Red Arrows accident Jersey

[Taildragger]

Just been announced on BBC 2 News that a Red Arrows Aircraft has been involved in an accident at Jersey today. Both people involved were "Shaken" but nothing worse than that.
Anybody have further details.?

[HectorPascal]

Try: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/3093782.stm

[pilotwolf]

...seem to remember there isn't a great deal of space before the cliff edge above St Ouen bay?

Wonder what was going through their minds?! :cool:

[Flap40]

Well where do you think that they are based? There were certainly 11 red hawks on the pan and at least one in the hangar when I was there on Saturday.

[amanoffewwords]

From the horse's mouth (http://www.raf.mod.uk/reds/news.html) - looks like a minor mishap

[four_two]

Do you have to be so cryptic Lost ThePicture? What exactly are you saying?

According to the report:
"Wing Commander Bill Ramsey ........

... said he thought the accident was caused by a minor engineering fault. "
It is possible you know, these things do happen.

[Obs cop]

Nice research LostThePicture ;)

The Red Arrows have been based at Scampton since 2001:ok:

[WorkingHard]

Well done to the pilot - no one was hurt. I am intiqued by the apparent discrepancy between the description from http://www.raf.mod.uk/reds/news.html and the BBC photo. Is it simply a case of Military jounalism trying to put a brave face on it or is the photo unreal?

[geedee011]

All 11 looked ok when they overflew Northampton enroute.
Perhaps Jersey is just a tad too small for an 11 ship stream landing?::eek:

[pilot_will]

Glad to hear nobody was hurt.

Got a nice surprise when landing back from Paphos into Exeter on the 27th aug. vacated the runway and saw the Red arrows parked. Then as I was walking into the arrivals, saw them takeoff :cool:

[Wedge]

You are right pilotwolf, there is not a lot of space between the end of 27 and the road, then the cliff face - sounds pretty hairy, especially since there was heavy building machinery about, and as you can see from the BBC pic the Hawk was eventually stopped by a large bank of earth.

Good to hear both on board were OK though.

[Minesagrolsch]

geedee 011 :

Perhaps Jersey is just a tad too small for an 11 ship stream landing?:


as the runway is a tad short,couldn't they forego the slick antics and land one at a time like the rest of the world ?


wedge :


You are right pilotwolf, there is not a lot of space between the end of 27 and the road, then the cliff face - sounds pretty hairy, especially since there was heavy building machinery about, and as you can see from the BBC pic the Hawk was eventually stopped by a large bank of earth.


the earth bank was only constructed 24 hours before the Red's arrival.Good job,otherwise the aircarft would have plopped straight over onto the golf couse/beach below !


From the RAF website :



Hawk incident at Jersey.
A Red Arrows' Hawk aircraft developed a minor problem on landing which led to the aircraft leaving the side of the runway onto the grass at Jersey Airport today.

The pilot, Flight Lieutenant Jez Griggs, carried out the standard safety procedures and both he and his engineer, Corporal Harry Harrison, were unhurt. An investigation has already begun into the incident.

The Red Arrows intend to carry out their display at Guernsey and Jersey on Thursday as planned. The Royal Air Force would like to thank the Jersey Airport authorities for their prompt and efficient assistance.

09 September 2003



Mmmm,

"leaving the side of the runway onto the grass"

Rather understates the fact the it went off the end and down a hill with nothing to stop it than a 1-day old earth bank.
The Wing Commander being interviewed on local tv was extremely embarassed when interviewed !

[illsaywhen]

The local television station showed a tractor pulling the plane back on to the runway. All was going well until the bar broke resulting in the aircraft going backwards and damaging it's stb elevator! Woops:mad:

[Chesty Morgan]

Happen to know very experienced ex RAF fighter pilot and test pilot who said the Red Arrows are a bunch of pansies who couldn't hack the front line and can't really fly anyway.!!!:cool:

[FJJP]

CM, you, of course, have served front line and been shot at - you must have been to agree with drivel that your prejudicd ex-fighter pilot mate uttered. How'd you like to work every day throughout the display season and spend mucho nights away from home, including weekends? And of course, the leave ban throughout the season, including the entire kids summer holiday...

No, I'm not ex-Red, or a particular admirer, but they do a great PR job, before going BACK to the front line.

[T_Handle]

Chesty... my mate says you are a pillock and can't hack a decent constructive reply!!! He said it so it must be true!


There I thick I managed to create an equally totally useless and pointless post just for chesty's benefit!

As I understand it they didn't do a 11 stream landing but did 3-ships (and yes I know 3 doesn't divide into 11 equally - before some niibbing blunty pionts it out!)

In my opinion the boys do a great job and are fine pilots. It is a pleasure when ever we work with them.

T:ok:p

[woodpecker]

From my recollections of "Performance A" Jersey is the classic balanced field with rather a steep over-run! To think BA once considered operating Tristars to the island!

[MadsDad]

As for the 'bunch of pansies' comment I have heard similar from front-line pilots. I also recall the wife of a GR4 pilot quoting her husband 'the fighter guys are ok at swanning round having thier photos taken but we just go out and make history' and a Tornado PR pilot saying 'its ok for the bombers but we have to go in the next day on our own to photograph the results. And they tend to be upset with us by then'. Anyone notice a pattern?

As for the arrows (and before anyone shouts at me I don't know which is why I'm asking) I was told that a lot of the pilots are recruited from the training staff at Valley. This presumably leads to the possibility that someone could go through training at Valley, be recruited there as a 'creamy' instructor (6 months training + 2 year tour) and then go into the arrows (3 year tour) so could end up with 5 1/2 years without going through the 'weapons and tactics' course, let alone front line service. True or false?

[Chris Kebab]

MadsDad - your para two is complete nonsence. They have all done fast-jet front line tours.

An awful lot of "my mate told me" on this thread....

[MadsDad]

Thanks Chris.

I know the creamies exist (I've met some) and the recruiting more from Valley (although not exclusively obviously) story seemed to make sense (at a minimum the Valley pilots would be current on the Hawk, as opposed to last having flown one a few years before, which should give some sort of edge in the type of trials shown on the box the other week). The rest was my extrapolation from that but I didn't know. And if you don't know it makes sense to ask someone who does.

[maxy101]

Instead of us all spouting off uninformed, why not check out the Arrows website that tells us all what these guys did before? It´s at

[jerseymilkman]

...I think you may find they had a hydraulic failure which led to the 'event'...

...also, for those of you who don't know Jersey too well, he was nowhere near the end of the runway, the cliff OR the golf course...

...entire event occurred within the airfield boundary and was really a 'non-event' other than the guys did a good job to get it down safely...

(I will never get a job with the press if I keep on like this!)

JM

[Minesagrolsch]

milky,


...also, for those of you who don't know Jersey too well, he was nowhere near the end of the runway, the cliff OR the golf course...


Admittedly my knowledge of Jersey is very sketchy,having only lived in the Channel Islands for 35 years !!
So where exactly did the hawk stop ?
Was it off to the north of 27 ?
Local news said that the pilot steered towards the bank of earth to stop himself !!

[CaptainFillosan]

Well they would wouldn't they! :mad:

Anyway, sad to see what appears a tiny bit of the colour green on here.

[Ali Barber]

Last time I watched the Reds land a couple of years ago, No 10 in a stream landing lost his brakes. They don't use a slow lane on the runway but go left/right side alternately. Was very impressive (and professional) to watch No 10 bolt through the middle to set up for an individual landing that he managed to stop on the runway.

I would find what they do boring after the novelty had worn off (about a year?). I preferred the variety of front-line flying but each to their own and, like FJJP said, they are good for PR.

[The Swinging Monkey]

Chesty,

I regret to say Sir, you are an ar$e.

I am no great lover of the Reds, but I do have immence respect for them. They are a great bunch of blokes, and I have the honour of knowing several of them personally.

Sadly, your comments are typical of 'ex-fighter jocks' and only go to show how sad you lot are. Fighter pilots, hum lets see........
Gulf war 1 - No fighter jocks
Bosnia - No fighter jocks again!
Kosovo - Guess what? yep, no fighter jocks
Gulf war 2 - yep, got it in one - NO fighter jocks
(maybe they've all gone to join the Reds!)

Mind you FJJP, don't go over the top about them my dear chap! Yes, it must be absolute $hit living in all those 5* hotels, visiting all those wonderful places, all the freebies they get - oh and getting the wife and girlfriend flown out free to those places!! Yes, it must be hell for them, still it beats a tent in Oman!
And as for leave? What's that? ask anyone serving on the front line for the last 3 -4 years, they'll tell you what leave is all about!

The Reds do a fantastic PR job for the RAF, and long may it continue. Fighyter jocks? go find yourself a real job somewhere, preferably with a 'bucket & spade' airline!

Regards to all
The Swinging Monkey
'Caruthers, is it time for my afternoon tipple yet?'

[FFP]

Hear hear !

Let's not forget these guys apply for the post, let's face it, it's not a job one gets "joed" for !!!

I think they do a great job. Had a run in with a now ex red a while back (he was an ar$e and being a pr!ck at the time !) but from the guys on this years team there are some good lads that I know.

A few of the lads do come from Valley but following front line tours, usually single seat.

I do agree with Ali that it would, I'd imagine, become repetative after a while but then so does working in an office and I know which I'd prefer :ok:

[FEBA]

Ali Barber -
They don't use a slow lane on the runway but go left/right side alternately
I take it that there must have been something parked on the hard shoulder then !!!

A mate of mine works for JCB. He told me they had received an order from the Red's to replace hawk tyres with tracks for off runway work. he's a good mate so it must be true :E

FEBA

[Grob Driver]

Mr Monkey…

While I agree with most of what you’ve said, you know as well as I do that they don’t get their wives or girlfriends flown out too all those places… That’s just utter rubbish!

Still, they do a fantastic job, they’re a great bunch of guys and I have immense respect from them (even if I do think they’ve got themselves a cushy number for 3 years…). At the end of the day, the reason they are chosen to represent to Royal Air Force, is because they are very experienced and competent pilots…

Oh, and one last thing… Most of the Reds are mud movers, not fighter jocks!… I’ll get my coat!

Cheers
Grob Driver

[The Swinging Monkey]

Grob driver,

You keep telling me you are far to busy at work for........?
so how come your not in that little Pop-Pop machine of yours flying about anyway ??!

As for the Reds taking their wives away - I beg to differ! I didn't say thay go everywhere with them, but they do get to go away with them to some of the more exotic places, we both know that.

No complaints about that, but whats good for one..??....et al old boy. Also, you are correct about most of them being Muds, the only time the fighte jocks get that close to the ground is take off and landing! They need a good 20 - 30k beneath them! (Maybe a bit less in an F-3!!)

Maybe we can have a chat about all this at Leuchars this weekend eh? although we'll have to watch out for all those 'fighter jocks'

Kind regards

The Swinging Monkey
'Caruthers, send the Grob Driver a large one'

[BoeingMEL]

Come on guys.... the best-trained and most professional aviators in the world bickering and gossiping like schoolgirls...he said...she said... blah blah blah! bm

[glider insider]

admittedly a bit off thread, but


"Hello, Im XXXX, red 4"

and the Air Trafficer replies

"Yes, Im XXXX, talkdown 2"

made me laugh anyway

[Wycombe]

Just back from a weeks hols in Jersey this morning.

Watched them depart this morning after their 4 day stay, Albert arriving at around the same time to pick up their stuff.

Whilst taxiing out for departure on 09, noticed the position of the aforementioned earth bank - quite displaced to the S of the threshold and well away from the "cliff" that drops to St Ouen's Bay below (assuming I was looking at the correct earth bank, of course)

Great to see them displaying against the backdrop of St Aubyn's Bay on Thurs pm (pity that the late morning Guernsey show had to be scrubbed due Wx).

To pick up on an earlier comment - BA did operate an L1011 to EGJJ - once - to clear a backlog of EGLL pax after one of those foggy Jersey days - I was in Guernsey on holiday at the time (late 70's, don't remember the exact Year) and remember seeing it reported on the local news

[Smokie]

Seem to remember an Ex Cook getting commissioned , flew "Frightnings" then the Gnat and Hawk at Kemble.

Last I heard was he went to the "Cloggies " to fly F-16s and come to think of it, did a spectacular Beat -Up at Kemble in said F-16.
They were the days ... :ok:

[coley chaos]

I know its rather late in the day, but judgeing by the eath bank in a photo, perhaps the pilot thought he was back in a harrier and for one confused moment thought he was going up,up and away on his ski ramp! mind you ski ramps are`nt brown. mmmmmmm:hmm:

[Megaton]

And he's never been a Harrier pilot but apart from that......