TUI/ First Choice
Join Date: Mar 2007
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We can do without unverified and speculative figures regarding the pension scheme being bandied around thanks. Even if accurate, which it isn't, who's interest is it serving?
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: UK
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Freddy
The last actuarial valuation dated March 2004 showed a deficit of £93.5 Million in a statement sent to me as a deferred pensioner in Dec 2006. It went on to state that the valuation to 31st March 2006 would be presented to the Trustees shortly so we are still in the dark as to what the present state is.I want to know even if you do not as to what this merger will mean with regard to Pension Fund Deficits.
All of this will have to be in the public domain with this merger and is not a secret
The last actuarial valuation dated March 2004 showed a deficit of £93.5 Million in a statement sent to me as a deferred pensioner in Dec 2006. It went on to state that the valuation to 31st March 2006 would be presented to the Trustees shortly so we are still in the dark as to what the present state is.I want to know even if you do not as to what this merger will mean with regard to Pension Fund Deficits.
All of this will have to be in the public domain with this merger and is not a secret
Join Date: Feb 1999
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wrt merging the seniority list - probably date of joining is the fairest way, actually would not help me but one has to think long term. The deal with who flys what?? Basically, we have to think long term.
The FCA guys should get behind Balpa and enjoy (Pensions, Block window protection, excellent leave setup, long salary scales, working agreements)
The FCA guys should get behind Balpa and enjoy (Pensions, Block window protection, excellent leave setup, long salary scales, working agreements)
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: England
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Good news?
Things could turn out extremely positive for both companies. There will now only be two major players in the UK travel industry (Thomas Cook Group and Tui Travel Plc) and that can only mean strength. Of course everyone will be worried about job cuts, but i'm sure most of the synergy benefits come from all over the place, not just pilot job losses.
It's potentially very exciting, and lets all try to keep our heads high so that we can merge together stronger and better than we are at present. Please, as some others have said, no bitching!
(Just look at the Bacon V Flybe thing, although that's mainly down to mis-management of the situation).
It's potentially very exciting, and lets all try to keep our heads high so that we can merge together stronger and better than we are at present. Please, as some others have said, no bitching!
(Just look at the Bacon V Flybe thing, although that's mainly down to mis-management of the situation).
Join Date: Mar 1999
Location: uk
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Millerscourt:
Having just ploughed through the whole press release, one of the "contributions" that TUI are making is some hefty debt which includes all pension liabilities.
There was also a bit buried in there that says the new set up will safeguard employees rights. Whether this means all the goodies we currently enjoy at TUI is open to question! It could be a simple statement that they intend to meet the legal requirements on the subject - as has been said, the Cabin Crew are facing CAP371 as a target rather than as a maximum.
Any FCA guys want to chip in on what your T&Cs, salaries etc are like?
Personally I think this is a great opportunity for all. Sadly we have a few who are still bemoaning their lot re the Orion thing 20 odd years ago and a few towards the bottom of the list who are unhappy for various reasons (see a recent TFly thread on T&Cs). As a very rough guide, about 2/3rds of the TUI seniority list is post 1997 and probably 1/3 is post 2003 on a list about 750 in total. How does that square with FCA?
Anyhoo: We are a long way off from all that but I can only echo the sentiments of others: Let's keep it civil and try and get the best from both organisations in all respects and back our CCs because sure as eggs is eggs, the power brokers will be after going for the cheapest in all respects.
Having just ploughed through the whole press release, one of the "contributions" that TUI are making is some hefty debt which includes all pension liabilities.
There was also a bit buried in there that says the new set up will safeguard employees rights. Whether this means all the goodies we currently enjoy at TUI is open to question! It could be a simple statement that they intend to meet the legal requirements on the subject - as has been said, the Cabin Crew are facing CAP371 as a target rather than as a maximum.
Any FCA guys want to chip in on what your T&Cs, salaries etc are like?
Personally I think this is a great opportunity for all. Sadly we have a few who are still bemoaning their lot re the Orion thing 20 odd years ago and a few towards the bottom of the list who are unhappy for various reasons (see a recent TFly thread on T&Cs). As a very rough guide, about 2/3rds of the TUI seniority list is post 1997 and probably 1/3 is post 2003 on a list about 750 in total. How does that square with FCA?
Anyhoo: We are a long way off from all that but I can only echo the sentiments of others: Let's keep it civil and try and get the best from both organisations in all respects and back our CCs because sure as eggs is eggs, the power brokers will be after going for the cheapest in all respects.
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: STN
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First choice were looking around Stansted last week, The word then
was that they were looking into 7-12 longhaul routes from STN for 2008,
at the time I like others thought "yer yer" whatever but now I dont know.
was that they were looking into 7-12 longhaul routes from STN for 2008,
at the time I like others thought "yer yer" whatever but now I dont know.
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Manchester
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First Choice (air 2000) /Leisure Airlines merger
When this occured despite assurances from Management their was a deliberate attempt to go for the lowest common denominator on both terms and conditions. Luckily Leisure had a strong CC, air 2000 at the time did not.
Now both TUI and First Choice Airways have Balpa agreements and CCs. Please can BALPA bring both together sooner rather than later and ensure a united approach.
As THE last of the originals who will be affected I hope for a positive outcome.
Alan Jones FCA
Now both TUI and First Choice Airways have Balpa agreements and CCs. Please can BALPA bring both together sooner rather than later and ensure a united approach.
As THE last of the originals who will be affected I hope for a positive outcome.
Alan Jones FCA
Join Date: Nov 2005
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Westie,
I am sure that you are right about the Airbus. I just can not help remembering being told during an interview with Thompson that they feel a single manufacturer fleet (Boeing) is much more cost effective. They were also at the time investigating with the CAA the possibility of mixed fleet ratings (737/757/767). I am sure that this has now been validated and is now in the process of being put in place. I could very well be wrong, and perhaps any Thomson pilots reading this could put me in the picture.
I am sure that you are right about the Airbus. I just can not help remembering being told during an interview with Thompson that they feel a single manufacturer fleet (Boeing) is much more cost effective. They were also at the time investigating with the CAA the possibility of mixed fleet ratings (737/757/767). I am sure that this has now been validated and is now in the process of being put in place. I could very well be wrong, and perhaps any Thomson pilots reading this could put me in the picture.
Join Date: Aug 2000
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Interesting numbers about 787 orders. 23? Am I right in thinking FCA had ordered 12? TUI announced 65 orders with Boeing (for fleet replacement, but no types mentioned). My guess then was that the majority would be 737-NG and possibly some 787s. Perhaps this is the 'announcement' of the 787s in TUI, through a back door?!?
I suspect that the new airline will be all 737-NG and 787 in time. Just a personal opinion, but I don't see the Airbusses staying long-term, not with TUI already going 737-NG and 'whatever Boeing' to replace the ageing 767s. Add to that the fact that FCA were already ordering 787s and it would seem to be logical that FCA would join the rest of TUI as a Boeing airline.
Many of us in TFly have been alarmed over the last few years at our 'floundering' in turbulent seas whilst the market changed fundamentaly around us. I personally think this news is very good for both companies, but will inevitably lead to redundancies for many. I suspect the crews will be safe enough for quite some time, as the 'synergies' producing £100m per year savings will be back office related to start with.
I wish all those in FCA well.
PP
I suspect that the new airline will be all 737-NG and 787 in time. Just a personal opinion, but I don't see the Airbusses staying long-term, not with TUI already going 737-NG and 'whatever Boeing' to replace the ageing 767s. Add to that the fact that FCA were already ordering 787s and it would seem to be logical that FCA would join the rest of TUI as a Boeing airline.
Many of us in TFly have been alarmed over the last few years at our 'floundering' in turbulent seas whilst the market changed fundamentaly around us. I personally think this news is very good for both companies, but will inevitably lead to redundancies for many. I suspect the crews will be safe enough for quite some time, as the 'synergies' producing £100m per year savings will be back office related to start with.
I wish all those in FCA well.
PP
Join Date: Aug 2000
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They were also at the time investigating with the CAA the possibility of mixed fleet ratings (737/757/767). I am sure that this has now been validated and is now in the process of being put in place.
PP
Join Date: Feb 1999
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I think the creation of TUI Travel PLC, a UK based company is perhaps the best news. The Germans were very good at the administration but less good at creation and develpoment of the brands with in TUI.
It shall be listed on the FTSE in London (share options???
?) Peter Long has a big job on his hands.
Hopefully, the synergies in the airline business does not mean a reduction in aircrfat numbers and commands, etc.
Balpa get creative and get moving.
It shall be listed on the FTSE in London (share options???
?) Peter Long has a big job on his hands.Hopefully, the synergies in the airline business does not mean a reduction in aircrfat numbers and commands, etc.
Balpa get creative and get moving.
Join Date: Aug 2004
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Yes, it does seem to be 23 787's. TUI announced an order during the late autumn for 61 Boeing aircraft but this has not yet been listed by Boeing in their weekly listings. It would now seem that that order consisted of 11 787's and 50 737NG's. On that basis the FCA Airbus would seem to be doomed to disposal.
Join Date: Jun 2001
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Can anyone from TUI UK comment on the appointment of Christoph Mueller as Aviation Director? He's currently with Hapag-Lloyd, has anyone knowledge of the guy? How has the TUI experience been since German ownership?
30W
30W
Join Date: Aug 2003
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Only this time last month First Choice was certain of a deal with Thomas Cook so why such a rush into a decision with TUI? A month doesn't seem a long time to organise a merger? I don’t know too much about business so perhaps it is long enough?
Can anybody see how this will get past the EU Competition when MyTravel (a smaller company then TUI) was blocked when it attempted to purchase First Choice?
Can anybody see how this will get past the EU Competition when MyTravel (a smaller company then TUI) was blocked when it attempted to purchase First Choice?
Join Date: Aug 2006
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Can anybody see how this will get past the EU Competition when MyTravel (a smaller company then TUI) was blocked when it attempted to purchase First Choice?
Yeah , all down to in-house Commercial politics!