It should also be remembered that there has been a great increase in the frequency of the train service. There is an hourly departure now, which neither carrier can match.

Personally, I still tend to use the train to travel between Cork and Dublin. Although, it should be faster, it is still competitive time-wise with the plane once check-ins and trips to and from the airport are taken into account. Also, the train ticket provides greater flexibility. If a meeting overruns or I decide to stay in Dublin late for social reasons, my ticket is valid on the next train.

The only times I ever fly between Dublin and Cork are if I'm catching a connecting flight or if my final destination is somewhere around Swords or Malahide.

Ork -dub
 

A flexible ticket should be introduced on a first come first served basis. I know its alien to low cost airlines but it might boost numbers. I'd say both carriers are incurring losses on ORK-DUB and it's a only question of who blinks first although I hope I'm wrong.

Cork-Dublin
 

Perhaps if passengers had to book on a selected flight, but if there was availability they could change to a different flight on the same day at no extra charge? Alternatively Aer Arann could introduce a frequent flyer programme, like Aer Lingus have, which would encourage people to fly so they could earn discounts. As far as I know they don't have one at the moment. Another option might be to include the bus tickets to the city centre in the price of the flight, like Sky Europe do with flights to Bratislava, for passengers who are going to Vienna. Or maybe they could just run adds highlighting the price advntage of flying over the train. All adsso far just highlight how cheap they are, not how expensive the train is!

It seems Aer Arann allow a free change on the Cork - Dublin route as long as you request it before takeoff time on the day of departure.

Ork - Mad
 

Does anyone know what loads are like on this service as ticket prices seem to be quite cheap!?

riptack

Tom the Tenor will be able to tell us when he and his missus return from Madrid :ok:

No doubt Ryanair operating the same route from Shannon isn't helping. In fact, don't think the Ryanair SNN - MAD route is doing very well either....

... it's a pity Charlie if their not doing well, maybe they should have choosen better days to fly! Madird is great for a long weekend so possibly a Sunday flight would be better than a Tuesday one!

Let's see what Tom says! :ok:

Ryanair are planning to add an extra flight per week from Shannon to Madrid for summer 2007

Just returning to this topic briefly, I travelled to Dublin yesterday for the afternoon. Left my office here in Cork city centre at exactly 11.00, was on the Aer Arann flight at 11.40 which departed 10 minutes early. I was sitting in our Dublin office on Harcourt Street at 13.00. Two hours door to door, including checkin and the time to travel to and from both airports. Train can't compete with that!

Ork - Mad
 

Hi,

For those that are interested, ORK-MAD had 91 flown passengers per flight in November and 87 in December.

Please note the usual caveat about loads and yields.

Good timing Angry rebel but you cut it very fine. The plane is far better than the train but I'm convinced that many people are intimidated by the airports.

They've become very unwelcoming in recent years with phrases like "Take off your shoes", "Take off your belt", "BOARDING CARD, passport, BOARDING CARD!" to mention just a few. The friendly helpful staff of yesteryear have all but disappeared. It doesn't bother me as I'm used to airports but its a turn off to many people.

Madrid was great all right and is well worth a visit. Nice and sunny with Monday temps of 17 C plus. We had good start last Saturday morning as the EI892 to Madrid was on Stand 9T at Cork and connected up to the airbridge! Our stroll down the sole Cork airbridge is almost worth a trip report of it's own like they do on airliners.net but we will let that one go for now! ;)

Terminal 4 at Madrid is a magnificent feat of airport engineering and it is a credit to everything that is great about Spain. Introducing a Cork slant to it Terminal 4 at Barajas is, of course, airbridge heaven and our A320 parked in between two Iberia A340-600s. Very impressive sight they were too not having previously seen the biggest of the A340s.

My principal memory of the new Barajas will, however, be tempered by seeing what remains after the ETA bomb at the multi storey car parks across from the new terminal where two people from Ecuador lost their lives a few weeks ago. At first you would think it is just another construction site as most of the rubble has now been cleared away and it is only where you see jagged edges around the ends of reinforced concrete beams that you realise that something more sinister happened. Fairly chilling to see the results of terrorism so up close and personal.

Off time to on time Cork Madrid is less than 2 hours and last Saturday's sunrise was marvellous. Flights from Cork to European capital cities have always done well and there is no reason to suggest that Cork Madrid will be any different. If snn can also hold up a Madrid flight with FR good luck to them. Gee, that is me sounding fairly concilliatory? Spring must be in the air!

It's a pity it doesn't have an Iberia code-share on it. I believe they have been dropped from EI flights on the DUB-MAD route, so it's pretty much a non-starter. The boost of being able to add a few more transfer passengers would give it a nice boost over the SNN-MAD Ryanair alternative.

What were the loads like on the madrid flights TTT?

The timing was tight! What I hadn't mentioned in my post was that I parked outside the terminal, checked in with about 2 minutes to spare, then ran back outside and went and parked the car!

On security, I came through Brussels last week and beeped so much going through the security that I was singled out for a search. I've never seen such a pleasant security guard, who made was is normally an annoying diversion no more than a slight delay. On top of that, he actually searched me, rather than the slight "patting" they give you in Ireland where you could conceal a baby elepahant in your trousers and they'd miss it....

Arann's latest "7" ads pushing their Dublin to Cork services are very reminiscent of the old Aer Lingus battle with Ryanair many years ago - push the positives. The interesting new change is the ability to switch flights on the day for no charge whatsoever and no matter what ticket type, a difficult feature for Ryan to match with their lower frequency.

They have been head to head with Ryanair for 15 months now - is this a record for any turboprop airline against Ryanair on the exact same airport pair?

Old terminal
 

Any news on what's going to happen to the old terminal now that the new one is up and running?

While expanding the apron would be great it seems a little shortsighted to demolish a building with money for any new buildings being v scarce!:ugh:

Who says they want to put new buildings there?

It looks to me that the old terminal will be demolished, and that the tower will too once the met and telephone exchange find a new home.
I see a possibility for EMC's hangar to be moved to this site and keep all executive traffic around the south ramp and stand 2/3.

Whats the point in keeping the old rat infested terminal if it's not required. It would take a lot of work to use it as anything other than a terminal, and Ryanair won't get it either.

Old terminal
 

The new terminal has a capacity of 3m which is the current passenger numbers. So what happens in a few years time when the numbers increase without any additional space?

I would have thought the old terminal could be used as an over spill? Cheaper than building any thing new!

Well it's designed to cope with 3 million comfortably. The old terminal was designed for about 1 milliong but was able to pump through nearly 3 million annually before things got chronic. I can't see capacity being an issue with the way things are being played there at the moment...

Is there any talk of the new cargo facility being moved along?

Cork Airport debt issue almost settled, 19/02/07:
An ultimate resolution to the debt issue in Cork Airport is, it seems, finally being agreed upon.
The Airport had been saddled with a €220 million debt after Martin Cullen, the minister for transport went back on Minister Séamus Brennan's commitment in 2003 that the Cork Airport Authority (CAA) would start off debt free and all debt would be absorbed into the Dublin Airport Authority (DAA).
The issue of who would pay the cost of Cork's new Terminal, Multi-storey car park and improved road network had been dragging on for over a year.
But, it seems with elections looming, the government has ordered the Dublin Airport Authority to pay €120 million of the debt, leaving the CAA to clear the remaining €100 million. The airport has begun redesigning its business plan to eradicate this debt.
This is still not a satisfactory resolution in the eyes of many after Séamus Brennan's original pledge for a debt free Cork Airport Authority, and it is perceived that the move is designed to soften the blow coming up to the elections.

€100 million? This is disastrous news :{
If anyone is organising a protest march let me know so that I can book flights home :(

According to reliable sources the board has decided to reject the offer

Doesn't the DAA get enough from its Duty free abroad, the sale of the Great Southern Hotel et al. Was in Dubai recently and they have a massive Duty free, now doesn't the DAA have a big stake there and other large Duty Free's abroad?? hmmm Shouldnt Cork get a slice of this wealth at all?? It's a farce from start to finish, Cork should get a debt free airport and also the DAA should keep its nose out its affairs permanently so that it can operate independantly. There is far too much politics involved in the running of Cork Airport. Debt free is the only way to go and to get out from the clutches of the DAA completely!

Yes, the Irish government's proposed half assed attempt to get the super profitable Dublin Airport Authority to shoulder just over half the massive Euro 220 million Cork Airport debt is intolerable. Not only the airport but all of Cork must now stand shoulder to shoulder against this farce and stitch up which if goes through will quite likely kill off Cork Airport for well into the future. Do not forget how well organised the Shannon lobby has been down the years in protecting their interests like with the stopover so take a lesson out of their book and make yourselves heard with the politicians in this general election year. The local Cork government TDs (MPs) in Fianna Fail and the Progressive Democrats must not be left off the hook and must be asked for their opinion on how a Cork Airport with a proposed Euro 100 million debt can put together any kind of credible business plan for the years ahead. In such circumstances it is all but impossible to see how the situation can work out well for Cork Airport.

A Cork Airport candidate for the General Election must not yet be ruled out as a possibility due to the gravity of what all of Cork and not just the airport may now be facing.

Aerfort Chorcai - Tabhar aire! (Cork Airport - Be on guard!)

The Cork Airport debt issue has at last fully made the national broadcast media today with the topic discussed hotly and at length on the lunchtime news programme on RTE Radio 1. Cork Senator John Minihane (not TD) of the government Progressive Democrats party was scathing in his criticism of his Fianna Fail colleagues's proposed solution to the DAA of splitting the airport debt's close to down the middle with Cork bearing Euro 100 million Euro of the Euro 220 million debt.

Earlier in the day the topic was also well covered on Cork local radio, 96FM. What a contradiction there was between two Cork government deputies, Mininster for Enterprise, Mr Micheal Mairtin, TD fairly meakly supporting the Government approach and some minutes later fellow Fianna Fail depty, Mr Noel O'Flynn, TD arguing proudly enough for a strong Cork Airport and even wanting the remaining airbridges to be put in without any more delay. I had to warm to that suggestion! :D

As can be predicted there has been little word today from Mr Cullen, the transport Minister and nothing either from the big shots at the Cork Airport Authority nor the Dublin Airport Authority. There has been one sort of sensation thas has emerged today in that it seems the DAA are keen on selling around 30 acres of land near runway 25 at Cork. The thing about it is that they want to do it over even the heads of the Cork Airport Authority without their consent to the deal! How's that for sneakiness? A form of asseting stripping by any other name?

If the DAA feel the need to asset strip Cork Airport so much why dont they sell off the area around runway 17, get their millions of Euro, and then let Cork put in another 4000 feet on runway 25. At least then there might be a chance of a decent length runway and maybe better chance of installing a CATIII ILS for low viz operations.

Air Southwest to Newquay.
 

NEW ROUTE:
Cork to Newquay
with Air southwest.
The new flights start on May 4 and tickets go on sale today. They will operate three days a week on Monday, Friday and Sunday throughout May, with a Wednesday flight being introduced from June.
Flights leave Newquay at 11.20am and arrive in Cork at 12.10pm, giving a flight time of less than an hour. Flights leave Cork at 12.55 and arrive in Newquay at 13.45.

Are the DAA serious? Presumably they are referring to the land ear-marked for the cargo apron at the airport. They should go take a running jump for themselves.

They'd have a battle on their hands if they wanted to extend runway 25. There are roads at either end, and closing the back one would mean I'd have to get up 10mins earlier in the morning:*

The board of the Cork Airport Authority should resign over the attempt to force the terminal debt on the CAA and also over the attempt by the DAA to sell the land bank by runway 25 (thus preventing any future runway extension). I hope the Cork electorate will remember this 'stitch up' in the general election!!!

Cork Debt
 

This is outrageous. Not only are they landing us with a €100 million debt, they are selling 25 acres of valuable land which was earmarked for a cargo village. They should easily get €50-60million for the land, or even more if there is a bidding war. Shannon got to be debt free and keep it's much larger land banks. Dublin got the Great Southern Hotels chain, the stakes in the foreign airports as well as Aer Rianta's overseas duty free business. What has Cork got, a huge debt that will probably take decades to pay off, and no chance to improve profitability since Dublin have sold off the remaining empty land from underneath them and pocketed all the cash. If I were the CAA, I would try and get a high court injunction preventing them from selling the land.

Change is in the air by the Banks of the Lee. It must be very difficult to run an airport with this constant political haggling and media scrutiny.

I see Air Southwest are starting flights from Cork to Newquay in Cornwall

The news about Air Southwest is very welcome news for a Cork Airport very much in the news at the moment. The days chosen by Airsouthwest - Mondays, Fridays, Sundays and with with Wednesdays to follow later are great. Aer Lingus would be wise to take note with their new token Cork - Manchester service - how foolish not having a Friday flight and yet on other days of the week there will be up to three Manchester flights with two from bmi baby and the Aer Lingus service.

If a tidy little airline like Air Southwest can grasp the significance of a Friday flight for Cork beats me why EI cannot do the same.

Cork Airport is very much in the media again today with Minister Cullen on the offensive saying that an independant Cork Airport is getting the sale of the century having a debt of only Euro 100 million! The government and DAA spindoctors are working hard to keep a leash on Cork at all costs. Our Cabient Minister from Cork, Mr Micheal Martin, is also having a go saying that the chairman of the Cork Airport Authority, Mr Joe Gantley supports the government's plan on how to deal with the airport debt and there is also supposed to be some confusion on whether the CAA have yet sent a letter to the Governement rejecting it's proposal to saddle Cork with Euro 100 million debt as had been reported in the media yesterday.

Minister Cullen is supposed to be announcing a big regional airports package for Ireland today and there is talk that Waterford Airport are to receive funds to widen and lengthen their runway. How genorously sporting of him! Pity Cork did not have a Mininster like Mr Cullen!

Instead Cork and Cork Airport gets Mininster Micheal Martin!

Cork-Manchester
 

2 daily Bmi Baby flights to Manchester?
Bmi Baby has daily flights to Manchester. Is this going to change?

Knock today received a grant of €27 million from the venerable Martin Cullen "under the new Capital Expenditure Grant Scheme for Regional Airports". How nice of him.
Am I allowed to link to a full story? If so I'll put up the link.

There's rumour alright that bmi Baby will increase to twice daily for, I think, 2 days in the week.

Ya Tom you're allowed post a link to and/or selectively quote from a news article that is not advertising.

Regional airports get €100 million windfall (if I've done my sums right):
http://www.rte.ie/business/2007/0221/airports.html

To that end, here's the link to the Knock article: http://breakingnews.iol.ie/news/stor...94&p=zyyx94xxx

Now lads, ye wouldn't begrudge Knock and Waterford a few million ?

For years Waterford had to put up with the crumbs left over from the other airports. About time a Minister for Transport went a little way towards evening things up !

Waterford will be a shorter road distance for all those diversions from Cork when the new runway is operational.

So really its good news for Cork people !

Good point NABLAG. I would much rather be diverted to Waterford than Shannon . Interestingly, Waterford has the potential to do a lot of damage to ORK going forward once they have a half decent runway. If FR don't get their way with the CAA management, then they could always operate flights from Suirside. Not hampered by debt, overstaffing, or dodgy weather, and within striking distance of a large populous hinterland, Waterford could fit in nicely with FR's plans. They could even have it renamed Ireland South or Waterford-Cork Airport. Cork folk would, I imagine, be much more receptive to traveling to Waterford than Shannon.