Award Winning Oxford Airport
 

Best Business Aviation Airport as voted by the Airport Operators Association : Oxford (Kidlington) Airport EGTK/OXF - Oxford Airport win Award for Best Business Aviation Airport

Air Babboo flights to Geneva start on Saturday!

First international scheduled flight today from Oxford to Geneva. No snow on the ground unlike Luton and other 'London' airports yesterday.

Shame the likes of Farnborough (or Biggin Hill for that matter) aren't allowed to do scheduled services - no need for a third runway at Heathrow if these three airports between them took up some of the regional stuff.

Hi there!

Long time reader, first time poster, thought it was about time I got involved!

Does anyone know what the loads have been like on the Oxford - Geneva flights so far? I only counted 6 coming off todays inbound GVA flight. Even on a Q400 that can't be profitable?

Thought I might as well pay some attention to my local airport, things seem to be going from strength to strength there.

Rgds,
Oxjob

Any idea of how the loads were on the 19th? It doesn't sounds as though it's been as well publicised at the Jersey services were back in the summer.

Any news on the loads on the GVA flights? Have they improved at all, they were looking a little lackluster at times.

Oxjob - According to the CAA stats for the flights to GVA, December = 90 pax & January = 157 pax, so not really anything special.

Regarding the EDI route, if it cannot be re-started by the incumbent then as mentioned earlier on the Air Southwest thread could they be interested? After all they are familiar with operating out of OXF & have a new aircraft due shortly.
Alternatively would Eastern be prepared to give it a go with their J41's?

We won't see ASW in Oxford while there's no radar

....but they obviously felt happy to operate to JER on Summer Saturdays last year, when arguably the class G would be more of a concern than on a dull day in March.

Or was it that experience that is driving your comment?

Ban the clowns...
 

Whilst the incumbent's current and past credibilty has to be very closely questioned (what? another financial disagreement???? :eek: ) the nature of the route itself may prove to be considerably more viable. From what I understand, take up with Varsity was reasonably strong.

This could be a very nice little earner for a more serious and credible start up.....:ok:

If you're interested here's the link to the full Oxford Mail article - it sheds a little more light on the incumbent.

Edinburgh flights grounded a week after launch (From Oxford Mail)


PP

:ok:
I don't know the full details but I've been told they won't go back until something is done about Radar

What about BE starting EDI with one of the Loganair Saab 340's, if Varsity had a good take up maybe BE can make a go of it.

Any thoughts ?

It is incredible that airports still seem to be taken in by these new airlines that suddenly appear.

Is this the same Mr Halstead that set up Alpha Airlines (or something like that) a year or two ago? They tried to operate a service in the Isle of Man. One launch flight then the whole operation ceased!

Surely there must be some input from the CAA in all this?

Lots of chat about this back at OXF. Looks like they gave the chap a chance - again, as a local entrepreneur, but somewhat regret it now!!

Almost all the forward flights were full and there were clearly over 500 seats sold after just five day's flying - on an 18 seater at that.

Looks like someone else will pick up on what is probably one of the best untapped routes left in the domestic UK market - EDI and OXF amongst the most visited cities in the UK and yet served by a diabolical train service - six hours versus the hour and a bit on the old Jetstream.

With HS2 (the fabled High Speed Rail) in 2026 (if we are lucky), there's a bit of breathing space to capitalise on this juicy route.

In the meantime, OXF will finish the GVA flights when the snow melts and start the Jersey runs in May which are likely to be full again, as they were last year.

Forget the third runway at Heathrow, this is where it is at!

It's a shame that it's all gone wrong.......as it looks like the route is a good one?
But reading this and other forums......it looks like its not going to happen. Not sure anyone will touch Mr H with a barge pole?
But from my point of view it did give me a good chance to get some nice shots....(well one anyway).
Photos: British Aerospace BAe-3102 Jetstream 31 Aircraft Pictures | Airliners.net

Varsity
 

Varsity Express: Baby Branson’s bogus business - Times Online

Sums it all up really....

That's really the icing on the cake:

This gentleman has sung praises about MH in the latest edition of the magazin, devoting a 3 page article on him (not on his airline, but on the guy personally). Isn't this the same magazine that also fell into the trap about this new Jersey based airline set up by a young teenager? Apparently top notch journalism at work...

Young at heart - stupid at brain?
 

Comprehensive article Horsebox re: an interview with MH.

If the investigative element is founded as truthful and he knowingly and pre-meditatedly deceived 5 FOs by over-charging for their training as part of an "operational airline" then the Serious Fraund Office may want to talk with him. Not sure Companies House will let him register any LTD company after this.

Also: If he did fabricate any relationship with RB and self styled himself as an understudy then given the kind of attention he has solicited on more than one occassion then he could well be in a lot of trouble with the bearded one...no-one likes this kind of negative media coverage - its not good for business. :=

I hope any influence with Pprune he may have had has completed just evaporated (where did all those threads go???!)

Please forgive me for being upfront and sounding harsh but personally, given the state of our industry at the moment and the number of young wannabees out there open to exploitation I hope MH gets everything he deserves whether that be industry banishment, legal action or prosecution - hopefully all three. :D

Eurocopter UK
 

Is Oxford airport where Eurocopter UK is based and also is this where the £300 million RAF Puma upgrades are going to be carried out. I know Eurocopter UK are prime contractor for these mods but don't know at what facility. If it is here i'm wondering if there is a possibility they will be looking for puma experienced guys for the mods.

Yes, they are based at EGTK. They have quite a significant base there and it includes police helis as well. See the descriptor on their website Home Eurocopter UK Helicopter Distributor VIP, Police, Air Ambulance Completions in the UK below:

Not sure about the situation with regards to upgrades or whether they are looking for puma guys. However a contract of that size (assuming that they are upgrading for current military requirements) may be spread across a number of maintenance locations. Probably best bet would be to give them a ring and ask. Good luck. :ok:

Oxford - Palma?
 

London Oxford (Kidlington) Airport EGTK/OXF - New weekly flights from Oxford to Palma, Mallorca
Flights from Oxford to Palma | Oxford Airport Travel

This is not another Halstead special is it?

I suspect the economics of this route are marginal given the prices which are being quoted and the fact that the a/c won't be flying at 100% load. Maybe the plan is to prove the route this season then bring in a larger, faster a/c next year, such as an RJ?

Sector cost Oxford-Palma is somewhere near the the £6k mark using a Saab2000. What fares are on offer ?

[FONT='Verdana','sans-serif']www.oxfordairporttravel.co.uk [/FONT]

[FONT='Verdana','sans-serif'][FONT='Verdana','sans-serif']'Flight only prices are from £395 return – include all taxes, baggage allowance of 15kg, in-flight meals, complimentary in-flight bar etc[/FONT]
[FONT='Verdana','sans-serif'][/FONT]
[FONT='Verdana','sans-serif']Self-catering holidays start from £695 pp for 7 nights including flights[/FONT]
[FONT='Verdana','sans-serif'][/FONT]
[FONT='Verdana','sans-serif']Hotel-based holiday prices start from £775 for 7 nights in a family hotel, from £1045 for 7 nights in a rural country escape hotel, or from £1215 for 7 nights in a luxury hotel – including flights[/FONT]
[FONT='Verdana','sans-serif'][/FONT]
[FONT='Verdana','sans-serif']Private villa holidays start from £895 pp for 7 nights, including flights'[/FONT]
[/FONT]

wow...that much ..?...a real money spinner then......only need to fill half the seats to break even (ish).......

Dead pan....sorry....missed your point about not being ably to fly at 100% L/F.....Long Way for a Saab2000 i know......what will be the restriction do you think ?

c.£400-£600 over the season. £6K seems on the low side for a Saab 2k for a sector of this length - a mate of mine was quoted £70K+ for an adhoc charter from EGTK to PMI (i.e. 2 sectors) using an RJ85 last year.

JonEMA - check out Phileas' link to the Eastern Airways thread at post # 107 above. There's a discussion around the no. of PAX they plan to carry on the flight.

Thanks Dead_Pan.

Looks like their having a real ding dong over in the Eastern forum over the operational aspects of the service. I'm no expert but I think Eastern are a very professional outfit and wouldn't entertain a service like this if they wern't totally confident in maintaining service and quality.

I'm using a commercial route economic system that's available here in the office so i'm pretty confident on £6k sector cost give or take a grand. As i said earlier, 50% load factor to break even is my guess which, interestingly, is close to Eastern's average network load factor.

Smart airline me thinks

It will be costing GTE, the organisation which have chartered it, a lot more than the ACMI going rate for this type, which I suspect your software may be using. Also, I think your assumption of break-even at 50% load may be optimistic.

Eastern won't be taking any financial risk on this route as such - GTE will have to pay them regardless of how many seats they sell.

Still, its nice to see someone taking the proverbial plunge in these difficult times.

Couldnt agree more...its about time we started to see some re-investment back into the industry. And this route could work. Good luck to them. :ok:


PP

Hi Dead_Pan,

Yes, you are right, the software builds the cost from the perspective of Eastern operating the route directly.

I agree, great to see the momentum building at Oxford. I’m not from the area myself but had it on my radar as displaying great potential for a couple of years now. It has an excellent catchment and could easily out compete LHR for UK domestic and near Europe day returns using turbo props.

I have to agree with you on this, dead_pan.

JonEMA: I use what is probably the same route economics package as you, developed not a million miles from Loughborough :-) . I'm not sure how you reached your estimate of a 50% breakeven load factor, even if we exclude Eastern's profit margin. I haven't seen it mentioned elsewhere, but unless Eastern is operating some other charter flight to/from OXF or PMI (which seems unlikely), then the costs of positioning sectors need to be included as well - realistically that's at least £1500-£2000 per sector depending on where the aircraft is coming from/going back to.

So your £12000 round-trip to PMI now becomes maybe £16000, and then there's the profit margin to the carrier. Let's imagine that they settle for as little as £4000 profit (remember, just one tech aircraft in PMI during the season would eat into this cumulative profit pretty quickly!) and you're looking at £20000 per round-trip.

If everyone were paying £395 that'd be a breakeven load factor of - oh, 100% if we count all 50 seats :sad: - so I could imagine that the goal is to increase the average yield (I notice that the operator's website says "from £395").

Looked at another way: if the tour operator are only selling 40 seats per flight, then they need to fill all those 40 seats at an average round-trip yield of £500. Not impossible, but not exactly a dead cert either.

The prices on GTE's site do appear to be firm - they range from £395 in June to £500+ in August.

Oxford does appear to have a good catchment - there are lots of wealthy people living in the city, Cotwolds etc who would no doubt appreciate its convenience. That said, its lack of radar will probably prevent it offering a decent winter timetable, also the PAX facilities are apparently limited (according to my aforementioned mate the terminal can only handle a hundred or so people at a time). Oh, and there's no hangarage for anything bigger than a mid-sized corporate jet, so no prospects of any airline basing an a/c there yet.

PS I'm writing this in the vain hope that either the airport's operators or the Reubens brothers are reading this and take note!

My understanding was that Oxford now has a hangar capable of taking a BBJ, is this not the case?

Hi Cyrano,

Thanks for putting me straight.

At a pure route level the system spits out just above £6k a sector and of course you are right to point out the positioning costs etc. My 50%ish LF to break even (before profit) was therefore simply £12k divided by £500 being the mid point fare taken from one of Dead_Pan's previous post.

Optimistic enthusiasm perhaps, but its interesting that Eastern's load factor across its network is also around this figure and they still make money.

Guys,

Eastern's bed & butter work are scheduled services, this PMI is an IT charter, Eastern do not need to sell seats, they do not need to worry regarding enough bums on seats, because they've sold the entire flight(s) to the tour operator and it is the tour operator that needs to get bums on seats to break even, make a profit etc.

Eastern's load factors have nothing to do with it!