Renaming the company called Air Botnia

[Fadec Off]

Quite a surprise that a well established company changes its name. Air Botnia will be "Blue1" in near future.
What a times we live in aviation business- all the best for the "new" company and may the more pilots get jobs.

[frazer]

Is that info confirmed?
What's you source for that info?

[Fadec Off]

1. question: Yes, it is confirmed and will take place at the beginning of 2004. Blue tail and blue engines- same avros.

2. question: source is good ;) Tarot cards :) :)

Question: Why spend a bunch of money for that...

[JJflyer]

Joo.

Tyrolean has been renamed "Austrian Arrows" together with a new color scheme of blueish tones. Looks ugly and the name sucks. Just wondering what was wrong with the old one. Rumour has it that Austrian group paid over 2.5 million Euros for the new "disaster".

Cheers

JJ

[Flap Sup]

Umiddelbart forstår jeg ikke hvorfor navnet skal ændres.

Når en airline livery ikke har været ændret over en årrække, vil mange synes at de begynder at se gammeldags ud, og man vil derfor kunne opfatte dem som konservative (=dyre). Så jeg bebrejder ikke airlines der efter et antal år ændrer udseende, især tror jeg mange finder det betryggende, hvis de beholder "den røde tråd" i deres livery, som eks KLM gjorde det. Det er et simpelt reklame gimmick, men hvis det virker - what the heck. I store træk signalerer det "nyskabende, men også traditionelt som i kender os".

Andre airlines skifter udseende for et godt ord - de hedengangne SABENA og Premiair var gode eksempler. En overgang var to fly hos dem ikke ens. Det kan skabe forvirring hos kunderne, når de ikke kan genkende flyene, hverken på jorden, eller i eventuelle reklamer. Signalet er: vi ved ikke hvem vi er.

Hvis Air Botnia ville ud af SAS skygge, ville det være en logisk måde at skabe lidt afstand til deres puppetmaster. Samtidig vælger de så de finske farver, hvilket burde styrke dem, ihvert fald på hjemmemarkedet. Se bare på den positive effekt der tilkom Braathens, da de genindførte det norske flag på halen. Man kan diskutere om det styrker deres image overfor passagererne ude i Europa, da de kunder kender Air Botnia som en subcontractor for SAS. Hvordan stiller de sig til et selskab der lige pludselig tager afstand fra moderselskabet? Det svarer til hvis SunAir skiftede udseende, men fortsatte med BA samarbejde. Jeg tror ikke umiddelbart det fåe en positiv effekt udenfor Finland.

Godt så. Nok om udseende. Navnet. Hvad gik der galt??????
Normalt vil en virksomhed prøve at slå deres navn fast med syvtommmer søm i forbrugerens bevidsthed, for at sikre at de vil vælge lige netop dem næste gang de skal bruge et produkt.
I gamle dage dage, når en søn overtog en håndværkervirksomhed efter faderen, ændrerde man gerne navnet til xxx's efterfølger eller evt xxx og søn. Det var for at sikre kunderne at de stadig ville få det produkt de var vant til.
Hvis en virksomhed vælger at skift navn, bør der være en god grund: En skandinavisk virksomhed kan f.eks vælge at skifte navn hvis der er et æ,ø eller å i navnet, og de ikke rigtig kan profilere sig internationalt når kunderne ikke kan stave deres navn. Eller hvis de helt har ændret produktlinie. Eller prøver at få kunder til at glemme virksomhedens dårlige produkter fra fordums tid.
Men at ændre et navn på et selskab der ude i verden har et fornuftigt ry, oven i købet på et selskab der ikke er særlig kendt endnu, lyder helt forrykt i mine ører.
Gammelt navn: Air Botnia. Altså signalerer de at de flyver i den Botniske bugt, til og fra regionen. De får også et vist niveau af goodwill på hjemmemarkedet for at hedde noget der minder om "hjemme", igen ref Braathens norske flag.
Nyt navn: Blue 1. Hvad er det lige de prøver at signalere med det??
Blue: Øhh, et JetBlue datterselskab (nej, jeg ved forbrugeren ikke vil tro det, emn jeg kan ikke finde på noget bedre)?
1: Nummer eet? Ja, efter AY og SK. Så burde de hedde Blue 3???

Min umiddelbare konklusion må være noget i retning af: Nå, ja, det var måske ikke så dumt at ændre farven på flyene, men navnet?? I, guder, hvad har de dog tænkt på?

/FS

P.S.: Når alt det så er sagt, så har jeg en enkelt lille besked til management: Husk lige mig når i gennemgår ansøgningerne. Jeg vil ikke være så negativt stillet, hvis i ansætter mig ;-)

[JJflyer]

Me lennettiin aikoinaan reitteja jotka oli numeroitu Blue 1, Blue 2, Blue 3. Black 1 jne jne. Voipi olla etta mulla on karpasen aivot puhvelin kallossa, elikka olen tyhma, mutta kun en vaan tajua miksi yhtioiden joilla on hyvat varit ja nimi pitaa menna muuttamaan ne joksikin muuksi. Tyroleanin pilotteja uusi nimi ainakin jurppii, oisko samoin Botnian... Sori, Sinisen ykkosen pilottien kanssa?

Kiitti vaan ja Thunder

JJ

English translation

Used to fly routes such as Blue1, Blue2, Blue3 etc. Might be that I have a flies brain in a buffalo's head, that is I am dumb, but I cant just get it why companies that have a good name ad colors have to insist on changeing them to something different.
I know for a fact that Tyrolean pilots are pi.sed off about their new identity, would it be same with Botnia... Pardon me Blue 1 pilots.

[Flap Sup]

JJ, jeg ved du kan svensk, men jeg kan ikke finsk, så det vil være lidt urimeligt at bede mig svare på din post. Kan du kort opsummere på svensk eller engelsk?

FS

[Nick Figaretto]

Ei saa peittaä!

[Fadec Off]

If topic was started in english, it would be most reasonable, practical and pollite to continue it with the same language it was started. Could you, Flap Sup make your one shortly in english. Hey! and no hard feelings indeed. That's about it and back to orginal...

Terrible name indeed and why to spend so much money for it? Everybody, even AirBotnia and especially SAS are saving money on other hand and another one is a big spender... strange.

Tack och förlåt

Niin ja JJ, eka kappale ei ollut sulle... thunder vaan ;)

[Flap Sup]

Det var nu meget bevidst at jeg skrev på dansk, eftersom vi er det nordiske forum.

Skal KF så også skifte callsign? Fra "Botnia" til "Blue" måske?

[Fadec Off]

Botnialla on tänään ollut kai pari lehdistötilaisuutta joten varmaan iltauutisissa salaisuuksien verhoa taas raotetaan lisää. Kai ne julkistavat jo aiemmin IATAlta haettujaSLOTteja mm. Pietariin, Moskovaan ja Hampuriin. Ehkäpä kenties vieläkin lisää tai sitten jotain aivan muuta, kotomaassa tuskin alkavat riehumaan enemmän kuin nyt. silti aika jännä veto SASilta. Olisi odottanut että ne olisi tehneet saman jo 1998 kun ostivat koko yhtiön.
No busines on busines ja Mooses on Mooses.
Kielipolitiikka sucks. Pitää varmaan häipyä sinne omalle foorumille ajoissa ennen kun potkitaan pois. Mulla on ehdot CRM:ssä tässä suhteessa ;)

[AUTO/MAN]

If topic was started in english, it would be most reasonable, practical and pollite to continue it with the same language it was started
Caught in Your own trap there Fadec?... ;)

[JJflyer]

I Would thing that Fadec Off was trying to prove a point with his last post written in th language of gods:p

I do speak Swedish. But after having lived in a non Swedish speaking enviroment for the last 7 years, and not having studied the language since 1991, my ability to use that language is somewhat limited. I do try and read short posts with relative ease. However longer posts, especially in Danish, well I have no patience to read all the way through them as it taked too long.

Therefore I suggest that if English is used in the initial post we continue using that language throughout that thread, but should one use another language, also provide a translation to a common language. Any takers on that?

JJ

[Fadec Off]

I agree JJ,

Of course one can say that put all the english post to other forums but, since the great nordic pilots are so few and our news and happenings do not intrest so many in "public forums" I have thought that I would be nice to keep conversation here where it hurts ;)
Unfortunately I can deal with english better that scandinaviska and that why I have to use it in NORDIC NON-ENGLISH forum, sorry folks for that but otherwise we can call it a day.
I was not fallen to my own trap like JJ mentioned, I just wanted to prove my point that if I was using one of the nordic non-english language, many of you, my fellow pilots could not follow the conversation.
:uhoh:

[gothammer]

Tässäpä taas yksi syy *puolustaa* pakko-Ruotsia :8 ;)

-g-

[Techman]

Det lader til at halv-russerne med deres ungarske dialekt har overtaget forummet.

[JJflyer]

Not very nice. We are not Swedes nor are we Russians.
Personally I find it actually quite insulting to call as half-russians with Hungarian dialect neither which is correct.

[Flap Sup]

JJ,

mon ikke det var ment i en god tone? Du skulle bare høre hvad vi danskere kalder svenskerne, eller endnu værre, hvad svenskerne kalder nordmændene :D

[Fadec Off]

Even if we face the facts that we dealing with The Great Danes( I do not mean those dogs, or do I) whom magnificent country I fly over and pass less than five minutes or even better, people from nation who has right to exist only because those half russians have fought their wars during the last centuries.

I'm pissed off.

Open the ****ing own topic for that **** above, this one is for conversation about the new name of Air Botnia/Blue1
:mad:

Denmark- the northest country of Africa

[Techman]

Fadec, for mig er det ligegyldigt om du skriver på finsk eller engelsk.
Jeg fatter alligevel ikke hvad du mener.:confused:

[Fadec Off]

Jeg fatter alligevel ikke hvad du mener.

Why am I not surprised.... :)

[Techman]

Fadec, selvom du tydeligvis har opfattet mit sidste indlæg som personlig kritik, så var det nu ikke ment som sådant.
Det var såmænd kun en konstatering af, at jeg simpelthen ikke forstod hvad du mente med dit indlæg.
Selvom du nu har redigeret det, fatter jeg stadig ikke hvad du prøver at sige?. :confused:

[bluesafrica]

Techman
I wonder what is bothering you about Finns? Wonder if there is more Danish speaking folks around than Finnish around... By the way do you know from where Danes came from?
Blues:E

[Techman]

Der er nu intet ved finner der generer mig, men jeg kan ved gud ikke forstå hvad det er Fadec prøver at sige.
Er det skrevet i en eller anden form for finsk kode, eller er det bare meget dårligt engelsk?.

Er der nogen der har en Suomi Decoder Ring?.....eller en ordbog.

[Techman]

Er der nogen her, der ikke er hyper-sensitiv, som kan decifrere Fadecs indlæg?.
Efter at have læst det for 117. gang, giver det stadig ingen mening.

[Fadec Off]

Techman, If you have something to say to me personally, Please do it in PM for example. That way you do not bother the others. If you do so, please do it in some civilized language what I can understand. English in this case, would be the most practical one. To keep it short and just to make it easy to you to understand:

I can not understand Danish, nor I can speak or write it.

Was that too much for your excellent skill in English. You must be so good at it that you do not even bother to use it at all. Thing what you are good at is marking the others, but try to esteem the others also and you will find the world nicer place to live. If you are not in strike...;)

Orginally topic is gone, long live this BS.

I'm sorry for all of us.


Ps. some told me that you cannot win the Danes. I do not agree, Germans did it in five days or was it minutes.

[Clarence Oveur]

I can't make much sense of Fadec Off's previous post either. But I'm sure there's an insult in there somewhere.

Fadec Off, your written english doesn't exactly facilitate the understanding of the message you are trying to convey.

I hope you can accept this as a bit of constructive criticism and not a personal attack.

[bluesafrica]

Clarence Ouver,
If you could read danish from Techman's messages you would see the reason why he got so upset. Looks like Techman has something against the finns. Maybe some of them run away with his wife...
Blues:E

[Clarence Oveur]

Bluesafrica,

I do understand danish, quite well infact and I don't see what there is to be upset about?.

What I do see is that Techman several times let it be known that he doesn't understand Fadec Off's post, and quite frankly neither do I.

Instead of an explanation or clarification as to what Fadec was trying to say, all that was offered were insults and what have you.
Probably because nobody else could understand the post either. :rolleyes:

[Fadec Off]

As I have noticed, long sentences make life difficult and for that reason I stay on the short clauses instead.

1. I do not understand danish

2. I understand english and finnish

3. I tried. To keep this topic. In english. So everybody could follow it.

4. I suggested that topic is continued same language it was started at.

5. I was insulted as "half-russian". Bad. Very bad. To Finn.

6. I still have mentioned. Several times. I do not understand danish language.

7. I am open for critic. Even constructive one;)

8. I insulted techman/flap sup.

9. Called them dogs.

10. I said they live. In the country. Which is so small. That I can fly over. In less than 5 minutes.

11. I highlighted that: we Finns have fought wars (war: open armed conflict between two or more parties, nations or states) against Russia.

12. I still write in english and maybe, just maybe somebody will again, answer me in danish. ( that was long, sorry. And it even had two commas.)

13. My english, finnish nor any language I use is perfect.

14. That is all.

15. Thanks.

16. Let's go back to another topic and ruin it.:E

[vikingdk]

Indeed Fadec..this is turning into an embarresment..even more so, because the finns tend to forget who helped them against the russians in the great pre-WW2 winterwar fought on finnish soil...danish troops...check your history books

[Dolcevita]

Well, well...

Air Botnia is changing it's name to "Blue1". And what the hell this topic has in common with different sortsof BS posts you are feeding in?

This is an issue of CRM. Please tell me if I'm wrong, but I think that most of the Danish air carriers created their SOPs in english as well as other "civilized" carriers in the world. So you don't seem to pay much attention to these terms and to use them effectively, to COMMUNICATE (and avoid errors). I won't start this all over again, but one thing is fact in this conversation. Fadec Off started it in english. That's a fact. And every reasonable person here could use his/her essential knowledge how to communicate with each other. Because we all know the importance of this matter, I will not go further...

And now let's go and see what happens when we forget that reasonable conversation. I think that
1. Denmark was conquered in one day
2. I see hell of a lot drug abusers in Denmark
3. Nothing except ATC separation works at CPH
4. Some swedish colleagues of mine (most of them instructors at SASFA) told that compared to swedish pilots Danes are below average
5. BS, BS, BS
6. Blaah Blaah, Blaah

You see? It's a bull****, but equally valid with your "finns are russians" and other that sort of crap.

Now, pls, prove me I'm wrong and continue writing about original topic "AirBotnia to change it's name to Blue1". In english. Or start another topic in danish. Thanks, and no hard feelings.

[Fadec Off]

Hi folks,

This topic is very good example of lack of communication. What we got here, is a failure to communicate. Let's all swallow our prides and stop this BS. It is amazing how the few little things start a war. This is a small one and in bigger scale same thing has happened several times in the world we live in. I, you and everybody here are those we should blame.

Now it is time to lick the wounds we have and let the smoke settle down. Let's just pick up our professinalism and carry on. I'm sorry for this. Also I feel sorry for me that I lost my temper so badly. I'm sorry for insulted ones.
That was too many sorries but anyway... ;)

Now if the moderator is so nice and close this thread, please.

Let's go to the Flap Sups topic PART II

Fadec