SOUTHEND 5

[SEN Observer]

Sea Air.......

......is still on the SEN website but, once again, nothing on the arrivals/departures board. Do you think we'll beat the five false starts already experienced elsewhere?!!

[Pain in the R's]

You couldn't make this up. The Sea Air website is showing the morning Southend departure as operating but no seats available on the evening flight so I guess it is full.

Better luck tomorrow for all the Munich lovers as both flights are listed with seats available.

[Pain in the R's]

Just had a look at the Munich airport website where a page has been set up showing new routes and services for 2016.

Nice long list but hang on those very efficient Germans have left one airline and route out!

Munich Airport - New flights Summer 2016

[LTNman]

I ran Southend - Munich through various flight search websites like, Sky Scanners. Expedia, Cheap Flight and Google Flights and every site says no flights available unless it was via another airport using Easyjet for the Southend departure.

Even if it did start tomorrow who would know it existed? The airline clearly has major problems and as I have already stated if it did start the route it will be doing SEN no favours in enhancing the airports reputation, as it would not be around long so would add to the list of Southend's failed routes thus making it harder for the airport to attract new airlines.

[Expressflight]

LTNman

As you do so often you sum up the situation very succinctly.

[tws123]

Surely anyone with half a brain who works in this industry will release that failed start-ups such as Jetisfaction, Maastricht Airlines, GLM, Sea Air, and to a certain extent OLT Express, are not true representations of what could be achieved on particular routes? Think there's more negativity from passengers wanting to use these routes that fail to start, than airlines actually being put off using SEN.

[LTNman]

If Southend wants to reach 2.5 million passengers by 2018 it won't be coming from Wannabe airlines, as listed above, flying in a handful of passengers each day although it is good for the arrivals board. It will be coming from an established carrier with a large fleet and more likely to be easyjet who has the vision to see that actually Southend is kind of special in a world of congested airports.

I actually think that 2.5 million is achievable.

[mik3bravo]

SEN need to seriously consider a loss leader contract to them but with a major carrier who will grab high visibility. Over medium to longterm the SEN 'brandname' will draw in other carriers which may more than make up for the loss leader sweetheart deal SEN may need to agree with a big name in order to ignite consistent growth. You have to speculate to accumulate but I fear SEN are trying to achieve big game hunting with a pistol, instead of a hunting rifle.

C'Mon SEN sort it out lads!

[mik3bravo]

Originally Posted by LTNman

If Southend wants to reach 2.5 million passengers by 2018 it won't be coming from Wannabe airlines, as listed above, flying in a handful of passengers each day although it is good for the arrivals board. It will be coming from an established carrier with a large fleet and more likely to be easyjet who has the vision to see that actually Southend is kind of special in a world of congested airports.

I actually think that 2.5 million is achievable.

Dublin - London is one of the busiest airways in the world if not THE busiest. Squeezey won't go head to head against FR on RoI routes, it will be car crash stuff for Squeeze.

Cityjet however might be a good 'neutral' friend for the airfield and will get on with its neighbours like Squeezey too.

a/c types perfect for SEN too unlike FR B73 types fleet.

[davidjohnson6]

mik3bravo - I thought the deal between SEN and Easyjet already was a sweetheart deal - certainly don't think the profit margin is particularly good for the airport. Are you suggesting SEN do another sweetheart deal with a 2nd airline ?

[Expressflight]

I'm sure that the new SEN management are working as hard as possible to attract "a major carrier" and that they will offer as competitive a deal as they reasonably can. That is simply the norm these days in airport/carrier negotiations but it still isn't always the deal clincher. The overall economics have to be sufficiently attractive over the medium to long term and airport-related costs form a relatively small part of that calculation.

As for the "sort it out lads!" comment, the "lads" are led by Glyn Jones who certainly has sufficient relevant experience to produce positive results where that is realistically achievable.

I get equally impatient with the slow progress at SEN but it's an industry where patience has to be applied within negotiations.

[SWBKCB]

with a major carrier who will grab high visibility

So easyJet aren't big enough?

[DC3 Dave]

Sure EZY are big - I think they will add another airframe by next year. They are totally committed to growth and SEN is a minor but not insignificant part of their plans (no operator would throw away the business they do here in the hope they could fill the airframes elsewhere). So the return of the fourth airframe must be on the cards. And if I allowed my mind to drift slightly off the reality scale - I can picture a fifth by 2018. But where does that take us? 1,400,000 -1,500,000 pax p.a. Still a cool million short of Stobart's target. Now I don't believe minor players will make up the difference - there has been absolutely no evidence that they are yet ready to commit to SEN. I absolutely support the view that others have expressed that SEN needs a second blue chip (sorry it's my age) operator to tempt the medium size, ambitious types to put the proverbial cherry on the cake.

[davidjohnson6]

I'm sorry if I'm being a bit thick, but I don't understand what having a 2nd sizeable airline at SEN does to tempt other smaller airlines to begin flying to SEN.

Easyjet have been flying from SEN since 2012 - the airport has had almost 4 years to resolve any teething issues and make their operational processes work. Easyjet show no immediate sign of leaving. Easyjet do not interline, codeshare or perform significant co-operation with any other airline - to Easyjet this is a point-to-point base, not a hub.

SEN management have shown what they can do on a day-to-day basis - if anyone had doubts about SEN proving themselves they will have been either confirmed or resolved long ago.

So what does having another sizeable airline at SEN do to encourage other smaller airlines to come forwrard ?

[tws123]

Even if 2.5 million ppa is reached by 2018, that's still only 50% of terminal capacity used. When will 5 million ppa be reached I wonder...

[DC3 Dave]

Davidjohnson6: Absolutely acknowledge the validity of your views. All I'm saying that IF another major operator signed up, then all those reasons for smaller operators to dismiss SEN and EZY's status here; reasons that you seemed to have nailed, would have to be revisited; reconsidered and could not be dismissed by anyone looking to expand in the increasingly crowded, expensive London market.

[LTNman]

......is still on the SEN website but, once again, nothing on the arrivals/departures board. Do you think we'll beat the five false starts already experienced elsewhere?!!

Well another day with no flights. This is like a plot out of Eastenders, will it or won't it?

[Barling Magna]

I'm sure that if Southend's runway was 500m longer (which it can't be) they would have no trouble attracting airlines. With the A320/321 and B737-800 so ubiquitous among European airlines there are many carriers that could not consider using SEN because of the restricted runway.

BUT..... there should still be enough companies with aircraft that can operate efficiently from Southend, AND we need to wait and see what the A320neo can do in terms of take off and landing distances.

[asdf1234]

Originally Posted by Barling Magna

I'm sure that if Southend's runway was 500m longer (which it can't be) they would have no trouble attracting airlines. With the A320/321 and B737-800 so ubiquitous among European airlines there are many carriers that could not consider using SEN because of the restricted runway.

BUT..... there should still be enough companies with aircraft that can operate efficiently from Southend, AND we need to wait and see what the A320neo can do in terms of take off and landing distances.

I said this right at the beginning and it's worth repeating now that we have seen yet another set of accounts showing a loss.

The management at Stobarts thought that EasyJet was an easy win. They had no experience in aviation and airports apart from Tinkler owning the odd private jet and helicopter. EasyJet have not paid their way and they scare off the competition. To base some aircraft at SEN instead of STN saved EasyJet money. But they still insisted on a sweetheart deal with "route promotion" rebates, etc, etc... The management at EasyJet saw Tinkler and crew coming and they picked their pockets.

It was a mistake inviting them in and another year goes by with another loss. It will only change when the management at SEN stop thinking of pax numbers and start thinking of profit. Pax numbers is vanity, profit is reality.

[AirportPlanner1]

asdf, I disagree. It might be true somewhere isolated or with a captive market, but not SEN.

The sort of airlines that might use SEN will not be interested in paying very much, and why should they with LGW/STN/LTN also keen for their business and no doubt offering their own sweeteners. Profit needs to come from passengers - look at STN and their drop-off charge. Volume fills up the car park, keeps the bar busy, occupies hotel rooms.