Decorum please on the flight deck.

[Menen]

Talked to a new bright eyed and bushy tailed ex GA first officer who had just started on the 737 of a major Australian operator and who was startled at the continual stream of obscene language emanating from the check captain he was flying with.
Seems that the left seat occupant was unable to string a sentence together without copius use of F and C words.

Is bad language really necessary in the cockpit or is it just a lack of proper education? Or too much watching of The Sopranos, maybe?

And flying big jets used to be such a dignified profession...

[amos2]

strewth!!...the F/O was that bad eh? :p

[MoFo]

Could it be that said F/O was one of those precious rich boys put through the best schools by Daddy and Mummy and has never worked a day in the real world in his life. Probably had everything but a personal valet throughout his life.

Perhaps the checky has seen some real life. Unlike the nancy boy.

Perhaps?

[What-ho Squiffy!]

MoFo - very funny! Thanks for the laugh...

[Hugh Jarse]

Seems that the left seat occupant was unable to string a sentence together without copius use of F and C words.

So Hutch is back on deck, eh? :} :} :ok:

[Animalclub]

You have to admit that it does show a poor command of the Australian (English) language if you can't express your self without swearing.

No, I'm not a nancy boy nor do I come from a rich family... and yes I do use those words when appropriate.

[Col. Walter E. Kurtz]

Welcome to Australia!

Profanity - so sweet a filler!!

[Chocks Away]

:mad: fellas! :mad:'n relax abit eh!? You f:mad: punsie :mad: ts have gotta :mad:en chill-out abit, eh!

:} :p

[Howard Hughes]

Of course, the real test is can you get the verb, the noun and the adjective of the word :mad:ck in the one sentence?

Cheeers, HH.

:ok:

[Douglas Mcdonnell]

From memory the Occa CRM training manual states that use of the F word is expected in Australian airline ops. I liked the paragraph that says, " the C word should not be used when flying with a female pilot, unless she uses it first ". June Dally watkins would be shocked!

Mennen, does your mate flog whatchtower mags on the weekends?

Regards DM

[No worries mate]

Sounds like your mate is a little up tight if he can't handle to hear the F and C word in the Flight Deck. F*** how did he survive in F****n GA.

[international hog driver]

Being Australians we are well know for our economising in the use of language.

ie: Barbie, Loo, Cuppa, Ta, to name a few.

As far as I am concerned, why waste a 6 or 7 letter word when a 4 letter one will do!
:E :ok:

[Soulman]

Gotta love my Macqaurie Dictionary definition of f**ker:

f**ker, n. Colloq. -adj 1. one who f**ks; one much given to f**king. 2. a contemptible person or thing. 3. (not necessarily offensive) any person.

Any person? Gee, might be able to have that as my title - just like the local quack has Dr.

Cheers,

J Soulsby. F**ker

[amos2]

Punsie?...I like that Chocks!...what's it mean? :p

Perhaps Mennens mate oughta trot off to the British Empire and fly with Nigel! :rolleyes:

[Pimp Daddy]

Of course, the real test is can you get the verb, the noun and the adjective of the word ck in the one sentence?

You mean like " The f@cking f@cker's f*cked "

Hear that all the time at work

[The Enema Bandit]

Who gives a fark??

[Thumbs up]

Not being a prude by any means,but I wonder if Mr
Checky had used such colourful language on his first check to line as a bright eyed,bushy tailed F/O ?.
If he did (and I bet he didn't),I wounder if he was chipped !!.

No check Captains that I have ever known has had loose language,but some line people do,perhaps that is one reason they're not checkies.

Menen,I agree...not a good message from a person of presumed authority,especially with someone impressionable.

[Kaptin M]

Holy F#*K that mother f#*king F#*ker (insert #1 here) f#*ked f#*king (insert #2 name here)'s f$*in girlfriend last week, and when f#*king (#2) f#*ing well finds out, he'll snot that f#*king c-word's f#*ing nose right through his F#*ing cerebellum!

But back to the guts of this subject.
Why should someone, whose parents have tried to provide the best education opportunities for their children,have sh!t put on them by some of the Oz yobs?

My old man was just your average bank Johnny, but he went without to provide what he considered was the best education for us kids.
I have done the same for mine - even to the extent that I was slowly going out the door backwards for a few years (by "charging it" on credit) to give my 2nd kid the same opportunities his brother had received.

And so f#*in' what if this F/O takes offence at "cuss" words - I, for one, know that I am guilty of occasionally unnecessarily incorporating one too many "f's" and "c's" into my vocab., and sometimes stop to think how much more respect I have for individuals who DON'T unnecessarily incorporate cuss words into their every conversation.

(Let's hope GoGirl isn't reading this - she might blow my cover!!)

[I'm gone!]

Jarse,

Your comment re Hutch gave me a good laugh!

Good to see the old fella is gone but not forgotten!

I will let the :mad: old bald :mad: know!

Cheers,
I'm gone!

[Transition Layer]

Kaptin M,

With all due respect, I don't think by being provided with the "best education opportunities" someone is precluded from swearing! In fact I think it has a detrimental effect on their use of the more "acceptable" words in the English language.

I come to this conclusion from my observations over a number of years whilst sharing train carriages with said boys - I was enroute to a Government High School and they were going to some of the best schools in Sydney!

Anyone who thinks that private school boys don't swear is f*cking kidding themselves!

:D

TL

P.S. I'm surprised no-one has brought out the old line about pilots talking about flying whilst f*cking, and talking about f*cking whilst flying!

[Wizofoz]

Fact is I think this goes to show how much of Aviation, particularly involving more "senior" members of our profession, often seems to exist in a vacuum compared to the rest of the workforce.

Our aeroplane is our workplace, the Captain is a manager, and provision of a non-hostile, non-discriminatory workplace is a requirement in most countries.

"F"ing and Blinding in an office would be an actionable offence, with the protagonist subject to discipline or dismissal, if any employee found it offensive. Indeed there has recently been a case here where a female FO "won" (out of court settlement) an action against an airline for harassment because she was verbally abused by a Captain.

Pilots are people. They might be female, Muslim, Christian or just plain offended by bad language.

If the FO in this thread is genuinely offended by this particular Captain, he/she has ever right to complain to management, and they would be well advised to caution said Captain to moderate his behaviour.

I'm not saying I agree with it, but that's the world we live in.

[steamchicken]

Reminds me a little of working for Tony Glenn on Corunna Downs - "It's a bloody, bloody f*cking c*nt of a f*cking thing!" being his catchphrase.

Not sure about posh persons being any less likely to cuss - I've known a few who use the f*ckin' great British adjective constantly because they think it conceals their poshness...fools..

[Soulman]

Menen - could you pass this onto your friend?

A Lesson In The Diversity Of The English Language (http://www.funnyjunk.com/pages/history.htm)

I'm sure he will be most impressed.

Soulman.

[itchybum]

wizofiz....... are you serious???

As for the FO, if that FO couldn't hack it that FO shouldn't have joined. It's NOT like any other "workplace".

[Wizofoz]

Itchy,

You, me or any 90 out of 100 pilots might think it's not like any other workplace, but I can assure you that pilots are employees, and no industrial law in any country states "applicable to all employees except pilots."

The law is the law. Contravene it, by busting an SOP or by harassing an underling, at your peril.

[Sperm Bank]

Wiz I take your point but pay it little credence for the following reasons.

Woops wrong button.

I was bought up in the bush and attended a nice boarding school. All the boarders and most of the day scholars used colourful language. Its just what we did.

Being bought up on a healthy diet of adjectives probably does not improve ones vocabulary in early life, however one can at least pronounce the word correctly and with conviction.

ANger..F@ck off!
Surprise..F@ck me
Moron..F@ckin loser
Disgust..For F@cks sake
Understanding..What the F@ck
Go away..F@ck you
Worry..Holy F@ck
Religious..Jesus F@cking Christ
and..F@cking Jesus, F@cking Christ.
Identity..Who the F@ck
Privacy..mind your own F@cking business
Had enough..Go and get F@cked

And so the list goes on. Why would we want it any other way?

[Capt Claret]

G'day Sperm,

Interesting word innit?

I'd have thought that Anger and Go away should have been transposed. :}

[The Baron]

I 'kin think it shows a broader 'kin ability to 'kin express oneself 'kin succinctly and with greater 'kin emphasis on getting your 'kin point across. Much like Leonardo 'kin da Vinci used to 'kin do with 'kin paint...:}

[Sperm Bank]

Gday Clarie.

Yes mate it's a great word. Your'e probably right about the positions, but being such a flexible word encompassing adjective, verb, ad-verb, noun and pro-noun, I guess it fits anywhere (if you'll pardon the pun).

[timezone]

What would Rodney Rude think of all this , if its in the dictionary its there to be used , my old english teacher used to say , learn a new word each day. FARCANAL !!!

[Wizofoz]

Spermy,

I'm not saying any of us want it any other way, I'm telling you that it is the other way.

If you are in the position of being another workers superior (e.g Captain of an aircraft) and engage in behaviour a reasonable person might see as potentially offensive (and you bet that foul language counts), you are an anonymous complaint away from a tribunal hearing, disciplinary action, and carrying the can for your employer having to pay out compensation.

It has and will increasingly happen.

Just remember, the measure of what is offensive is not the person speaking, it's the one listening (even if you weren’t talking to them!!).

[cribble]

:*
It appears to me that the F/O is being a bit precious, as are some posters in reply advocating going directly to redress. We are supposed to be big boys/girls and should be able to sort out a reasonable level of relationship problems ourselves: its called social interaction or somesuch trendy phrase (It used to be called being a grownup!).

IMHO the first action should have been a bog-standard 'assertiveness statement' (most would remember it from basic CRM training, if not from normal life experience).

After a nil or adverse reaction to said statement, only THEN go nuclear.

[Capt Claret]

Cribble,

you don't really expect the poor complainant to actually confront the alleged transgressor do you. Surely not when a quiet word said to a superior enables them to avoid looking into the eyes of the one they complain about. :rolleyes:

[Centaurus]

So we are all agreed, then. Decorum on the flight deck is for wimps and not applicable to Australian airline captains. :ok:

[Wizofoz]

HHmmm,

Simple question,

Do you all change/moderate your behaviour at work when dealing with a Female rather than a Male?

If so, you are assuming that one person is entitled not to be subjected to certain behavior based on their sex.

Try arguing that one in a court of law!!

you don't really expect the poor complainant to actually confront the alleged transgressor do you. Surely not when a quiet word said to a superior enables them to avoid looking into the eyes of the one they complain about.

Clarrie,

Should they? Yes. Do they have to under the law? NO!!

I'm not arguing the rights and wrongs, I'm warning people in positions of authority what they are up against in todays blame centred, litigious society.

[Vmo248]

Ya sure 'Newbie's' not co-ing on a F-28?
They're a real Fokker!


<boom-boom>:\

[ER2nd.]

..getting back to the original posting....just wondered why (if true) the Checkie's language was so extreme? Could it be the way the flight was going? All kinds of senario's come to mind. It sorta (runs parallel with) cunjures up memories of when I was tought to drive a car and the ear blastings I got from the 'other' seat (rarely of course) in response to the little errors I made whilst behind the wheel. Ah..."The driving instructor".... anyone remember it? Such a long time ago....and I nearly ran over that guy ahead of us too - the one holding the flag .....

[Capt Claret]

Well in light of this thread I came to work today resolved not to say :mad: so much, and to try and be more considerate to the F/Os who have to listen to it.

All went well for a while until I was telling the story about being :mad:ed around by the local Nissan dealer, who took my Patrol for a whole day yesterday to fix what was supposed to be a one hour warranty job. The :mad:ing stupid :mad:ers spent the whole day fitting the wrong :mad:ing parts!!! :{

This thread reminds me a bit of the movie Lenny (I think) from the 70's. Poor sod got locked up for pointing out how usefull the word :mad: was, simply because it has so many :mad:ing uses. As eruditely pointed out by Sperm Bank

[Animalclub]

Capt C.

I have to say that your posting about your car "fixer" had me rolling on the floor. Thanks.

[Pinky the pilot]

Well; I'll go out on a limb here. Whilst I have certainly been known to let fly with a few expletives on occasion I hold the view that to use the f and c word almost continuously in normal conversation is boorish and unacceptable.

You only live twice. Once when
you're born. Once when
you've looked death in the face.

[nzer]

If the language used or the topic discussed causes offence, and the listener states that they find it so, in law as well as manners the speaker must modify the language/desist from the topic. A Flight Deck is not exempt, and it includes anyone of any rank.

[cunninglinguist]

If pornstar was up and running with the deathstar, I'd say that he was an effo with them and that its completely normal.
Most common phrase heard in the A320 flight deck :

" what the f*ck is it doing now ? ", or maybe :

" who told the c*nt of a thing to do that "

;)

[Ralph the Bong]

This all reminds moi of 2 stories:

A mate was being given his clearence to line check as an intake pilot. The checkie said to him as the did the pre-flight on the first sector: "Ya know ya've passed already, dontcha". My mate asked why. The checkie replied " 'Cause your the first bloke I've checked and if I fail ya, everyone will say I'm a f#$%^g c$%^t.". Certainly relieved the tension.

Two friends were walking down the George st. in Sydney. They saw Rodney Rude coming in the other direction. One asked "Hey, you're Rodney Rude, are'nt you?" The response? "Yeah, I am. Now F$%^ off!". Definitely in the spirit of the personality.
:p

[amos2]

You know, I think the turkey who started this thread has got the message that his mate is a bit of a ponce and perhaps should trot off and sell used cars or something, perhaps insurance, to self funded retirees or the like!

He certainly does'nt have what it takes to cut the mustard in this business of ours!

I mean, I'm bored with this, are'nt you?

Padlock time, methinks!!! :rolleyes:

[Ralph the Bong]

Jezz Amos, we might actualy have some common ground..

[mumble xp]

interesting thread.
does anyone know the penalty for swearing over the radio? can atc get all uptight and report the a/c concerned??

[Wizofoz]

amos,

It aint "This Business" of yours any more. It has changed and continues to change as does the world since you left (I mean since you left flying, but then again...)

Your chamingly antiquated view of Aviation as a "Where men are men" frontier is long gone, particularly seeing as many of the participants are now Women!

[Capcom]

mumble xpdoes anyone know the penalty for swearing over the radio? Not sure, it is in most cases assumed to be inadvertent (Stuck PTT) or stress induced (Near cluster f**k factorhttp://www.stopstart.freeserve.co.uk/smilie/madgrin.gif). I for one would not “take a position” over the colour of the Oz vernacular, in my case, it would be tantamount to “pot calls kettle black”!.:} can atc get all uptight and report the a/c concerned?? Not on my shift Cockohttp://www.stopstart.freeserve.co.uk/smilie/smokin.gif

Classic Dick:E

Bazaar…………..http://www.stopstart.freeserve.co.uk/smilie/moreek.gif
.
.
.
.
.
Pertinent…………….http://www.stopstart.freeserve.co.uk/smilie/ssst.gif.........
.
.
.
.
.
…….but very Bazaarhttp://www.stopstart.freeserve.co.uk/smilie/eek3.gif

[126.9]

It's f:mad:king great to watch a bunch of Aussies debate the con's and pro's of their most famous trait!

F:mad:king good on ya!

:}