Pens at altitude

[Hansard]

I use a particular type of very ordinary ball point pen which writes perfectly well at ground level, but gives up at 9,000' in an unpressurised twin. It's been suggested to me that some pens won't perform at altitude. Is this utter rubbish or a possibility?

[Rhodie]

Could well be -

Saw a sales splurb once at an aviation shop, which convinced me to buy a lovely little silver bullet shaped pen, advertised as the "Astronaut" pen..

could write upside down, under water (never tried that) and at altitude..

I must admit, it always worked - right up to the time I lost the bleedin' thing cos it was so small (and probably cos it was so shiny as well - it got legs..:suspect: )

Now, Iv'e never had a problem with my 'Waterman' - but believe they have a 'pressurised' cartridge or some other fancy system, same as the Parker..

Hope it helps
Cheers
R

[icemaiden]

There has to be something in it... afterall NASA spent $12 Billion on a pen that could write in zero gravity, upside down, on a variety of surfaces and at differing temperatures etc...in the meanwhile of course the Russians just used a pencil.

[The African Dude]

If I'm right, it's the differing pressures either side of the ballpoint tip (assuming the ink chamber is airtight and sealed at ISA pres. or near enough) which will cause the ball bearing to jam in the socket! But I'm not a pen manufacturer! :)

Andy

[Waggon rut]

A cheap ball point I had gave up in a NG in my jepp flight case.
Always buy a good pen now, just keep leaving them in the aircraft.

[Hansard]

Thanks folks!

RTO - very interesting, it's the "Pilot" brand I'm talking about and I've also had one which leaked all its ink in the cruise!

On some of the others, the ink has separated in the chamber, leaving air pockets.

[squashed fly]

Can thoroughly recommend the PAPERMATE DYNAGRIP. Been using (and losing) them for years. The clip on the pen is just the right size to fit in the spring clip on the yoke mounted chart holder (sadly, no pen holders provided on our 737's). These pens have a soft rubber lower barrell to make them easy to grip - it also makes them fit perfectly into the small hole at the forward end of the DV window frame . . . I wonder how many pens have met their end in that hole?

[Human Factor]

I can thoroughly recommend the Marriott hotel in-room complimentary variety. Never had one fail in cruise (cabin-alt 8000'), doesn't matter if they quit 'cos you have several in your bag at one time and available with black ink for the tech log.

Maybe I should go and work for Micheal O'Leary.... :O

[bookworm]

My favourite pen is the Pilot Hi-Tecpoint. Unfortunately, despite the name, it has a habit of leaking copiously at altitude (I've lost shirts, not just notepads!), hence I don't use them when flying.

Favourite writing instrument for airborne use -- good old HB! :)

[Genghis the Engineer]

I have one of those space pens in front of me, the make is "Fisher" (www.spacepen.com). You can buy some very expensive ones - or you can buy them in the shop at the Smithsonian for about $8, I've had mine for 4 years, used it pretty constantly, including in the air on numerous occasions, and not needed a refill yet.


The story about NASA pens versus Russian pencils does the rounds, but the truth is still better. NASA actually permitted a private company to spend a fortune developing pens that will write in any conditions; as a result, NASA got all the pens it wanted for free, whilst Fisher have made far more money than it ever spent developing them selling pens with NASA endorsement. It's the American way!

G

[FlightDetent]

Im with the "classics" now, and the green variety of Holliday Inn works juuust fine. Could it be the automatics on NG? Dunno, if it ain´t Boeing, I would be going anyway...:cool:

FD.

[fesmokie]

I dont know what it is but I've had more pens leak in the past few months than ever. I cant seem to find the right one.I've even tried the Dynagrip and some work and some don't. Funny, the Hotel pens seem to work best.;)

[Kerosene Kraut]

You can get cheap no name refill cartridges for the fisher space pen in US office supply supermarkets with the very same pressure mechanism and functionality.

[Bre901]

the Hotel pens seem to work best

Wouldn't it just be because the ink chamber is open-ended, just like the basic Biros ?

Pressure difference betwen either side of the ballpoint tip remains the same as on-ground and Bob's your uncle.

[FlightDetent]

Such a lovely thread it seemed to have developed here and now some smart haired gringo comes and provides totally corect and complete scientific explanation to the topic. Shame on you, the magic is gone now. :{ :ok: :ok: :ok: I've even dismantled the various hotel representatives in my flight-bag to find precisely so. ;), off to JetBlast now.

FD

edited for typing

[maxy101]

I'm with Human Factor here. Hotel pens are the best! And if it doesn't work, you chuck it and use a different one. BTW, why do people take their cheapo pen with them when they go on their rest?

[Bre901]

Pane FD

If you read this thread, you will see that I'm not the only one to talk about pressure. :8
It was just a matter of logics.
And it's not only pilots who are taking pens from hotel rooms, SLFs do exactly the same. ;)
off to JetBlast now
You should visit JB more often, that would teach you some manners :p :}

[Basil]

Ordinary Parker works OK for me in pressurised cabin at 6k - perhaps a mil reader could try depressurising @ 35 & report :D

[expedite_climb]

I had two spacepens, they were great apart from one thing - I kept leaving them on the aircraft !

I've used ordinary 15p BIC biros or similar (well, not that they are 15p any more !), and have never had a problem.

On the other hand I had a biro explode on me in the car on a sunny day the other week......

[selfin]

I guess no one has bothered to try those nifty felt pens which don't penetrate the paper? You know.. the sort with the fine nibs which architects use.

[Pilot Pete]

I felt impelled to add my experiences to this thread............

Had the Spacepen as a Crimbo prezzie from the Brother-in-law who felt very proud that he had found me the 'ideal' present. Just how often he thought I experienced zero gravity on the way to Tenerife I shall never know. I was unfortunately not impressed with it. I found it had to be kept almost perpendicular to the page to get it to write and I tend to hold my pen at quite an angle so the 'seating' for the ball point would touch the paper and not the ball. Banished to the 'pen' drawer at home.

I found the best pens were the black plastic Hilton pens that were doing the rounds in Europe a year or two back. They were fine point (which I like) and twist top (not as good as push top which can easily be used with one hand) but acceptible nonetheless, and black (a must). They fitted neatly into the pen-clip, the top pocket (hence retractible nib required) and also just clipped into the yolk mounted chart holder 'slider groove' with a pleasing 'thupp' sound on the 757. they were made for each other. Why, oh why, oh why...................

Sadly the Hilton have gone green and now produce those god awful cardboard toilet rolls with a cheap and nasty BLUE refill, non-retractible and after any more than a couple of sectors use, totally unable to keep the refill held in due to 'cardboard swell'. They go fuzzy on the outside and resemble a chip wrapper after a day's use with the amount of grease and dirt they hold in the now decaying cardboard outer. They are not doing the environment any good at all as they get binned well before they run out and another one begins its short lifespan! They even say 'made from recycled cardboard' on the side! Fine, but do I really have to recycle it every day to have a useable pen.........!

So they have been banished to our recycling bin. Just about all the other hotel pens have equally gone down in quality. The 'Black Marriott' is a bendy Bic with a seperate top (ok to just bin the top and leave in the pen clip but no good for the old shirt pocket). The Tivoli is a blue version of the same :( (don't like blue). The 'Fat Radisson' is black in colour (promising) but the ink is blue (disappointing) and the twist top (hmmn, not bad) lets you down when you find it twists the opposite way to what one would expect..........damn! Even more disappointing is the fact that I have just found another two in the pen drawer. Ahh, the Holiday Inn. Bendy Bic (:{ ahhhhhh), but black (hoorahhh!), still got a seperate top though :hmm: (oooooohh). Old style Marriott, found at the back under the pencil shavings, looked good at a glance:ooh: , but failed to deliver on closer inspection:* . Ohhh, a new contender. Euopcar, Gatwick circa 2002 I venture. Chunky, firm and grippable, ultra smooth action push-top, clip for the pocket, fine nib, it's got it all.................sh!te it's blue!!!!! Best Western. Ditto.

Ahhh, the definitive. Papermate Flexgrip ultra. Push-top, pleasing 'click' action, firm rubber feel in the hand :\ (oo-err), comfortable, reliable, black:cool: , fine enough. My dream pen:D .............

Jeremy Clarkson:p

[GlueBall]

Beware, the BIC Grip Roller definitely leaks. :ugh:

[Nozzles]

Somebody bought me a Spacepen once. Unfortunately it exploded whilst sitting on my desk. Did NASA remember to test them at 1g and 1 atmosphere's pressure?:E