Another Award
 

''Budget airline bmibaby has won the Best Low Cost Airline Award in the prestigious Conde Nast Traveller 2011 Reader Awards.''

Bmibaby wins award for best low cost airline - Cheapflights.co.uk

Wow

This really shows how bad moral is - even considering what is going on at present, nobody has posted here for 20 days! :\

AltFlaps Wow

This really shows how bad moral is - even considering what is going on at present, nobody has posted here for 20 days!


Or it shows how good moral is?

We know what's going on!

See you in another 20 days

I'd have thought that the absence of any posts on a particular topic on a discussion forum indicates just that there is nothing new to discuss - for an airline this might mean the staff are all just getting on with the job

The company has been very open with it's communication to all employee's I do not claim to know beyond what is in the bmi public domain, I don't know the outcome but some speculation offered on here is just plain rubbish, the clues are there, but the dots can be joined in different ways.

Is Baby part of the deal with IAG?

I didn't think it was part of the deal, but now I'm not sure. I do not think IAG want baby, I can see it being closed down, which would be a pity for EMA and the East Midlands area.

To shut a company down has surprisingly high costs. As far as I know, bmibaby is not losing a large amount of money, so it should be possible to turn it around, given sufficient attention from management. Thus, if sold cheaply enough, even for a notional £1, there is presumably some other airline with existing UK infrastructure (Easyjet, Flybe, Jet2, Monarch or Ryanair) out there that would want to take on baby

I doubt very much that baby will be 'closed down'.
Any sale to another carrier will almost certainly still ensure a presence at EMA, albeit in a different guise to baby.

Some of the EMA routes are pretty good money-spinners so it would be a foolish company to dismiss those.

I wish all my ex-colleagues at baby (and bmi) all the best luck in the world over the next few months. I've been there, as well.....:ok:

People are forgetting that Vueling is a subsidiary of Iberia which is also part of the IAG group.

Some of the surplus A319/A320 being sent to them from the BMI/BA deal.

It seems strange that Vueling makes an announcement to start Barcelona from Cardiff just as bmibaby say goodbye.

Ease Vueling into the market before the announcement of bmibaby is now Vueling.

It's a long shot but could happen

Flights to Rome or 'flights of fancy'?
 

'I didn't think it was part of the deal, but now I'm not sure. I do not think IAG want baby, I can see it being closed down, which would be a pity for EMA and the East Midlands area' - VC10man

There is something that does not quite add up here. Whey when there has been a paucity of activity re route development from Bhx should both BMIbaby and Monarch launch Rome? Suddenly from nothing to two carriers.

Or will it be two carriers?

There is still intense speculation as to the future of BMIbaby, part of IAG or part of Monarch in the fulness of time.

Does this route to Rome hold any key as to the future?

Edit: reason spelling

If BA had to take Baby with mainline in order to secure the deal with LH, BA will have to do something with it. However, having thought about it I simply can not see Baby being integrated into Vueling. Yeah Vueling is part of IAG, but seriously the UK has the most competitive low cost operations, well certainly more carriers in a crowded market place. FR, LS, EZY etc. etc.

Personally, I think it would be a mad idea to place Vueling in the UK where Baby is now. There are far more places on the continent that would make more sense.

Give us a break with the Monarch spiel!
Monarch is NOT buying baby - the 'big' Monarch announcement has come and gone.

sts, I think Jet2 would be more interested than Monarch, and I agree that Vueling have no presence in UK - and I think the name sounds crap too, too much like wealking!

Question is, what would they get for £1? Slots at BHX aren't quite the same as at LHR - do baby own the 737's outright? Fairly old frames, but at least LS operate same type?

Monarch is yellow herring
 

It simple really, Lufthansa announce that they are considering a sale or partial sale of the bmi group, which includes mainline,baby, and regional, plus engineering and a share in NATS.

A number of parties express an interest in bits or all of the group (Lufthansa's preferred option) the big boys wouldn't out of choice want either regional or baby, because all they really want is access to LHR, but if push comes to shove they'll take the lot, meanwhile other players express an interest in regional and baby and first out of the block is Woddley & Ross with an offer for regional and that should be complete inside a couple of weeks, likewise there are rumoured to be a couple of interested parties in baby and it's probably that any deal would likely be agreed in principal before November is out.

IAG & Virgin have been in talks to buy the group and IAG tables an offer for bmi which includes everything bar regional which is already sold, IAG will be aware of the baby sale timetable but should that fall apart they'll be left holding the baby so to speak.

So if it works to plan IAG will end up buying bmi which will have shed regional and baby, simples!

Unwinding baby and regional from the bmi group will be less straight forward me thinks

Forget Vueling or Monarch or Jet2, the baby brand will almost certainly continue with it's new owner, after all it is only the brand that is of worth

Inky,
agree with most of what you say, but I do question the value of the brand once the bmi connection is removed; it would still require a bit of investment and effort to re-establish what is effectively a new brand.

The same will be true with Regional, remove the bmi bit and it rather loses it's impact. Just my opinion of course.

Monty Gordo - just my speculation, but if we consider this from a game theory point of view:

My understanding is that bmibaby announced a Birmingham - Rome route over 2 months ago. Monarch presumably will have been well aware of this announcement. However, Monarch are also aware that the bmi group is for sale, and that because of the change of ownership and general instability may have considered bmibaby either
- unlikely to actually send planes to Rome (i.e. routes gets cancelled in February 2012 for some reason or other)
- or that the new owner of bmibaby will be much more focussed on integrating a new airline into their existing operations and thus may not have the stomach in 2012 for a head-to-head fight against another airline - better to gain stability before trying for growth

Furthermore, now that Lufthansa have publicly announced bmi is being sold, and it's gone all over the press, customers may view flights with baby as a higher risk - should I book 6 months ahead with baby whose future ownership is unknown and risk my holiday being messed up or should I book with a more stable airline ?

Bmibaby has become a much less credible competitor on any new routes and thus Monarch have a greater chance of making the Rome route work.

Pup
 

I would think any deal on baby will include the use of the name for a period of time much as is the case with regional, although the impact on regional may well be higher without the bmi in front of it,bmibaby or baby having dropped the bmi bit is a easier rebrand in my view.

Monarch and Rome DJ you could well be right and I have no doubt that some passenger will be reluctant to book with baby whilst there is uncertainty over it's future, but most don't read Pprune clearly there has been uncertainty over the future of baby for the last 3 years, but it hasn't stopped people booking with them ! Fortunately because of the state of the UK market it has moved to a late booking market and if this can be settled before the peak booking season after Christmas then I think it's impact will be limited.

Baby is web airline and needs only bmibaby.com to re route to another domain name is easy stuff supported by marketing spend

The problem is everyone assumes that it will be another airline that buys baby, I don't see that, why would Jet2 or any other player want the hassle of different pays scales, management structure, the TUPE stuff? when they could just put aircraft into EMA & BHX ?

I often wonder if people stop to think that these lowcost airlines forcing people to pay by debit card means they have no credit protection. Maybe as only way to avoid baby fees is to pay by Electron, maybe more people pay by credit card than previously?

Personally, I imagine that baby won't suddenly stop like XL or SkyEurope, but there is a hidden risk no credit protection or even travel insurance will cover. If the airline stops, you might get back what you paid for the flight, and you may even be able to get refund on some ancilliaries, but if you have already made arrangements, chances are you will have to fork out extra for alternative flights, and that consequential is your problem.

For those reasons, I'd think twice before booking next summer with baby, and I think there are plenty of punters who read the news, even if they don't read pprune!

Jabird
 

I understand where you are coming from, but this is very different from the likes of Globespan which basically went bust, bmibaby is owned by bmi and bmi is owned by Lufthansa so there is no chance of baby going bust, were its owners now or in the future to choose to cease trading, they would be doing so knowing that they would have to refund all bookings money taken, bmi, Lufthansa or IAG could not just shut up shop and take the money.

Having said that it will of course concern some, however i have had several phone calls from contacts outside the industry who watched the news reports and said i guess your company is secure now that you have been taken over by BA!

This is a non event for 99% of baby customers and come Christmas will have forgotten about it in the same way most have about JLR being bought by Tata motors or Cadbury by Kraft, it is uncertainty that does the damage, just look at SAAB car sales, this should bring that uncertainty to an end

IJ,

Exactly as I posted - I doubt they will run with punters' money, but there are other costs involved with making a travel booking that a flight canx refund would not cover.

There is also a small question of car hire - never good value with locos anyway imho, but if baby were to cancel your flight, and you've booked a hire car, their deal is with an agency (CarTrawler), who then contract with the rental co. Who would be responsible for the refund?

BA used to own go, and baconnect, I don't think they are in the business of running locost. I don't care who makes my chocolate bar, I have never wanted a refund on one!

Most people actually refer to bmibaby as ''baby'' now, this is what the airline has wanted to achieve for a while. You may have noticed that the increase in use of the word ''baby!'' in marketing etc and less use of the word bmi to help differentiate the brands.

Re-naming the airline to ''flybaby.com'' for example would still keep the branding in-line and everything they have been working to achieve.

In all fairness, there is no brand connection needed anymore regarding the ''bmi-'' part of baby. Even if there wasn't a sale of the group and things were to carry on as normal, bmibaby could re-name itself to flybaby.com tomorrow and still retain it's brand image. What i am trying to is people are booking to fly with bmibaby not 'bmi' and what that stands for.

Maybe BA will rename BMiBaby as "Go" :ok:

I'll get me coat....

Viking9
 

What about Gobaby ?

or just BAby :)

New routes
 

Take over aside, Two more new routes are set to be announced before the end of the week for next summer.

do you know from which airport cazza?

Bound the be from Fortress EMA......unless they are going back on BHX-MAD?

New Routes
 

GayFriendly & BHD2BFS

The four based BHX schedule is quite packed and any new route might come at the expense of an existing route (Madrid for Rome due Monarch's service ;))

East Mids had loads of gaps in their schedule of eight aircraft that is why I thought they were going to lose an aircraft when there was some discussion about a delay to re-signing of the four aircraft leases. Coupled with Munich and Prague being taken of sale for next summer, it was all pointing to one less aircraft. I wonder if Prague will survive but certainly not bookable next summer from EMA.

Now that it is believed that 14 will be in the fleet, this leaves at least a chance of a couple of new routes for EMA. Sorry BHD2BFS I have not looked at the BHD aircraft utilisation to see if there is room for more in the schedule.

Pete

i thought after the launch of BHD they where interested in reinstating the prague route, especially since no one else flies there now and i think there is a few gaps in the time table, just a thought

No sorry, all i know it will be 2 new routes and slight frequency increases to some of the most popular current destinations.

Only with a jigging around of some timing and days at BHX would there be enough room for the likes of say another Med-length route, so most likely they will be from EMA where there is a few gaps some days.
BHD looks a pretty full schedule also, I guess they could squeeze in a UK domestic route some days with a little jigging about with the current timetable, but I doubt they would do.

Let's just hope it's NOT in the old bmibaby style of introducing brand new routes while quietly dropping another...

I was hoping baby would squeeze in a Jer service somewhere in the schedule as its a pretty short run down and back. Compete with be .

I was actually thinking NQY. Maybe even at 2x weekly like LS did at BFS.

Anyway Ive heard they will announce within the next 48hours :ok:

Could Baby be just what Stelios needs to get his new Fastjet airline off the ground?

Well, they do just have an aircraft out of the paint shop today named "Surf's up baby"... :hmm:

Anyone able to tell me more about the current fleet utilisation? How many aircraft are based at each base? I'm especially interested in the BHD operations...

Thanks in advance!

BHD = 2x 733
BHX = 8x 733/5
EMA = 4x 733/5

Thanks! :)

Based aircraft
 

Reverse BHX & EMA ;)

I am sure BHX would love 8 based!

Currently BHX is three based but from the end of next week only
Sunday will see all three needed.



Pete

True, this is the summer plan however not all these aircraft are being used at EMA during the winter either, just like most airlines many will be parked up for long periods throughout the day. BHX will see upto 4 a/c, EMA 8 a/c and BHD 2 a/c parked up even over the winter.