kind of...

back in the days of the A330's both aircraft were chartered out to longhaul tour operators, a significant amount of flying in Summer was done for Airtours/Cooks etc and winter for specialists in India and MLE. None of it had to be marketed and sold by Monarch, once it was sold to the tour operators it was money in the bank and the risk is with the tour ops to make yields work for them. Often the flight is a loss leader for the accommodation you can sell on Longhaul.

That market has gone.

Either in house to the big tour ops, off to Emirates etc for routes such as India and MLE and up in smoke in the case of Egypt and Banjul.

If Monarch were to re-enter longhaul and do it off their own back they need to start from scratch.

Pipedreams are nice I guess. But people need to face facts. Starting a longhaul operation from nothing again would bleed more cash than anyone can get their hands on, and anyone expecting Boeing to sugar-daddy Monarch back into a sustainable existence reminiscent of past glories is deluding themselves.

The blame lies in the inaction of the previous management to do anything other than fill their own pockets. Too many ships have sailed. They need to find the right size and carry on doing what they do well and hope it works.

The only way to fly to Luxor now is using Egyptair's daily service via Cairo. The direct service is a winter only flight. Whilst Hurghada is in full swing with Thomas Cook, Thomson and others, the Nile cruise industry needs heavy investment. There are around 300 boats lolling around the Nile with only around 30 in service. A sad situation but no operators seem to move to get it going again.

thanks - well the winter is the High Season on the Nile of course -

i did the SS Karim twice and the SS Sudan paddle steamers about 10-12 years ago - am awesome way to plod down the Nile and see the wonders unfold

I guess these vessels are laid up

A source in Boeing claims they have signed of on some b787

Any link to your claim which I find VERY unlikely.

MOL spouting that Monarch are "burning money" and will struggle to get through the winter.

Well I find that a lot easier to believe than the ridiculous rumour two posts before...

The only ones that would be likely to be available quickly would be the last of the "terrible teens", the first 20, or so, 787s off the production line, which very few airlines were mad enough to take. They are essentially individually hand built, with a lot of "re-work" done to them.

The initial A380s have similar, overweight, overly complex maintenance requirement, which has led to them being retired by Singapore Airlines after just 10 years. the initial 787s are so bad not even business jet operators will have them.

If MON do take some of these, the lunatics really will be running the asylum.

EDIT: It seems they have been sold. Where would MON get 787s quickly?

O'Leary is "spouting" that pretty well all airlines in Europe except for his (surprise, surprise) IAG, AF-KLM, Lufthansa and possibly EasyJet are going belly up.

More like wishful thinking on his behalf than reality - but then when did he last consider allowing the truth getting in the way of a good press release!?

Just because O'Leary says it doesn't mean it's not true!

MOL could say that about a lot of airlines especially ones that rely summer sun routes but if you look at Monarch they are introducing more city routes which may be more viable in winter.

As ever I wish them luck and hope they don't need it, but that's a market that other people are involved in with a range of slightly different USPs and competitive advantages. What can Monarch bring to the party?

Ideally Monarch need to be pushing their Monarch Holidays brand further and better using their knowledge and expertise they have gained over the years of offering such product as an advantage.

They should also make better use of their Vantage card product as a USP. Perhaps join forces with Avios to collect and spend points on it. Tier points should be earned depending on flight spend / distance flown as per the current card, although with easier to obtain perks closer matching the likes of BAs Executive Club... This is something not really seen in the low cost market but absolutely does attract repeat business.

Finally, with their new Max 8's on the way they will finally have a standardised fleet. The new aircraft should better match demand across a larger mix of destinations throughout the year. I feel while the A321 has been perfect for their summer sun routes and previous charter days, it's also been too big to venture into new scheduled markets outside of this, especially during quieter parts of the year. Yes they have the A320 but again this adds a degree of complexity for scheduling to fit in whuch aircraft can fly to where.

Monarch already have a lot going for them - i feel it's just been a case of them not using these positives to their own advantage. As soon as the new aircraft arrive hopefully we'll soon see new markets and destination pop up on the route map. Alongside their bread and butter routes, perhaps they should have a focus on offering more niche routes from their current bases. As for long haul it's really not the be all and end all. Personally they should stay clear of this for the near future at the very least and completely focus on growing shorthaul and pushing their product.

As a frequent traveller with Monarch mainly from AGP-BHX I'm concerned about the capacity issues with the new 737Max versus the A321. I always go for extra legroom seats although they sell very quickly in the summer, and I often have to be flexible on dates to get them. and that's with 2 A321's daily on said route. Will they still have as many extra legroom seats on the 737? Will the capacity issue increase the fare? Do they want to decrease their market share? I'd like to hear from those with more info on this.

Yeah it will have 6 rows of extra legroom at the front and 2/3 rows at the overwing. The inflight product as such won't be changing.

It's not about wanting to decrease their market share? Once the whole fleet has been delivered, there should actually be a significant increase in available seats on offer compared to currently.

There has been no confirmation on cabin configuration for the Max's as yet. Capacity wise you should be looking closer to the A320 for comparison. As for extra space seats, there's every possibilty that they will offer the same amount as the A321's or more. The A320's already offer an additional row (6 more seats) of extra space than the A321's do. It all depends on if the economics will still add up to remove a row of seats, although personally i'd say they're definitely a good ancillary earner for them. If Monarch decide to go for a smaller forward galley (by removing the galley 2 area), they will be able to offer the same amount of extra space seats as on their A320s (54) whilst being able to achieve 186 seats in total. An additional 12 seats vs the A320.

Last year my wife and 2 friends flew Monarch to Larnaca. They paid extra and booked their seats, many months before, and chose row 5. Shortly after she received an email saying that they had been moved to row 9 because of a change of aircraft. This year she had booked MON flights to Funchal, choosing her seats and guess what, there is a change of aircraft and she has been moved some rows back.

Why are Monarch doing this as it doesn't matter whether the aircraft is a A320 or A321. She is not that bothered but wonders why pay more to chose your seat and then get moved.

One of Monarch's problems at the moment is the lack of commonality within the fleet.
You pay a premium in advance without the airline knowing which aircraft will be used. The introduction of a common fleet is long overdue and will eradicate all of these glitches.

Cazza fly Thanks for your reply and explanation regarding seats etc. Interesting to see that there will be more seats available but in reference to the BHX-AGP service I was referring to 2x A321 versus 2x 737Max must be a significant seat availability reduction, and this summer the A321's appear to be full most of the time. I think they'll put the fares up because there'll be more people chasing fewer seats.

Or with more aircraft in the fleet they could add extra rotations.