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Belfast International-2

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Belfast International-2

Old 2nd Apr 2018, 08:47
  #901 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by El Bunto View Post
Early-wave integration ( 08:00 Euro, 09:30 long-haul ) without parking an aircraft + crew overnight in Belfast.
Are you suggesting that a flight arrives in empty around 05.20 from AMS to do the 1st flight out from Belfast?
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Old 2nd Apr 2018, 11:18
  #902 (permalink)  
 
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KLM has 3 main waves of European arrivals (2 morning, 1 evening), as well as a more spread out fourth wave in the afternoon.

The most popular wave for UK/Ireland flights arriving into AMS is the third wave, with 17 out of 18 airports (including BHD) operating during this period. The first wave includes 14 airports, and the second wave includes 15 airports.

The early morning wave of KLM European flights depart the UK/Ireland between 05:55-06:30, and arrive in Amsterdam between 08:10-09:00. A 05:55 departure from BFS (which is the same as from DUB) would mean the aircraft would arrive in AMS at approximately 08:35, right in the middle of the UK/Ireland early morning arrivals. It would also require an overnight stop, which KLM already do at 14 UK/Ireland airports.

Based on KLM's current BHD schedule and KLM's other UK/Ireland operations, then this would be the likely schedule for double daily flights to BFS.

BFS-AMS: 05:55-08:35
AMS-BFS: 16:05-16:45
BFS-AMS: 17:50-19:15
AMS-BFS: 21:35-22:15

This schedule allows for BFS passengers to arrive in AMS in time for two waves of European flights, plus the vast majority of long haul departures. Comparatively, KLM's current BHD schedule allows for only one wave of European departures, and a select few long haul destinations to Asia and South America.

However, I would not be surprised if KLM were to add an additional third daily flight from BFS. Only 3 out of KLM's 18 UK/Ireland airports do not have at least three daily departures (BHD, INV, SOU), so expansion from BFS would likely mean three daily flights.

If KLM were to add a third daily flight, the likely flight times would be as follows;

AMS-BFS: 07:45-08:25
BFS-AMS: 08:55-11:35

Thus would mean BFS passengers would be able to arrive in AMS in time for three waves of European flights, plus all long haul departures.
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Old 2nd Apr 2018, 12:20
  #903 (permalink)  
 
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Assuming all pax transfer to KL flights with code shares etc I am sure they could fill the flights ans probably to the detriment of EI and BA who depend on a great deal on onwards traffic rather than point to point.
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Old 2nd Apr 2018, 12:45
  #904 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Alteagod View Post
Assuming all pax transfer to KL flights with code shares etc I am sure they could fill the flights ans probably to the detriment of EI and BA who depend on a great deal on onwards traffic rather than point to point.
According to an article from 2016 (I believe it was on anna.aero), only about 1/3 of BA passengers on BHD-LHR are connecting passengers, and I imagine there are even fewer connecting with EI. Back in 2016, KLM said that 45% of BHD passengers connected at AMS. This was the lowest figure across KLM's UK/Ireland network, with 75% of all UK/Ireland passengers connecting at AMS. While I do think that this figure would rise if passengers had a greater choice of connections, if anyone is going to suffer from KLM increasing their frequency, it'll most likely be easyJet.
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Old 2nd Apr 2018, 14:28
  #905 (permalink)  
 
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Just for information

https://news.causewaycoastcommunity....ional-airport/
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Old 2nd Apr 2018, 14:52
  #906 (permalink)  
 
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Pity about the railway line about 200 yards away, #imboseals
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Old 2nd Apr 2018, 16:06
  #907 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by West Brit View Post
Are you suggesting that a flight arrives in empty around 05.20 from AMS to do the 1st flight out from Belfast?
I don't know for certain but International gives them that option ( they don't night-stop at Dublin either ).

Of course looking at the other end of the day you might be right, a 23:00 arrival would let them sweep connections from the last Schiphol inbound waves ( around 21:00 CET ) and then park overnight.

Anyone remember what the schedule was was NLM ran into International? There were a few upgauges to KLM 737s during the week as I recall.
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Old 2nd Apr 2018, 16:11
  #908 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by El Bunto View Post
I don't know for certain but International gives them that option ( they don't night-stop at Dublin either ).
KLM do have a night-stop at DUB, as well as 13 other airports in the UK/Ireland (i.e. all airports that have an early morning KLM departure)

KL939 AMS-DUB arrives in DUB at 22:15. That aircraft remains in DUB overnight, and then operates KL932 the next morning, departing at 05:55.

Originally Posted by El Bunto View Post
Anyone remember what the schedule was was NLM ran into International? There were a few upgauges to KLM 737s during the week as I recall.
I don't know NLM's old BFS schedule, but passenger numbers might help with the frequency.

From 1992-1996, approx 40,000 pax used the route, indicating daily Fokker flights. In 1997, approx 60,000 used the route, indicating that the B737 was used on select days. From 1998-1999, approx 120,000 pax used the route, indicating double daily flights, with both Fokker and B737 aircraft in use.

Last edited by A320.b744; 2nd Apr 2018 at 16:30.
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Old 2nd Apr 2018, 16:24
  #909 (permalink)  
 
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I don't buy the whole 05.55 Belfast departure. They have 05.55 out of DUB because they wouldn't of gotten anytime within 06.00-06.30 departure slots.

They could get an 06.30 out of BHD and be in AMS for 09.05.

LHR-AMS first departure is 06.30 arriving at 09.00

I'm sure some slot adjustment at AMS can solve any potential problems which BHD has. I mean they put up with a lather LHR arrival because there is no choice.
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Old 2nd Apr 2018, 16:43
  #910 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by EI-A330-300 View Post
I don't buy the whole 05.55 Belfast departure. They have 05.55 out of DUB because they wouldn't of gotten anytime within 06.00-06.30 departure slots.

They could get an 06.30 out of BHD and be in AMS for 09.05.

LHR-AMS first departure is 06.30 arriving at 09.00

I'm sure some slot adjustment at AMS can solve any potential problems which BHD has. I mean they put up with a lather LHR arrival because there is no choice.

The main problem with BHD is the late night arrival required to facilitate an early morning departure. KLM's final wave of European departures are between 21:00-22:30. If KLM were to depart AMS for BHD at 21:00, the aircraft would arrive at 21:35, i.e. after BHD's curfew. Even if KLM decided to depart slightly before 21:00, it would mean any delays would result in an arrival after 21:30. In addition, a 06:30 departure from BHD would mean a 09:05 arrival into AMS, one of the last of KLM's early morning European arrivals. Given that KLM's next wave of departures begin at 10:00, it doesn't give passengers much time to make their connections, especially since the aircraft parks at a remote stand in AMS. Combine that with any delays incurred, and it's simply not feasible to operate from BHD.
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Old 2nd Apr 2018, 18:35
  #911 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by West Brit View Post
The MD has been silent on Twitter for over a month now.(not like him) Is he ok? or is he really busy?
No hes off twitter as he retweeted a tweet from the DUP, he upset quite a few people. Staying off until it blows over i assume
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Old 2nd Apr 2018, 19:15
  #912 (permalink)  
 
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With regards to ezy not being happy I really donít think KLMís arrival would effect them
Ezy as we know is all point to point and Pax numbers have still been growing even with the arrival of klm so I think figures would must continue to increase for both carriers
It would mean on certain days there would be 5 ams flights a day if klm do go for 3 making it the busiest EU route from NI
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Old 2nd Apr 2018, 19:28
  #913 (permalink)  
 
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Bfs management got lucky when ryanair messed up on lgw, that saved a major bfs lgw turf war, if this klm rumour turns out to be true the management will need to play it fairly, not to be saying to the low cost market but, klm/air france totally different market, bfs may need to wise up if they get it, namely the handler, noseloader etc
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Old 2nd Apr 2018, 21:38
  #914 (permalink)  
 
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friend sent me this, from bfs mgmt https://ibb.co/kpuOUx
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Old 2nd Apr 2018, 21:52
  #915 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by snn20 View Post
friend sent me this, from bfs mgmt https://ibb.co/kpuOUx
I can assure you that if KLM are indeed relocating to BFS, then BFS management will want to make a huge PR stunt out of it. There's no way that BFS would leak any information before the official announcement, and thus spoil the surprise! At this moment in time, it's business as usual - KLM are still officially operating AMS-BHD in W18/19 - and that will be the official BFS position until they go public with the (rumoured) news.
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Old 2nd Apr 2018, 22:43
  #916 (permalink)  
 
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When rumours of bmi baby and EI moving to Bhd it all came to fruition. Which makes me believe that it could very much happen.
With that said could KLM/AF start a Paris route? Iím sure a deal could be struck
With Eurowings doing well I wonder if the have NI on their radar question is which airport ?
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Old 2nd Apr 2018, 22:56
  #917 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by BHD2BFS View Post
When rumours of bmi baby and EI moving to Bhd it all came to fruition. Which makes me believe that it could very much happen.
With that said could KLM/AF start a Paris route? Iím sure a deal could be struck
Back in 2015, 2016 and 2017 KLM have stated that as well as extending BHD-AMS to two/three times daily, they were also looking at starting more routes from Belfast with other Air France/KLM airlines - i.e. Air France (CDG), Joon (CDG), Transavia (EIN, RTM) and Transavia France (ORY).

I am hoping that the rumoured KLM announcement will include a daily Air France service to CDG on top of the extra flights to AMS, though it's probably unlikely. However, I do think that Air France will come to Belfast within the next 5 years.

Originally Posted by BHD2BFS View Post
With Eurowings doing well I wonder if the have NI on their radar question is which airport ?
My sources are telling me that Eurowings (and Lufthansa Group as a whole) are looking solely at BFS for potential Belfast operations, having already disregarded BHD.
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Old 3rd Apr 2018, 21:30
  #918 (permalink)  
 
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KLM are definitely not coming to bfs
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Old 3rd Apr 2018, 21:37
  #919 (permalink)  
 
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Moving away from the KLM hearsay, Norwegian have announced their first cuts for W18, Cork to Provedince suspended for the winter. Hearing at least one or more airports at risk too.
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Old 3rd Apr 2018, 22:56
  #920 (permalink)  
 
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Can anyone tell me how NCL, smaller airport than BFS, has a direct route to DXB and can manage to sustain it?

Ahhhhhh wish we had a direct route to DXB, AUH or DOH!
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