=

Rob

[paulc]

The ID scheme should at least be given a chance rather than be scorned. If it means that the genuine enthusiast can register their interest with the authorities then where is the harm in that.

Some of the comments on this thread are 'anti spotter' which is unfortunate as the vast majority would not and do not behave in such an offensive way, but as in any hobby you will always get the odd idiot.

Even the term 'spotter' is often spoken with derision by some, enthusiast is a better term as it covers a far wider range of aviation interests such as historical, restorations, photography.
I am involved in all 3 aspects, especially the restoration (one member on this thread has seen the project in question) and it is probable that some will have seen some photo's in magazines.

If enthusiasm for all aspects of aviation were reduced then airshows / publications etc would have no market to aim for.
You only have to go into a well know high street shop to see the range of aviation related magazines on offer.
How many people that will visit say IAT or SBAC Farnborough have involvement in aviation other than it being an interest.

yes I admit I collect tail codes but I do not have an anorak, thermos, bobble hat, stepladder or any such equipment that some might associate with a 'spotter' :)

[NinjaBill]

Would it be possible to have a warning on this thread, specifically, not to read it while at work. I've jsut recieved a lot of dodgy looks by nearly squirting coffee through my nose laughing while reading this thread.

My prooning adiction was nearly uncovered at work. :uhoh:

NB

[FNG]

On the security theme, I notice that, in order to get your ID card, you have to send in a photocopy of your spotter club membership card. A foolproof system! That nice man Mr Jihad al Shaheed, who has rented the place down the road and is obviously a keen gardener judging by the sacks of fertiliser piled up in his front hall, says that he's already sent off for his, and just hopes that they spell his name correctly.

[Man-on-the-fence]

Its not meant to be foolproof and the card does not confer any special rights etc. on the individual.

It doesnt do much but it may just help, why so negative?

[Reichman]

Perhaps Captain Mainwaring could be put in charge.

[dublinpilot]

Well....I'd prefer someone videoing my landing, taking down my aircraft reg, and telling me I'm actually flying a different airplane than I am, rather than have the same person being just as focused on stopping those noisey little airplanes flying over their village.

Imagine if we would convert every NIMBY to a spotter!

dp

[FNG]

It can be done....the CFI at Waltham told me the other week that, after taking one of the local nimbies for a free flight, she's become a convert and is getting a PPL. She will probably become a scary zealot, as converts tend to.

[bar shaker]

Dublin Pilot said:

Imagine if we would convert every NIMBY to a spotter!

Mate, what you need in the Emerald Isle is the 28 day rule. This automatically turns every NIMBY into a spotter.

;)

[shortstripper]

I've never had a problem with spotters. I've had a few over the years come to look at my aeroplane or current project and they were nothing but polite and pretty harmless folk. At least they're not anti aviation! Lets not alienate them but being mean in spirit to them.

That said ... My T31m project was "spotted" landing at an international airport umungst the airliners 6 months after I registered it .... it's still in my workshop under construction three years later! :rolleyes:

SS

[ShyTorque]

I've just had a terrible thought!

We've all turned into spotter spotters :bored:

[J.A.F.O.]

Today I saw a Nigel, a Kevin, a Stuart and a Keith at an airfield near me. The first three were in the usual denim and DPM livery but the Keith was in the shorts and T-shirt livery, first time I've seen that all year.

(Apologies to anyone with those names; I did insist to the Keith that he was in fact a Peter and suggested that he checked the label his Mum had sown into his underpants, but he refused - these people can be so rude, even when you show a genuine interest).

[BahrainLad]

Sat next to one of the morons on the Metro on the way back from EGNT the other day.

He was spouting off, with a an air of ultimate authority, a whole load of inaccurate information about the future plans for the airport and its current operations.

I was sorely tempted to batter him repeatedly with a rolled up copy of the FT......


(But then again, I did make a day trip NCL-LHR-NCL on October 24, 2003 to have a look at 3 pointy things landing, so where does that put me?)

[Steevee]

Reading this thread has prompted me to remember a story I was told by one of my former instructor some years ago.

A friend of hers had piloted an aircraft (sorry, no details on the type) into an unfamiliar airfield. After vacating the runway, he had been told by the tower to await the arrival of a marshal for directions onto the stand for parking. Almost at once, an individual (you can see what's coming, can't you?) had appeared in front of the aircraft, making signals with all the authority of a marshal.

Depsite the absence of any obvious outward official accoutrements - hi viz jacket etc - the directions provided had been so authoritative that the unsuspecting pilot had followed them for some distance before being alerted by the appearance of the real marshal and an anxious communication from the tower telling him to hold position.

The bogus marshal had been subsequently sent back to join his avaiation enthusiast friends at the perimeter wire.

Interesting question... who would be responsible if an accident had happened in these circumstances? We have all recently learned that running out of fuel can be considered not to be the fault of the PIC if s/he is can prove that inaccurate information about the previous fuel situation was provided. So what is the position of a PIC deceived into thinking s/he is under offical control bya marshal?

[paulo]

Heh heh... now Mr BahrainLad I was all poised to point out that you were trekking round the perimeter fence like a good 'un. I think by now, all the ppruners I met on the 24th have raised their hands on this thread!

I was going to say that I've never seen the Concorde bunch with pens and pads and so on. And then realised that there wasn't much to write down. :rolleyes: :(

Funnily enough they all look down on 'spotters'. :)

[SuperOwl]

I had to go and pick up my mother from Manchester the other week and I got there too early so I decided to go to the car park form which you could watch the planes come and go. Now, I am a person who lives and lets live but these people amazed me.

They got into a frenzy because they saw an Air France Airbus that they hadn't seen at Manchester before. It reminded me of one of those films where a ship is adrift with no hope of rescue until one of the sailors spots land on the horizon. It was a little unusual, it was almost like Beatlemania. Maybe not that bad.

Having said that, if they are able to be the eyes and ears of the police and are able to do so in a responsible but discreet manner, I can't see it being anything but good. Although they are a strange breed, if they are prepared to do this and are prepared to do it effectively, they deserve a pat on the back.

I still think its a strange hobby but if its how they get off and they aren't harming anyone, fair play to them. Its not my cup of tea though. As for the guy who Stevee describes, he's the sort that deserves a good kicking. He should have had the book thrown at him.

[Fly Stimulator]

A few minutes Googling using the terms "spotting", "Obsessive Compulsive Disorder" and "Asperger's Syndrome" is quite interesting, with a number of articles and academic papers identifying obsessive spotting and list-making as a form of mental abnormality at the milder end of the range of autistic disorders.

[PPRuNe Radar]

Interesting question... who would be responsible if an accident had happened in these circumstances? We have all recently learned that running out of fuel can be considered not to be the fault of the PIC if s/he is can prove that inaccurate information about the previous fuel situation was provided. So what is the position of a PIC deceived into thinking s/he is under offical control bya marshal?

Very easy one .... the commander of the aircraft does not have to follow the instructions of a marshall if he believes they are unsafe ... therefore, the responsibility of the safety of the aircraft always lies with the commander of the aircraft.

[Steevee]

PPRuNe Radar,

Fair enough. But what if the commander of the aircraft has no reason to believe the marshalling instructions s/he is being given are unsafe?

[BEagle]

Then he'd have questionable captaincy - safety of the a/c on the ground whilst under power is always the commnader's repsonsibility. Even if some turkey marshalled you into a wall, it'd still be your fault at the end of the day. Harsh - but dem's de facts, Jack!

[Steevee]

BEagle

I entirely agree with you. I am sure too that the PIC is also completely responsible for ensuring that s/he has adequate fuel on board to complete a journey. The outcome of a recent Court case suggests though that it is possible successfully to argue otherwise.

[Kolibear]

Steevee,

I read eactly the same story in GASIL, so it doesn't sound apocryhal.

Bill Oddie, in one of his excellent books, described trainspotting as 'ferro-equinology', literally 'a study of the iron horse'.

What would be the equvalent for plane-spotters then??

[AerBabe]

Ferro-ornithology, presumably. :)

[SQUAWKIDENT]

Amazing how many people on this thread are slagging-off "spotters" when it's a pretty sure bet that most of them were into "aircraft-spotting" at some point in their life before they took up private flying?

I am happy to admit I used to "spot" aeroplanes and (for some reason I have forgotten) make notes of registration numbers in my Ian Allan reg books. Then I grew up and got a well-paid job so I could achieve my dream of becoming a Pilot.

We should be as helpful and friendly as possible to these guys/girls - many may want to go on to become PPL's (or even ATPLs?). Yes there are some odd ball (but harmless) characters around who "spot" for years and never get a proper job (and live with mum..) but I think the vast majority are just like me (and you?) used to be when we were teenagers.

Adam

[AIRWAY]

it's a pretty sure bet that most of them were into "aircraft-spotting" at some point in their life before they took up private flying?

I am one of them.

Learning to fly and a spotter although i dont write down regs, just the photography side of things.

[MikeJeff]

Well I was never a spotter. And sitting on perimiter fences with sandwiches that their mum made and a thermos means that they bring no revenue into aviation. I think it's not unreasonable to charge this people to watch, or better still to shoot the barstewards!

[HighandTight]

The problem with 'spotters' is that many of them show an amazing lack of common sense.

Was doing my instructors rating out of LPL several years ago and turning wide base behind a large jet on finals. ATC suddenly orders jet to go around off short finals and us to orbit wide right base. Turns out some numpty of a bus driver had decided to go spotting and parked his large red doubledecker bus down the old track that led to the GA area. This put him amidst the approach light smack under the end of the runway. ATC hadn't known this, just saw large bus appear and stop. Apparently police had a good time ticking the guy off after making him move the bus.

Driving past MAN recently, it seems this stupidity hasn't stopped as cars are parked along Styal Road blocking the road on both side with spotters standing on the verge and wandering into the road. Why the police allow these morons to block the access gates and the main road to the airport amazes me. What saddens me more is that one of these chumps is going to be killed walking into the traffic whilst craning his neck up spotting.

Still, maybe not quite as stupid as the two guys who tried to climb the chainlink fence at Manchester's spotter's park a few years ago. Presume they wanted a better angle to take photos from and thought the fence was in the way. Had to chuckle at their look of shock though,as I taxied past with my student in a PA28. Two police Land Rovers suddenly appeared carrying armed police. Said spotters bundled into back of Landy and driven off! Hopefully never to be seen again:D

[SQUAWKIDENT]

I would agree with your comments about some of them displaying a lack of common sense at airfields and I will admit that I nearly got run over by a DC-3 at Jersey once when I was "spotting" (airside was alot less secure in the late seventies).

At least they're not Train Spotters. Now that IS weird;-)

Adam

[FNG]

Being keen on aeroplanes is one thing, but collecting registrations is plum bizarre. As mentioned above, the more extremespotters seem to have little interest in the aircraft themselves, or are only interested in extreme geeky techie detail, rather than, as Aussie Andy put it, the wonder of flight and flying machines (not to mention the drop dead gorgeousness and general all round fabulousness of all pilots) . I love the idea of Spotter Patroller number 1 arguing with Spotter Patroller 2 about the number of fins on a Mark 2 as opposed to a Mark 3 Stinger Missile whilst Mr al Shaheed lights the blue touch paper and retires to a safe distance.

[sharpshot]

I have to agree with some - You are giving "spotter's" a hard time!

So Spotter's enjoy these:ok:

http://img51.photobucket.com/albums/v156/Emirates/Cooperative_prod.jpg

http://img51.photobucket.com/albums/v156/Emirates/Hungarian_2.jpg

http://img51.photobucket.com/albums/v156/Emirates/Spitfire.jpg

There's so much variety on airfields.

Now define the term spotter!
:p ;)

[Monocock]

Hellfire

Where did you get that picture of my wife:suspect:

I must admit I know her well and I know that smile....

What she's thinking is...

"When you guys tuck your shirts into your pants, do you use the overlap method or the split middle method to aid access".:O

[Keef]

If she's a spotter, I feel a new pastime coming on...

[High Wing Drifter]

If she's a spotter, I feel a new pastime coming on...
Except that she'll be about 60 now.

[Reichman]

Is it some sort of Spotter self test?

If you're looking at the girl thinking, "Nice legs" and trying to see if she's wearing a ring - you're a normal bloke.

If however, your looking at the Spit and thinking, "I wonder what mark that is" - you probably live at home with your mum.

[sharpshot]

Would you like to see her in colour :D


The photo was taken at
01:38 UTC on 20030211 - but in the Southern hemisphere it was naturally daylight.

Now if she was ** then, well add on 15 months.
Spitfires - so well preserved!

SS

[Monocock]

She reminds me of a girl I used to entertain back in 1997 who went off to become an Emirates hostie.

Is her name Rebecca by any chance and do her parents come from a village near Telford.......?:E

[Reichman]

I've just watched it on the news!

The spotters at Luton (I think) over the moon that they are being involved in airport security.

"We even have a special telephone number to call!" said one. I thought he was going to drop his thermos he was so excited.

The best quote was from a copper who actually kept a straight face while saying, "We want to use the aircraft spotters' expertise to look out for unusual people hanging around the aiport perimeter." Priceless.

Reichman

[J.A.F.O.]

Oh dear, the kind of people who will want to do this are exactly the kind of people who should not be allowed to do it. I only hope that the special phone number goes to an answering service so as not to waste the time of the police listening to their well-intentioned but ultimately useless information.

[Wycombe]

Aerbabe,

The term you are looking for is "aero-sexuals" :D :D

[Irv]

I was teaching a spotter friend to fly in the 90s at Eastleigh and at hold Bravo for 20. We were cleared to line up after the landing xxx on short finals - whatever it was, it was obviously exotic to a spotter. Bob - sorry - this mate just said 'you have control, read that back will you, I've got to get this reg' - he then turned to a new page on his kneepad and started scribbling time date, etc.

[J.A.F.O.]

A few minutes Googling using the terms "spotting", "Obsessive Compulsive Disorder" and "Asperger's Syndrome" is quite interesting, with a number of articles and academic papers identifying obsessive spotting and list-making as a form of mental abnormality at the milder end of the range of autistic disorders.

I really can't say any more.

[bar shaker]

Sharpshot, you have shown that you aren't actually a true spotter at all.

No true spotter would have taken a picture of an aircraft with some bird obscuring the view and especially the numbers. A true spotter would have moved to a better vantage point.

;)

[Danza]

Looks like a mk XIV to me :E, now where did I leave my note pad?

[BEagle]

What a honey! Nice undercarriage and fine curves.

But the Spit in the background sure isn't a Mk XIV. Mark V?

Trainspotting in the 1950s I could understand. No TV worth mentioning, no Internet, so the sight of a proper steam hauled express belting past at close range must have been quite something. Collecting numbers? Can't see the point of that - but photography is certainly something else.

Nowadays trains are distinctly dull things. About 10 times a year I have to travel from Didcot to Paddington on whatever Western Region is called these days. Now and again there's a whiff of steam engine exhaust and a chuff-chuff sound from the museum which has all the old boys craning their necks in misty-eyed nostalgia whilst the broing diesels go past. However, when the 'stand back, this train isn't stopping here' tannoy goes out they aren't kidding! Even a diesel going through the station flat out is impressive - would be even better had it been a Castle or King (oops!) with shrieking whistle hauling chocolate-and-cream coaches!

Aircraft spotting - harmelss if they keep out of the way. Even in Greece! But some are as bad as 'militant twitchers' who will seemingly stop at nothing to pursue their hobby.

But as for bus spotters....:rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[Kolibear]

Bus Spotters!

You've just reminded me! Mrs K & I used to go to Mildenhall Airshow on the local Residents association coach trip. The airshow was full of aircraft spotters, and the coach park was full of bus spotters. Accordin to the coach driver, there were guys there who used to book onto coach tours with the sole intention of bus-ticking.

I don't think that we are having a pop at spotters here, the vast majority of them are perfectly normal. OK, so we may think their chosed hobby is a bit strange but I'm sure that 99% of us collect something, CDs, stamps, beer-mats, or whatever. What we do find hilarious are the activities of the fanatic spotters.

(Now theres a thought - Extreme Plane Spotting!)

Unfortunately, every hobby has its extremists, which tar all the moderates with a bad name. I enjoy birdwatching, but to most people I am instantly labelled a twitcher - hey, I've not done any twitching for about 15 years .

The time to worry is when you find some guy not only taking your reg, but recording the a/c serial number, then unbuttoning the cowlings to record the engine's serial number!

[FNG]

"Extreme Spotting"? There's already a TV show about that: catch it at 0330 on the Granada Men and Morons channel, presented by A A Gill and the fat floppy haired bloke fom Top Gear.

As for discussions of Spitfire variants, a salutary tale: two of us were arguing in the bar at North Weald over the one hanging from the ceiling. "It's a Mark whatever". " No, it's a mark something else, look at the tail". Sensible bloke at next table intervenes: "It's a model. Hanging from a ceiling. In a bar."

[Danza]

BEeagle, fair point I've looked again and it's not a MkXIV, but the exhaust stacks are wrong for a MK V, How about a MKIX?

Hmm, now I'm worried, maybe I am a spotter after all :\

[AerBabe]

Good grief, Danza... have you been snorting the methanol again?! There was me thinking you were a fairly normal, well-adjusted individual. :confused:

[Danza]

lol, I do manage to keep my spotter tendencies under control most of the time, but sometimes I just can't help it ;)

[AerBabe]

At least there are plenty of nice men in white coats around. :p

[BEagle]

Hmm, I was looking at her rounded tail and those nice bulges, not at her exhaust.

Nor the Spitfire's...:E :E

[PPRuNe Radar]

Might be PS915 which was used as a still in the Battle of Britain film (and presumably converted from its PR.XIX form for the duration before being restored to how it should look).

It's still flying with the BoBMF of course.

I'll get me anorak .... :ugh:

[AerBabe]

Looks the the undercarriage is in need of some repair and the flaps are probably loose. :E

[Kolibear]

Are you looking at the Spit AB?

[sharpshot]

For all you spotters out there

http://img51.photobucket.com/albums/v156/Emirates/Col-Spitfire.jpg

I would certainly give this Spitfire a high Mark;)

I\'m not an expert, but I have seen the occasional photographer
representing the fairer sex..............sooooo there must be a proportion of spotters too:ugh:

http://img51.photobucket.com/albums/v156/Emirates/F-117.jpg

[vanhigher]

hey Sharpshot - you look mighty cool in that F117...

Aerbabe - i didnt realise that you worked for Shell ;)

[AerBabe]

Ouch... dunno what happened to the lass in the colour version, but it probably hurt!
Vanhigher - Thanks for the compliment, but it can't be me, I have brown hair. :p
Sharpshot - I have to ask... if it is the aircraft saying that, why doesn't it just eject the pilot? :suspect: ;)

[Lowtimer]

"ferro-ornithology"? Aerbabe, even the Russians don't build iron aeroplanes. Well, not entirely iron, anyway...

[vintage ATCO]

You think spotters are sad, I have just heard on the radio (R4 Home Truths) of someone who collects Co-op stores. When he comes across one he hasn't seen before he takes a photo of it.

Er . . . . :confused:


VA

[AerBabe]

even the Russians don't build iron aeroplanes Sorry boss.
In a curious Gretin (Greek/Latin) mix then, how about this:

Bractea gallinology

:\

[sharpshot]

Hey A/B, I was in a hurry to go out last night.

I'll be more careful when I am messing in Pshop with my pics!:=

[sharpshot]

A daring Spotter

http://img51.photobucket.com/albums/v156/Emirates/F14_upload.jpg

[sharpshot]

......the F-14 fled back to the safety of the carrier :{
but there were some intrepid airmen better equipped to take care of the spotter.........

http://img51.photobucket.com/albums/v156/Emirates/AN-drop.jpg

[BRL]

Excellent stuff this, but, and a big BUT, I may send this to JetBlast as well as the pink aviator thead as it is nearing it's first anniversity so, as to reduce the workoad here, as it has its own forum now, things can be posted there.

If Pink has done her skills test before then, then all is well, but if not then the thread will be locked out of use as it takes too much time for us on here and it can be continued on her own forum. So, Pink, you have untill your first aniversity to do your skills test, if not, the thread gets transfered to your own forum for it to continue and prosper in there.

Sorry to be the bringer of bad news but it has been disscused where the thread goes and the general consenus favours it continuing on your own site.

Go for it, the time is now Pinkster, go for it...........

[Evo]

as it has its own forum now, things can be posted there.


Pink has got a PPRuNe forum? Where?

[WestWind1950]

not a pprune forum, but her own very own homepage :ok:

Pinkster (http://www.pinkaviator.com)

enjoy! :E

Westy

P.S. my only experience with Spotters was in 1997. I flew over to England with a another girl pilot in a PA28-140 to the North Weald airshow. After landing, I wondered what all those people were doing with binoculars and clipboards. Well, I guess we were a bit something special arriving in a pretty "old" Piper with German registration and 2 gals disembarking :cool: Our stay in North Weald was very memorable. The organisers arranged a place for us to stay and we were just thrilled at the hospitality. It was the first time my friend had ever been to England!

We don't have spotters in Germany as you have in England. I'm sure there are some, but they must be hinding in the bushes :} ... I've never noticed them....

[Evo]

Wow, there's a whole pink-PPRuNe (Pink Pilot's Rumination Network?) out there. It's kind of scary ;)

[TonyR]

I had a spotter here yesterday, a "Foxbat" light aircraft landed at my strip, they only said hello and were off in a bout five minutes again.

Just as they were airborne a "spotter" arrived and wanted to know all about this aircraft etc.

I was a bit reluctant at first in case he was out to report them for something, but he was just a "spotter"

So I told him where the aircraft was based (about 10 miles away)and off he went "wheels spinning" to se if he could get there before they landed.

I dont really understand them but I suppose its all harmless fun.

[Pink_aviator]

HI EVO

Be NOT AFRAID.

I have SPOTTED YOU . and I am a forum spotter ,and now probably a hijaker of threads , teehee

but I am harmless .

pinkster

[Whirlybird]

BRL,

I must confess I don't understand your logic in talking about this thread and Pink Headsets in the same breath. I've only skimmed this thread, but I've seen little content relating to Private Flying...though I daresay there's some. That's the reason I rarely come back to it. Pink Headsets, on the other hand, is overall fairly flying related. OK, so there's a lot of other stuff there too. OK, so PA's way of describing stuff is a little....unconventional, shall we say. But overall it's a detailed account of her flying training. It is becoming very popular...and a fair number of regular readers are instructors and/or regular PPRuNers - BEagle, Westwind1950, little me, knobbygb...to mention but a few. I know some people don't like it - but they don't have to read it. And it's merely ONE thread - PA is hardly starting half a dozen per day, as has happened in the past with...minority interest threads, shall we say.

I started off not reading it, then dipped in now and then, then thought it was fun but didn't take it seriously. I now feel very strongly that it should be left where it is. I think you should show this post to the other mods, who I gather discuss this thread at intervals. I know I speak for a number of others. And I suspect I speak for a number of lurkers, some of them people who wouldn't otherwise bother with all the technical detail in Private Flying ( and flaming!), some of them new PPLs and students who are scared to post, but can identify with PA's difficulties, both in her private life and in the air.

Seriously, I think this thread is an asset to PPRuNe. As for it's place being on PA's website, I for one don't want to go there. I spend too much time on the internet. I'm a busy person; I read PPRune, then that's it. I don't want to get into PA's life generally (Sorry, Pink One!). But I do want to read fun, sometimes digressing, but vaguely flying related threads on Private Flying. And as one of the founder members of Priavte Flying , who fought for this forum, I think I have a right to be listened to.

So, I mean it, KEEP PINK HEADSETS!!!!!!!

[locksmith]

If any should be in jetblast the Pfa thread should, as it is now back to life.

[FNG]

I think that it would be a shame if we could not have threads in Private Flying which principally consist of jokes and daft anecdotes. BRL's own "Passengers from Hell" thread was a good example of a thread of this kind. The PFA thread included a lot of ranting, but raised some worthwhile debate about the organisation. I shall take the Fifth in relation to the pink thing.

[bar shaker]

I agree completely with BRL.

The spotter thread was very funny but its home should now be in Jet Blast, so that others who are looking for just such a thread can find it and enjoy it. Its where I go when looking for a

I had a look at Pink's site and its a very deserving home for her thread. You could even assume that it had been set up specifically for this purpose. Perhaps someone can help her move it over in its fullness. The thread seems to have become a club for those that visit it and is only a click away from these people's favorite list. Whirly, you cannot use the phase "I am a busy person" in a post about reading Pink's thread ;) ;)

[Pink_aviator]

WHATS A "FIFTH " FNG. please .

The girl from the PINK thing .

[BEagle]

The Fifth Amendment to the US Constitution's Bill of Rights:

"No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation."

Not sure of the relevance here, to be honest, PP, perhaps FNG is referring to the right to be free from self-incrimination?

[sharpshot]

Hmmmm,

http://img51.photobucket.com/albums/v156/Emirates/Harrier.jpg

Is this Mod guy a Limey?

http://img51.photobucket.com/albums/v156/Emirates/F-15_reheat.jpg

http://img51.photobucket.com/albums/v156/Emirates/Tomc_10.jpg

"That\'s All Folks"

[BEagle]

WestWind1950, there certainly are spotters in Germany!

Several years ago I was working in the field as a temporary Harrier site opertaions officer. The site commander was rather concerned at the number of civilians who had come to watch the jets flying out of the site as some were parking directly under the approach path at quite some risk to their safety.

The problem was solved when they were encouraged to move by a demonstration of 'playful' antics by our woolly alligators masquerading as police dogs! A few woofs and bites on the padded suit worn by the volunteer RAF 'intruder' persuaded our inquisitive German chums to move to somewhere rather safer!

[redsnail]

Rego collecting is something I can't quite understand but watching aircraft fly/land/whatever is fine :ok:

The spotters at Luton probably don't realise how they frighten the FA's who have to walk to their cars. The FA's don't know that they are "harmless" spotters and just see a "different" looking guy loitering around where the public don't usually go. This naturally unerves them a bit. They either get security or one of the male crew to walk them to their cars. Paranoid? No, I don't think so. The threat perception of a female is very different to a male's.

[WestWind1950]

@BEagle

that must have been in the days when the British had a few military bases here.... the "local" Germans were probably infected with the spotters desease :}
I live about 5 minutes from Germany's busiest public airfield and I have never seen spotters there.... it's just not common here. That, of course, doesn't mean they don't exist at all... but certainly not as on your island .... ;)

Westy

[BEagle]

Well, the last time I landed at FRA (as a LH passenger) I noticed a whole gaggle of spotters on one of the little roads just off the western edge of the airport..

Though perhaps our spotters are rather more common in number as you say!

[Taildragger]

I can't be a@sed dragging my way through umpteen pages of this, but got the gist after about 20 responses.
My partner (In our aircraft-not the poofta variety) is a 23,000 hour heavy pilot (Still - at the age of 62- that narrows it down a bit.!!) Even grade A triple gold anoraks regard him as the God of all Gods. I once put him thorugh a recital of the most obscure reggies, and he got the all one after one.!
I can't do that, but I have been a pilot for 33 years and I am just as plane crazy as I was then. So dear prooners, it is not only people in camo jackets and bobble hats, looking as if six months with a personal fitness trainer would do them a world of good, that are spotters. Mind you I often wonder about the ones trailing the wife with the notebook and muttering reggies for her to dutifully write down. Surely they should be at home cooking....No NO I didn't say that. It was an aberration...honest.
Mind you there are quite a few female of the breed. (And two I am aware of who used to be anoraks and are now anorakettes)

[Kolibear]

Spotting is to flying as p0rn is to sex.

You get to know what the different bits are called, what they do, how they work, whose got the best and biggest bits, where those bits have been.

But its still nothing like doing it yourself.

[Aussie Andy]

Beautifully put, Kolibear!

Andy :p

[BEagle]

Aussie Andy, perhaps the problem is that they do it with themselves..??:E

[GK430]

So Kolibear,
It's a kind of adolescent period. Are you saying all pilots start here until they mature & get their hands on the real thing:D

[AerBabe]

all pilots start here until they mature That's a contradiction in terms. :rolleyes:
Remember the story about the guy who takes his child to the airport to watch the aeroplanes?
'Daddy, when I grow up I want to be a pilot'
'You can't have both, son'.

[Dop]

Taildragger - I can't help wondering if the anoraks who became anorakettes did so because they thought there should be more women spotters!

(A similar tale is told about a science fiction fan who had the op. some years ago)

[sharpshot]

Crikey it's still in this Forum!

Monocock - before you proceed and look any further, please confirm that you are not really a bigamist. This is not Rebecca......although you might like it to be:ok:

Breaking News:
Even aircrew are now having to evade spotters on the Ramp!

http://img51.photobucket.com/albums/v156/Emirates/SSGM.jpg

[GK430]

No, I don't think it's Rebecca, but I would like to welcome our colleaugues into the EU as they have just joined.

Seen that uniform somewhere ;)

[Floppy Link]

I was toying with the idea of getting an L4 Cub, AOP Auster and Fiesler (?) Storch together for the airshow circuit and calling them "Spotter Formation" - never thought about the other meaning of the term. :ugh:

Probably won't bother! :\

[ShyTorque]

I like the uniform but the collar and cuffs don't match.....

[sharpshot]

They're behind you

http://img51.photobucket.com/albums/v156/Emirates/C-17_Ob.jpg

[Wycombe]

....and the aircraft type in the above photo is????

[Rattus]

Come on Wycombe - nobody's going to damn himself as a spotter by admitting he knows what it is... but is it a J or a K?:8

[Wycombe]

.....incorrect on both counts!

[sharpshot]

You tell him Wycombe.

It's one of those rentals with four big fans:ok:

[AerBabe]

Good grief, it's soooo easy to cheat on this one. :rolleyes:

[Kolibear]

Oh dear, I got it right before I worked out Aerbabe's cheat.

I've already got the binos, the hi-vis jacket and the pocket copy of Jane's. I think I'm turning into.......

[FNG]

Returning briefly to the starting point of the thread, I have to report that one of our agents who, at great personal risk, conducts covert monitoring of the dangerous nutters on the Flyer Forum, intercepted the following transmission this morning:-

"Broadcast on BBC Radio Suffolk this very morning and transcribed as well as I can from memory.

Plane spotters in Suffolk have warned that the 2 mile exclusion zone around the Sizewell nuclear power station - which has no radar - is frequently penetrated by light aircraft that could pose a threat to the facility."

Before we know it, they'll be issuing the spotters with ground to air missiles. The only consolation will be that, as pointed out above, they'll be too busy writing down the numbers on the missiles to fire them before we have buggered off to beat up the beaches in North Norfolk.

[sharpshot]

http://img51.photobucket.com/albums/v156/Emirates/168_6868.jpg

[Wide-Body]

This post is made under a big Allegedly heading without prejudice.

One of my aircraft was recently highlighted to the authorities for incorrect historical markings. I believe the said person was a spotter at my local airfield. Up until this point I have always given as much time (and flights to enthusiasts). The Authorities have been understanding but they have a job to do.

Sorry airfield enthusiasts, but you will find access to restricted areas of my airfield a little bit harder to come by. As for flights to interested parties in historic aircraft !!!!

Throwing teddies out of the pram perhaps. Just thought some may be interested. Out of interest, the offending article will have to be replaced by kill markings deemed illegal in some JAR countries. Humm

regards to all Wide :\

[FunctionedSatis]

Ehm.......


Yes there a funny breed spotters , but each to there own! Now who ever heard a pilot holding court and bumming on and on????? hummm..........??

:p :E

Stu

[Jet Dragon]

Easy to pi$$ take isn't it chaps ;)

Reality is that the spotting fraternity like most others (including pilots and other aircrew) has it's fair share of a***holes.

On the other hand there are many "spotters" out there around the world who are a tad more rational and mature, who do/have worked in the industry, and who do genuinely have a love for aviation.

I don't think anyone would seriously suggest that spotters are there to enforce security at airports, but on the other hand the guy who spends time regularly outside the fence is arguably likely to notice activities "beyond the norm" - why would security agencies ignore a potentially accurate warning??

Many spotters are "enthusiasts" guys - many, like myself have an industry background, and many people now flying as crew cut their teeth with the notebook out at LHR and the like.

Don't be so :mad: superior - some of the kids out there now are the aircrew of the future.

JD

spotter/enthusiast of some vintage (and I dont live wiv me mum:ok: )

[Wide-Body]

JD

Was not Piss taking just hard fact


Wide

[Jet Dragon]

Wide - not a dig at your post

I sympathise with your experiences - as I said every group has it's A***holes.

But please don't paint us all the same.

JD

[bar shaker]

... and can I have your registration please?

;)

[Germstone]

the worst i heard was some guy trying to gain access to a hangar to take "rivet rubbings" wax crayon and paper in hand I kid you not.

[LGS6753]

It's easy to poke fun, and sure, some spotters make it even easier.
But 40 years of aviation enthusiasm has given me an excellent grasp of world geography, a passing understanding of some of the laws of physics and some knowledge of a most important industry.
And what's more I know many others who are responsible members of society, but just take an interest in aircraft.
If I saw something out of the ordinary near an airport, I would certainly let Mr Plod know about it. But because I am a regular visitor, I have learnt what is usual, and what isn't (eg not all Ryanair 737-200s are on fire).:D

How about 'live and let live'. You can peer into my back garden from 1500ft, and I'll watch you cocking up your landings. Deal?