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Ettyl

Old 11th Jun 2021, 08:31
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@PATUK I support any new start up, at any location, but lets be honest certain start ups are just a joke and will do more harm than good and for those I am always worried.

Varsity Express, Firnas Airways, FlyPop... Ettyl,, they are all a painfull joke, a pipedream that went to far.. But they can hurt some serious lives... Ettyl now taking over (or not) Stobart, that is 200 families we are talking about.. their food and shelter... And it is always a 3rd party who didnt make it happen.

We live in weird times and that Ettyl and Flypop got thet attention is just because we are in this crasy time but in normal times no one would look at these pipe dreams... Flypop is starting already 5 years and now they might or might not..

I am pro any start up, but keep it real...
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Old 11th Jun 2021, 09:18
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"Yes...but no but"...

As far as a saviour for Stobart is concerned it is the "pipe dream" or nothing but itself brought on by very "painful" Stobart mismanagement over the years.

How is Flypop hurting you hw?
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Old 12th Jun 2021, 04:10
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harriewillem,

Jokes that went too far? How about Holland Aerolines operating Nomads, or should that be Gomads, across the North Sea?

Talking seriously though I've never heard of those first three names you mentioned but what I have heard of are Atmosphere Intercontinental Airlines, apparently the brainchild of a failed handling agent clerk who now wants to take over the world, well an airline or few anyway, then how about Aer Southeast, the guy behind that boasted some 20 years in aviation without identifying in what capacity, could have been another failed handling agent, the picture of his SF340 was straight from Google images and the crunch came when he started selling tickets without a licence.

So, pray tell, what less than public knowledge information do you have to put Ettyl in the same category as these jokes?

This thread started off last year with Ettyl being flamed for being another virtual airline, it seems that they are trying to get away from the 'virtual' tag and are now being flamed for that also, just what do they need to do, not that they need to, to satisfy these armchair critics?

200 families? From Wiki it seems that Stobart, the airline, are operating some 13 aircraft, let's say 5 crews per aircraft, that would be 260 staff, then there are management, office staff, engineers, etc., just where did you pluck the figure of 200 from?

And just how many families were affected when Flybe went down, wasn't it Stobart Air themselves along with Virgin that were going to be the saviours of many of those families, was that Ettyl's fault also?

Just my personal opinion but perhaps there are a few too many bored armchair critics during these crazy times.
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Old 12th Jun 2021, 10:17
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Holland Aerolines flew ATR-42s after the Nomad and operated from 1985 to 1988 so I don't understand why you mention them in this context.

Methinks you protest too much about criticism of Ettyl - I wonder why. The deal to buy Stobart Air has now collapsed with Esken having today decided to terminate Stobart Air operations with immediate effect and they will be appointing Liquidators. Perhaps if the time wasted on the Ettyl proposition could have been avoided so might, just possibly, the Liquidation.
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Old 12th Jun 2021, 10:33
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Expressflight,

You mean that Flybe might still be going had they not wasted time with Stobart and Virgin, how about BMI, had BMI not wasted time with Lufthansa might they still be going, the list of maybes is endless, I'm not defending, I'm just questioning why the knives are out for Ettyl as much as they are.
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Old 12th Jun 2021, 12:23
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I suspect that the issue people have with Ettyl is that their owner has been the subject of some suspect dealings involving non-delivery of paid for items in the past. Plus the fact that they have failed to deliver on their promises regarding Stobart Air and Carlisle airport. This directly impacts peoples lives and livelihoods and understandably irritates reasonable people.
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Old 12th Jun 2021, 13:06
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TartinTom,

I like such TV series as Dragons' Den and Ramsay's Kitchen Nightmares and it is fact that by the time businesses and/or business people find their way on to such programmes asking for financial investment and/or help it is regularly a last gasp hope before they are forced to close the doors, in light of events of today this is neither the time nor place to say "I told you so" or similar, it is not what affllicted employees want to hear or read, but I doubt that Ettyl made any, quote, "promise" and whilst it would appear they had stumbled at the first hurdle do people here know with any certainty that they had thrown the towel in regarding buying Stobart or if indeed they just needed more time, more time that Stobart couldn't afford?

And the knives have been out on this thread for Ettyl since last year, not since last week or the week before but since last year, it can't have anything to do with Stobart.
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Old 12th Jun 2021, 14:26
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Promises, promises:
Jason Scales, Chief Executive Officer of Ettyl Limited, said: "We are delighted to have signed agreements for these acquisitions. In the immediate term it will be very much business as usual in respect of both Stobart Air and Carlisle Lake District Airport’s operations and our deal ensures that the great teams within those businesses are retained. We will be making further announcements over the coming weeks and months regarding our plans. Ettyl sees significant opportunities for increased regional connectivity as economies recover from the impacts caused by the pandemic and return to stability across the UK and Ireland."
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Old 12th Jun 2021, 14:32
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Jason Scales/Ettyl didn't use the word "promise" in that quote
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Old 12th Jun 2021, 14:42
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Pat, I’m beginning to wonder if you have had an alter ego on this site at some point in the past…
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Old 12th Jun 2021, 14:53
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It's starting to look like it isn't it.
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Old 12th Jun 2021, 15:16
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I've recently read this on the BBC:

"Stobart Air staff received an email from the company's managing director on Friday night informing them of the situation.

It outlined that Ettyl Limited, a company based in the Isle of Man, had agreed terms with Esken, the owners of Stobart Air, to buy the company.

However, according to the email, Esken discovered on Thursday evening Ettyl Limited was unable to acquire the company "on the original terms" or "obtain an alternative funding package within the required timescale"."

I've read and reread it a few times and as I interpret it Stobart made a last ditch attempt to Ettyl on Thursday at which time Ettyl didn't have the financing available leaving Stobart with no other option than to close the doors, no suggestion that Ettyl pulled out of the deal, moreso that Stobart ran out of time.
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Old 12th Jun 2021, 15:27
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Well if someone doesn’t have the means nor ability to complete a deal then it ceases to be a deal. I could agree to buy Stobart but with no funding or ability, you wouldn’t argue that it was Stobart being unreasonable in pulling out.
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Old 12th Jun 2021, 15:28
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PatUK

If you cannot provide the financing that was agreed as being necessary to complete your purchase of a business within the timescale you agreed in the sale contract, all you can do is ask the Seller for more time to do so. If, of course, you have no new possible financing options to present to the Seller at that date he is entitled to take alternative steps. I would think that is the likely scenario in this case so Ettyl had to withdraw their purchase interest by default.
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Old 12th Jun 2021, 15:38
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From what I have heard, I don’t think any offer from Ettyl to either Esken or Aer Lingus would have been entertained. Their credibility was blown several days earlier.
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Old 12th Jun 2021, 15:41
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I guess it's kind of like buying a house, that the party you are buying from needs to complete by a particular date, you make your offer with the best of intentions, then there is a problem with the survey, perhaps the surveyor undervalues the property, so you apply to another moirtgage lender etc. but what with the delays the seller hasn't paid their mortgage for so long they have to hand the keys over to their mortgage lender, happens as they say but as per the Dragons' Den/Nightmares point I made earlier, businesses often leave it until it's too late before going looking for help/investment.

But this thread is in danger of drifting from Ettyl to Stobart.
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Old 13th Jun 2021, 02:07
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How on earth did Ettyl convince the Board, accountants and senior Stobart management, that the airline and airport sale could actually be financed?
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Old 13th Jun 2021, 12:23
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The roots of that appear to sit in the Isle of Man and some documentary “irregularities” which are now the subject of a police (thus logically potentially criminal) investigation. I’d not expect to hear anything more of that until or unless something happens and it comes to court.
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Old 13th Jun 2021, 14:21
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Perhaps Stobart were acutely aware of how bad their situation was and were desperate to believe it might have been genuine?

Seen it countless times, organisations in desperate plights sell out to charlatans and liars.
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Old 13th Jun 2021, 15:08
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Looks from the out-turn of events that Stobart were caught between financial desperation and a lack of alternatives in pursuing the whole Ettyl idea.
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