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strawberry Ribena 3rd May 2023 21:27


Originally Posted by laviation (Post 11429305)
I don’t know what they’re trying to do but it certainly won’t work without a package operation like TUI or the good VFR knowledge of BA!

i reckon they are jumping in on the fly+ cruise market. Tui (Any cruise liner) will probably buy up a lot of the seats.

Wycombe 4th May 2023 07:47


Originally Posted by strawberry Ribena (Post 11429711)
i reckon they are jumping in on the fly+ cruise market. Tui (Any cruise liner) will probably buy up a lot of the seats.

Could well be, TUI haven't had a great year performance-wise on their big contract to the Carribean for P&O Cruises, for example.

JW95 4th May 2023 10:57


Originally Posted by davidjohnson6 (Post 11429221)
Apologies if already mentioned, but the Norse website now shows new routes from Gatwick to Barbados, and both Kingston and Montego Bay in Jamaica. All routes start late October 2023

Interesting choice of routes, although I can see the sense in them as 'winter sun' destinations which could allow Norse to improve its a/c utilisation and profitability in the winter. Will be interesting to see how BA respond to this. I doubt VS will bat an eyelid since they won't be returning to LGW in the near future.

intortola 4th May 2023 11:24


Originally Posted by davidjohnson6 (Post 11429221)
Apologies if already mentioned, but the Norse website now shows new routes from Gatwick to Barbados, and both Kingston and Montego Bay in Jamaica. All routes start late October 2023


Love for them to get the cruise contract back on the SJU route. Flew it with Norwegian quite a few times and was always full. Very popular with people living and working in the NE Caribbean. Hope it had the yield to make a comeback at some point.

JW95 6th May 2023 12:11

Qatar Airways
 
As per Aero Routes, QR will be reducing LGW-DOH service to 10 weekly from 1st December, unsure if this is a temporary reduction from the existing 2 daily service. One nice change however is that the daily 788 is being upgauged to the 789, and LGW will also see the A359 3 times per week :) It'll be nice seeing the A350 back at LGW, I believe QR will be the sole operator of the A350-900 at LGW until MK commence their daily service to MRU in October :)

Charlie Roy 14th May 2023 13:31

6 or 7 aircraft inbound to Gatwick diverting to other airports right now (Sunday 14/5 2pm-3pm). What's going on?

Stein7b 14th May 2023 13:41

Drone activity apparently.

davidjohnson6 14th May 2023 19:39

https://news.sky.com/story/gatwick-a...drone-12880784

N707ZS 14th May 2023 22:40

They didn't find it again.

Cautious Optimist 15th May 2023 05:28

Is it just me or is it only ever Gatwick affected by drones? Don't recall any other airports shutting down for this reason but I stand to be corrected

GrahamK 15th May 2023 07:03

Edinburgh was affected the other night, and Dublin has had a big problem with drones too.

JW95 21st May 2023 13:40

China Eastern
 
Unsure if this has been flagged up, but China Eastern Airlines will be returning to LGW from later next month to Shanghai with the A330. Booking now live on their website :)

Good to see more airlines resuming services to LGW, hopefully this will continue and more are to come :)

Sotonsean 21st May 2023 17:02


Originally Posted by JW95 (Post 11438075)
Unsure if this has been flagged up, but China Eastern Airlines will be returning to LGW from later next month to Shanghai with the A330. Booking now live on their website :)

Good to see more airlines resuming services to LGW, hopefully this will continue and more are to come :)

Great to see China Eastern Airlines return to LGW with a resumption of service from Shanghai.

I've seen this flight several times on the LGW arrivals/departures board but shown as cancelled. I have noticed that this often happens when airlines are due to announce new routes.

China Southern Airlines from Wuhan has also appeared recently on the LGW arrivals/departures boards. I wonder if China Southern Airlines will be the next long haul airline to announce service to LGW.

JW95 23rd May 2023 11:07


Originally Posted by Sotonsean (Post 11438144)
Great to see China Eastern Airlines return to LGW with a resumption of service from Shanghai.

I've seen this flight several times on the LGW arrivals/departures board but shown as cancelled. I have noticed that this often happens when airlines are due to announce new routes.

China Southern Airlines from Wuhan has also appeared recently on the LGW arrivals/departures boards. I wonder if China Southern Airlines will be the next long haul airline to announce service to LGW.

Indeed :) LGW now has a nice mix of airlines that mirror the mix pre-covid up to 2019/early 2020 :) It certainly has come a long way since it was on its knees when all the travel restrictions were in place. Hopefully more are in the pipeline :) IIRC I think China Southern were initially planning on moving the route to Wuhan from LHR to LGW prior the pandemic breaking out? Could certainly see them making an entrance to LGW. Cathay I think will also be looking at resuming LGW either this year or next, as they rebuild their network.

I also predict that Delta will expand presence at Gatwick, depending on JetBlue's expansion at LGW. For instance, I can see them launching BOS to compete with B6 on the route. This was a route that Delta had planned for LGW originally before Covid hit. Sadly, I don't think we will see VS back at LGW for some time, which is a shame.

Sotonsean 24th May 2023 04:40

China Southern Airlines did indeed announced Wuhan to LGW prior to the pandemic. Very much a potential airline for LGW.

Delta as you rightly pointed out planned to operate BOS to LGW prior to to the pandemic. I agree with your assumption regarding the reasons why they might eventually fly that route.

I also agree with your comments and the reasons regarding the return of CX to LGW

On another note.

​​​​​​Air Asia X have gone completely silent on their proposed return to LGW with their planned KUL-DXB-LGW routing. I was very skeptical from the very beginning when it was originally stated that the airline was planning to make a possible return to LGW. Although it would make a great addition to the ever growing long haul portfolio at LGW I still remain very skeptical of the return of Air Asia X.

On another note.

The newly formed Ghanaian flag carrier Ghana Airways are to receive the first out of of three B789s on order from Boeing in the Q3 of 2023. The airline has stated that they intend on initially using their B789s on opening up long haul routes from the Ghanaian capital of Accra to London LHR and New York JFK. If the airline are not able to obtain slots at LHR I'm certain that Ghana Airways could well be another potential future long haul airline at LGW.

During 2022 the Tanzanian flag carrier Air Tanzania announced that they were intending to resume flights from DAR to LGW again once that the airline can obtain slots. Air Tanzania had obtained slots for LGW in 2019 for a resumption of their Dar Es Salaam flights which were supposed to commence in 2020. Obviously the pandemic changed those plans and those slots at LGW were lost after three years and the airline has recently had to reapply for new ones.

Air Tanzania are due to receive their third B788 added to the fleet soon giving them a total of three. Air Tanzania have also just recently received a new build B767F direct from Boeing with cargo expansion on the airline's radar. Air Tanzania could well be another potential future long haul airline at LGW.

Air Tanzania would be a very welcome return to LGW. On a personal note I can remember being on the viewing terrace at LGW in July 1980 when the first ever Air Tanzania Boeing 707 landed on it's inaugural flight from Dar Es Salaam. The livery looked great on the B707 along with their leased Ethiopian B767s. Their current livery looks great on their B788s and hopefully we will eventually see them at LGW.

JW95 24th May 2023 09:34


Originally Posted by Sotonsean (Post 11439429)
China Southern Airlines did indeed announced Wuhan to LGW prior to the pandemic. Very much a potential airline for LGW.

Delta as you rightly pointed out planned to operate BOS to LGW prior to to the pandemic. I agree with your assumption regarding the reasons why they might eventually fly that route.

I also agree with your comments and the reasons regarding the return of CX to LGW

On another note.

​​​​​​Air Asia X have gone completely silent on their proposed return to LGW with their planned KUL-DXB-LGW routing. I was very skeptical from the very beginning when it was originally stated that the airline was planning to make a possible return to LGW. Although it would make a great addition to the ever growing long haul portfolio at LGW I still remain very skeptical of the return of Air Asia X.

On another note.

The newly formed Ghanaian flag carrier Ghana Airways are to receive the first out of of three B789s on order from Boeing in the Q3 of 2023. The airline has stated that they intend on initially using their B789s on opening up long haul routes from the Ghanaian capital of Accra to London LHR and New York JFK. If the airline are not able to obtain slots at LHR I'm certain that Ghana Airways could well be another potential future long haul airline at LGW.

During 2022 the Tanzanian flag carrier Air Tanzania announced that they were intending to resume flights from DAR to LGW again once that the airline can obtain slots. Air Tanzania had obtained slots for LGW in 2019 for a resumption of their Dar Es Salaam flights which were supposed to commence in 2020. Obviously the pandemic changed those plans and those slots at LGW were lost after three years and the airline has recently had to reapply for new ones.

Air Tanzania are due to receive their third B788 added to the fleet soon giving them a total of three. Air Tanzania have also just recently received a new build B767F direct from Boeing with cargo expansion on the airline's radar. Air Tanzania could well be another potential future long haul airline at LGW.

Air Tanzania would be a very welcome return to LGW. On a personal note I can remember being on the viewing terrace at LGW in July 1980 when the first ever Air Tanzania Boeing 707 landed on it's inaugural flight from Dar Es Salaam. The livery looked great on the B707 along with their leased Ethiopian B767s. Their current livery looks great on their B788s and hopefully we will eventually see them at LGW.

RE. Air Asia, I agree with you- I don't see them returning to LGW, or the London market anymore. Passengers now have a greater choice of full service carriers when travelling long haul to Asia, and I don't think a marginally cheaper fare is likely to get customers to switch to Air Asia, especially when you consider that extras such as luggage, meals, entertainment etc have to be paid for on Air Asia. From a passenger point of view, these are important factors when considering long haul flying. Scoot have also tried something similar flying LGW-SIN via BKK with their 788s and that didn't last long, just 8 months I believe? So low cost, long haul flying to Asia is a tough nut to crack, and like Scoot, I think Air Asia would struggle making this work.

The others you highlight (Air Tanzania, Ghana Airways) I can see entering LGW at some stage, dependent on LHR slot (un)availability and pricing.

True Blue 24th May 2023 15:19

So Gatwick has another new route starting end of October, BA to Accra 3 weekly. It is available for booking now.

vectisman 24th May 2023 15:33


Originally Posted by True Blue (Post 11439747)
So Gatwick has another new route starting end of October, BA to Accra 3 weekly. It is available for booking now.

This in addition to daily flights from Heathrow.

JW95 24th May 2023 16:44


Originally Posted by True Blue (Post 11439747)
So Gatwick has another new route starting end of October, BA to Accra 3 weekly. It is available for booking now.

Interesting new addition to Gatwick :) I wonder if this is to deter Ghana Airways from coming in?

Sotonsean 24th May 2023 18:27


Originally Posted by JW95 (Post 11439791)
Interesting new addition to Gatwick :) I wonder if this is to deter Ghana Airways from coming in?

Although it's a great addition to LGW I don't see British Airways flying to Accra deterring Ghana Airways from establishing their own flights.

Ghana Airways has three B789s on order and they have maintained from the very start that they eventually intend flying them from Accra to London and New York.

Before the pandemic British Airways had previously announced that they intended to move service to Accra from LHR to LGW. I believe that this decision was overturned because of uproar from the Government of Ghana who demanded a link to LHR.

Regarding that last sentence. It makes me wonder if Ghana Airways will actually be able to obtain slots at LHR. If they can't they will obviously have to use LGW. The Government of Ghana has changed since they made a fuss about British Airways intending to transfer their Accra flight to LGW.

With British Airways announcing service from LGW to ACC running alongside their existing LHR flights I don't think it will deter Ghana Airways from eventually resuming their own service to London, whether that be to LGW or LHR.

VickersVicount 28th May 2023 12:11

Ho Chi Minh didn’t last long.. #Bamboo

Sotonsean 28th May 2023 20:47


Originally Posted by VickersVicount (Post 11441910)
Ho Chi Minh didn’t last long.. #Bamboo


This hasn't really come across as a surprise to me personally. As much as I wouldn't want the airline to leave LGW altogether, I wouldn't hedge my bets on Bamboo Airways even flying to Europe in the future.

​​​Hanoi being the capital city of Vietnam was always going to be more popular than Ho Chi Minh City. With Bamboo airways in a precarious way financially and the fact that the airline has a very small fleet of B789s perhaps the aircraft used to fly to LGW would be better placed elsewhere on their network.


Downwind_Left 28th May 2023 20:55


Originally Posted by Sotonsean (Post 11442078)
This hasn't really come across as a surprise to me personally. As much as I wouldn't want the airline to leave LGW altogether, I wouldn't hedge my bets on Bamboo Airways even flying to Europe in the future.

​​​Hanoi being the capital city of Vietnam was always going to be more popular than Ho Chi Minh City. With Bamboo airways in a precarious way financially and the fact that the airline has a very small fleet of B789s perhaps the aircraft used to fly to LGW would be better placed elsewhere on their network.

That isn’t what’s happening though… Bamboo are dropping Ho Chi Minh City, but increasing Hanoi to twice weekly. So their frequency and capacity at Gatwick is unchanged. Probably more viable to serve Hanoi twice weekly than both destinations with a single frequency.

AirportPlanner1 29th May 2023 06:53


Originally Posted by Sotonsean (Post 11442078)
​​​Hanoi being the capital city of Vietnam was always going to be more popular than Ho Chi Minh City.

Really? Isn’t that like saying Madrid is always going to be more popular than Barcelona?!

Probably the reason is more likely that because HCMC is much better served the yields are lower, a weekly flight is always going to be a struggle against EK, QR, TK etc.

JW95 29th May 2023 11:17

Bamboo Airways
 
Given that they've only got 3 789s in the fleet currently (albeit with another 10 on order), it probably makes more commercial sense to raise LGW-HAN frequency to twice weekly from the current 1 weekly flight whilst unfortunately having to drop the SGN route (although hopefully it may return as more 787s are delivered). What I think is more likely is that Bamboo Airways will struggle against Vietnam Airlines who will be increasing LHR-HAN to daily from October versus just a twice weekly LGW-HAN flight.

Skipness One Foxtrot 29th May 2023 15:07


Originally Posted by JW95 (Post 11442372)
Given that they've only got 3 789s in the fleet currently (albeit with another 10 on order), it probably makes more commercial sense to raise LGW-HAN frequency to twice weekly from the current 1 weekly flight whilst unfortunately having to drop the SGN route (although hopefully it may return as more 787s are delivered). What I think is more likely is that Bamboo Airways will struggle against Vietnam Airlines who will be increasing LHR-HAN to daily from October versus just a twice weekly LGW-HAN flight.

Bamboo are in a financially precarious place, one of their B787s was impounded for a time for non payment of fees. If you want to go direct, Vietnam Airlines has a much higher frequency having worked some magic to hang onto their position at LHR. The idea that they're going to end up with 10 B787s as things stand looks unlikely sadly. I think they're under-capitalised at the mo.

JW95 30th May 2023 08:55

Global Airlines
 
Being reported on Airliners.net and elsewhere that a new start up, called Global Airlines has just purchased their first aircraft, an A380, for use on London-US routes commencing in spring next year. According to their website (https://www.globalairlines.com/about), they plan on acquiring 3 more A380s, if not more. Presumably if (and a big if) and when this ever takes off, LGW would be their choice of London airport?

I can't help but think that this venture does remind me a little of what European Aviation Air Charter (EAAC) tried doing by buying ex-BA 742s in 2002 and going long haul to the US and Canada (besides additional charter work), but that didn't last long and they ended up losing £££££. I never flew with them, but I think they did long haul from LGW as well as from BOH (their main base) and MAN?

Skipness One Foxtrot 3rd Jun 2023 01:52

Air China's PEK-LGW service seems to have returned to LHR now that BA have relaunched service on LHR-PKX.
Replaced by Air China opening PVG-LGW as PVG-LHR ends? Seems odd with both BA and VS operating out of LHR for Air China to move PVG to Gatwick?

Vokes55 3rd Jun 2023 05:42

Do you think a Chinese state owned airline are that bothered about the competition? They already have the competitive edge over BA and VS as their flights are two hours shorter in each direction.

Skipness One Foxtrot 3rd Jun 2023 10:55


Originally Posted by Vokes55 (Post 11444999)
Do you think a Chinese state owned airline are that bothered about the competition? They already have the competitive edge over BA and VS as their flights are two hours shorter in each direction.

They had to return to Gatwick due to the complexity of the bilateral as BA were off the route. And yes, they do have a preference to serve LHR, I am just trying to understand the current situation.They didn't originally leave LGW and build up 5 daily LHR slots by accident now did they?

Vokes55 4th Jun 2023 12:07

I don’t know. Shanghai was served from LGW until March 2020, so this is more or less back to how they operated before Covid, minus Chengdu from LHR.

What I do know though is that, bilateral agreements aside, Air China couldn’t give a hoot about the competition.

AvGeek1 9th Jun 2023 14:35

According to the slot report, the below airlines have applied for slots for W23:

Azerbaijan Airlines (from Baku)
Ethiopian Airlines (from Addis Ababa)
ITA Airways (from Rome or Milan?)
PLAY (from Reykjavik)
TAAG Angola Airlines (from Luanda)
Volotea (has several bases in France, Spain & Italy)

Credits to @SeanM1997 for this info.

Sotonsean 9th Jun 2023 23:48


Originally Posted by AvGeek1 (Post 11448432)
According to the slot report, the below airlines have applied for slots for W23:

Azerbaijan Airlines (from Baku)
Ethiopian Airlines (from Addis Ababa)
ITA Airways (from Rome or Milan?)
PLAY (from Reykjavik)
TAAG Angola Airlines (from Luanda)
Volotea (has several bases in France, Spain & Italy)

Credits to @SeanM1997 for this info.

Azerbaijan Airlines and Ethiopian Airlines would be welcome additions, but obviously it would be a resumption of service to LGW for both carriers.

​​​​​​I was only thinking the other day whether TAAG Angola Airlines could be a possible candidate at LGW for a service from Angola. When British Airways stopped flying from LHR to Luanda a few years ago I half expected TAAG to announce service to Luanda. Hopefully this service comes to fruition as it will add London to the airline's route network in Europe along with their existing routes to Lisbon, Madrid and Porto. TAAG Angola Airlines are in expansion mode and are considering ordering new long haul aircraft to accommodate this. I can also forsee TAAG Angola Airlines being a possible future candidate for joining the Oneworld alliance.

Regarding Volotea, will be interesting to what routes they have in mind without having to compete with existing operators at LGW.

Hopefully the Play application is not intended to replace their current STN operation.

ITA Airways expanding their London operations, or are they still having issues with their current leased slots at LHR?

davidjohnson6 16th Jun 2023 08:40

Danair's new routes to/from Brasov and Bucharest is not off to a good start. Flights between different destinations are being combined and departure times being changed by 10+ hours at very little notice. It sounds like ticket sales are low, and Brasov airport/ATC isn't ready for what Danair were planning.

danielson81 17th Jun 2023 10:55


Originally Posted by davidjohnson6 (Post 11451832)
Danair's new routes to/from Brasov and Bucharest is not off to a good start. Flights between different destinations are being combined and departure times being changed by 10+ hours at very little notice. It sounds like ticket sales are low, and Brasov airport/ATC isn't ready for what Danair were planning.

That's a shame, I note Gatwick departures/arrivals labels it as "Bucharest VIA Brasov-Ghimbav"

davidjohnson6 20th Jun 2023 01:07

Dan Air have published a revised schedule, including their routes between Gatwick and Brasov / Bucharest
https://danair.ro/press-release
Flights will operate Bucharest - Brasov - Gatwick - Brasov - Bucharest 1x per week on Fridays. There will be no other flights to/from the UK.

Ryanair fly Bucharest - Stansted nonstop 24x weekly
Wizzair fly Bucharest - Luton nonstop 26x weekly and Bucharest - Gatwick nonstop 7x weekly
British Airways fly Bucharest - Heathrow nonstop 14x weekly
Tarom fly Bucharest - Heathrow nonstop 7x weekly
Wizzair will fly Brasov - Luton nonstop 3x weekly from August.

I'm left wondering how Dan Air will compete against Ryanair and Wizzair

Rutan16 20th Jun 2023 08:38


Originally Posted by Sotonsean (Post 11448662)
Azerbaijan Airlines and Ethiopian Airlines would be welcome additions, but obviously it would be a resumption of service to LGW for both carriers.

​​​​​​I was only thinking the other day whether TAAG Angola Airlines could be a possible candidate at LGW for a service from Angola. When British Airways stopped flying from LHR to Luanda a few years ago I half expected TAAG to announce service to Luanda. Hopefully this service comes to fruition as it will add London to the airline's route network in Europe along with their existing routes to Lisbon, Madrid and Porto. TAAG Angola Airlines are in expansion mode and are considering ordering new long haul aircraft to accommodate this. I can also forsee TAAG Angola Airlines being a possible future candidate for joining the Oneworld alliance.

Regarding Volotea, will be interesting to what routes they have in mind without having to compete with existing operators at LGW.

Hopefully the Play application is not intended to replace their current STN operation.

ITA Airways expanding their London operations, or are they still having issues with their current leased slots at LHR?

TAAG are subject to EU operational restrictions banning use of D2 registered aircraft and their twice daily Lisbon regular Madrid and seasonal Oporto flights are flown by HiFly .They have been seeking to add Paris for some time however so far been declined.

To-date the CAA has continued to mirror the EU aviation exclusion and restricted operating lists, so i think TAAG will have a difficult time securing government approval anytime soon.

VOLOTEA may want add my part time home town of Nantes possibly Lyon, and Toulouse - Their biggest competitor tends to Vueling.

Play apply for slots all over the place only to hand them back - They aren’t in great financial shape to be honest.

Opinion only ITA may need to speak nicely with LH Group about some slots at Heathrow or abandon the market and rely on City (As per Luxair)


c52 20th Jun 2023 17:41

Nothing on Gatwick's website about northern runway ambitions since summer last year. When can we expect the next bit of news?

DaveReidUK 21st Jun 2023 12:13


Originally Posted by c52 (Post 11454096)
Nothing on Gatwick's website about northern runway ambitions since summer last year. When can we expect the next bit of news?

There was a feature, with interview, on BBC South news yesterday.

BBC iPlayer - South Today - Evening News: 20/06/2023

Sotonsean 21st Jun 2023 16:28


Originally Posted by c52 (Post 11454096)
Nothing on Gatwick's website about northern runway ambitions since summer last year. When can we expect the next bit of news?

Never rely on company websites for updates especially regular updates. In my opinion they are the worst places to visit for such things.

The London Gatwick Airport official website has a tendency to always be behind other sources of information. In some cases especially regarding airport development it's not listing anything at all.

I've been asking on LinkedIn for ages when the Pier 6 extension will eventually start construction with still no direct answer. In my opinion Social media sites such as LinkedIn are your best bet to keep upto date with the planned developments rather than the official website.

A simple Google search will be of great help as you tend to come across so much information that you would otherwise be non aware of.


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