Ryanair at Shannon?
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Good to see MOL going back to his homeland for expansion - what I'd like to know is if FR will ever expand north of the border.
The scattering match that would ensue would be worth witnessing!
The scattering match that would ensue would be worth witnessing!
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SNN-Nantes officially confirmed, 3/week from November 1st, 737-800 !!
Press conferences today morning.
Already updated on ryanair.com !
Press conferences today morning.
Already updated on ryanair.com !
Last edited by jsd95; 7th Jul 2005 at 14:57.
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Anybody any info on the expansion at LDY? Im a little confused! Do they still use the ex-Buzz 733's I cant see MOL letting a 738 go into LDY with 130 pax. Whats the story on the LDY r/w?
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scattering match that would ensue
Who would scatter? and to where? Flybe? surely not EasyJet? even less likely...... Allan we must by now have reached saturation on the amount of traffic this area can stand?.I look forward to your insight as to the areas for TRUE competition.....perhaps ex BFS to NWI?
Not edited ...etc etc etc
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Hi all,
I flew LGW-SNN on EZY and outbound was about 60/70% load factor and coming back it was around 30% so not just FR who could do better out of SNN.
As has been said there is scope for based aircraft at Shannon but I think what FR is currently doing is ambitious!
As for the LGW-SNN this winter there will be 2x738's and 2x319's a day (680 seats approx supply) someone is going to be the looser!
I flew LGW-SNN on EZY and outbound was about 60/70% load factor and coming back it was around 30% so not just FR who could do better out of SNN.
As has been said there is scope for based aircraft at Shannon but I think what FR is currently doing is ambitious!
As for the LGW-SNN this winter there will be 2x738's and 2x319's a day (680 seats approx supply) someone is going to be the looser!
Join Date: Sep 2004
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Both Ryanair and EasyJet will persist with losing fortunes head to head in Ireland at NOC, SNN and less so at ORK.
The implications for the share price of both companies if one of them gives into the other on these routes is massive. If EasyJet back out of SNN or NOC - Ryanair will exploit it to the hilt - crushing EasyJet's share price. Such is the fickle nature of the city and it is being played out on the West of Ireland.
Easy share price has more than doubled since Oct 04 - so they are not going to jeopardise city sentiment by pulling out of SNN.
The implications for the share price of both companies if one of them gives into the other on these routes is massive. If EasyJet back out of SNN or NOC - Ryanair will exploit it to the hilt - crushing EasyJet's share price. Such is the fickle nature of the city and it is being played out on the West of Ireland.
Easy share price has more than doubled since Oct 04 - so they are not going to jeopardise city sentiment by pulling out of SNN.
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@ neidin:
Interesting that you should say that.
As far as I can see, the EZY services between LGW and NOC, ORK and SNN are still not for sale beyond 29th October.
Tickets for the only other airport pairs on which EZY and FR compete head-to-head (EMA - CIA, STN - LEI and STN - VLC) appear to have been released.
Is it too early to draw conclusions?
Interesting that you should say that.
As far as I can see, the EZY services between LGW and NOC, ORK and SNN are still not for sale beyond 29th October.
Tickets for the only other airport pairs on which EZY and FR compete head-to-head (EMA - CIA, STN - LEI and STN - VLC) appear to have been released.
Is it too early to draw conclusions?
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Anna
Too early to say if Easy will put those routes on sale or not, there are a number of gaps in the schedule BFS ex LGW and BLQ ex STN still missing
neidin
First rule of bean counting is to stop losses. Staying on a loss making route to support the share price can only be a short term solution and will only lead to problems in the end. Better to cut loss making routes and concentrate on making a profit which shareholders want and they will support the share price if the profit remains intact.
Too early to say if Easy will put those routes on sale or not, there are a number of gaps in the schedule BFS ex LGW and BLQ ex STN still missing
neidin
First rule of bean counting is to stop losses. Staying on a loss making route to support the share price can only be a short term solution and will only lead to problems in the end. Better to cut loss making routes and concentrate on making a profit which shareholders want and they will support the share price if the profit remains intact.
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Mr. Bean I agree with your logic entirely - but sadly logic and LCC's share prices do not tally.
If EasyJet blink against FR in SNN or ORK they will get mauled by the markets. FR will kill them with the finacial analysts and press if EasyJet have to pull back and that could cause huge problems for EasyJet going forward. It does not make sense to stay on loss-making routes - unless leaving them causes you to lose a bigger war. I guess they could maybe drop NOC with less complaints - but even that would be risky for EasyJet.
As for FR - no way they will ever pull back from this farews war with EasyJet in Ireland.
If EasyJet blink against FR in SNN or ORK they will get mauled by the markets. FR will kill them with the finacial analysts and press if EasyJet have to pull back and that could cause huge problems for EasyJet going forward. It does not make sense to stay on loss-making routes - unless leaving them causes you to lose a bigger war. I guess they could maybe drop NOC with less complaints - but even that would be risky for EasyJet.
As for FR - no way they will ever pull back from this farews war with EasyJet in Ireland.
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Neidin
We know you will do anything to retain the flights, including putting out silly rumours regarding the share price. However, with the oversupply of seats at both NOC and SNN, the ridiculously low yield combined with poor load factors something will give very soon.....wait and see! Without making business sense it won't contine....it is not even near to making a contribution to the bottom line.
We know you will do anything to retain the flights, including putting out silly rumours regarding the share price. However, with the oversupply of seats at both NOC and SNN, the ridiculously low yield combined with poor load factors something will give very soon.....wait and see! Without making business sense it won't contine....it is not even near to making a contribution to the bottom line.
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Edge, of course you are right, it does not make sense to run massively loss making routes and for Europe's two largest low cost carriers to wage a bitter fares war at marginal locations such as NOC, ORK and SNN.
But whoever blinks and gives in will suffer at the hands of spin doctors, twentysomething stock market analysts and the media.
If Easy gives into Ryanair in Ireland their share price will get hammered.
Maybe the twist in the tale will be EasyJet's rumoured moves to open a real low cost operation at Kerry where a brand new regional bus hub is being built with hourly services to Cork and Limerick cities.
But whoever blinks and gives in will suffer at the hands of spin doctors, twentysomething stock market analysts and the media.
If Easy gives into Ryanair in Ireland their share price will get hammered.
Maybe the twist in the tale will be EasyJet's rumoured moves to open a real low cost operation at Kerry where a brand new regional bus hub is being built with hourly services to Cork and Limerick cities.
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Interesting facts. I am inclined to think that Ryanair is in a worse position than Easyjet if EZY do not withdraw from the Irish routes soon:
- The Shannon base seems to have been a reaction to the Oranges entering Irish territory. As has been discussed, there are probably more lucrative places in Europe where Ryanair can dump capacity.
- By flooding the market with seats, the self-inflicted damage to revenue on existing Irish routes from London may have a very significant impact on Ryanair profitability.
- It seems that Ryanair had to use its Gatwick-Dublin slots to compete head to head - there must be a significant opportunity cost to that move!
I can't help but think that Ryanair overreacted a bit and that at the end of the day, Ryanair may well be worse of than EZY. Maybe this was even a deliberate provocation by the Oranges to make Ryanair react irrationally?
In any case, it will be interesting to see what the outcome will be of this clash of masculinity.
I have noted, however, that Ryanair are increasingly looking to compete with other low fare airlines. For example, they have just announced a number of routes that compete against SkyEurope and Wizz, two airlines that probably have a very low cost base as well because they are based in Eastern Europe.
Could it be that the European low-cost sector is becoming increasingly crowded?
Pete
- The Shannon base seems to have been a reaction to the Oranges entering Irish territory. As has been discussed, there are probably more lucrative places in Europe where Ryanair can dump capacity.
- By flooding the market with seats, the self-inflicted damage to revenue on existing Irish routes from London may have a very significant impact on Ryanair profitability.
- It seems that Ryanair had to use its Gatwick-Dublin slots to compete head to head - there must be a significant opportunity cost to that move!
I can't help but think that Ryanair overreacted a bit and that at the end of the day, Ryanair may well be worse of than EZY. Maybe this was even a deliberate provocation by the Oranges to make Ryanair react irrationally?
In any case, it will be interesting to see what the outcome will be of this clash of masculinity.
I have noted, however, that Ryanair are increasingly looking to compete with other low fare airlines. For example, they have just announced a number of routes that compete against SkyEurope and Wizz, two airlines that probably have a very low cost base as well because they are based in Eastern Europe.
Could it be that the European low-cost sector is becoming increasingly crowded?
Pete
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I remember the days when apart from everything else we used to have 2 operational bases at HHN and SNN. And it was hell difficult to change/position crews on a short notice between these bases... Few times it resulted in a hire of business jet (that's the way to make the crew happy, isn't it?), otherwise it was Hahn to FRA on a taxi, then FRA-LHR-SNN...
The real relief was Ryanair who opened HHN-SNN direct
The real relief was Ryanair who opened HHN-SNN direct
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Easyjet Expansion
New Easyjet routes announced today give Ryanair a taste of their own medicine
LGW MJV
LGW GNB both Ryanair routes ex STN
DTM BCN
DTM MPX both Ryanair routes ex HHN
GVA LIS
GVA AGP
But still no winter schedule on ORK, SNN and NOC
They have loaded LGW BFS however which was missing earlier this week
LGW MJV
LGW GNB both Ryanair routes ex STN
DTM BCN
DTM MPX both Ryanair routes ex HHN
GVA LIS
GVA AGP
But still no winter schedule on ORK, SNN and NOC
They have loaded LGW BFS however which was missing earlier this week
