New routes for Bristols new extension
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Whats this another rumour about RYR basing aircraft as BRS and not DSA i thought that was decided. But i did here the rumour 3/4weeks ago that RYR were thinkin of basing at BRS cant see it myself EZY got all the parking spaces lol BRS is a bigger and busiest airport than CWL, weather they got more long haul routes than us or not. But our terminal is more modern and airly, the airport is friendly and fairly quick when collectin your luggage on the arrival belts and both online performance with most airlines. And another of the welsh do go over the brigde and work at BRS coz there more jobs if any, than at CWL.
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WindSheer
You make a very good point about the Toronto route. In some ways BRS has been unlucky though. I vaguely remember Nation Air operating to YYZ in the 80s from BRS and I certainly remember Odyssey International doing so around 89/90 with 757s. At first they went via NCL to pick up pax en route but it was quickly realised they could fill the aircraft from BRS so stopped at (I think) PIK to take on fuel, but not pax. Can't remember which tour operator (s) Odyssey carried for but the airline went bust after, I believe, the first season.
Can't recall another operator until 2000 when Royal Air did the route with A 310s via GLA. The next year Canada 3000 took over Royal Air and the equipment became 757s also via GLA. Canada 3000 then ceased to operate at the end of that summer season and the Canada cupboard has been bare since.
Apart from CWL, the airport down the road at EXT has had a weekly summer YYZ for many years, usually via another airport, I believe BHX this year. Now there must be a reason why no-one is jumping in to fill the void at BRS. I remember speaking to someone fairly senior at BRS just before the new terminal was built asking why there was a dearth of transatlantic routes (in fact there weren't any then). The answer was that airlines would be "falling over themselves" to launch such routes when the new terminal was finished. Apart from CO we are still waiting!
I don't believe that a lack of potential pax is the problem. The BRS area is far more populous than EXT and more so than CWL and it is a well-off area too - just read Barbara Cassani's book on 'Go' to see it was BRS's exceptional access to a populous, well-heeled clientele, many with oodles of disposable income, that made the airline such a success there from day one.
The airport seems to attract pax for most of its routes like the proverbial bees and honeypots so why is the Atlantic ignored? Both the present MD and his predecessor have assured me in letters that the runway is not the problem so what is the problem?
You make a very good point about the Toronto route. In some ways BRS has been unlucky though. I vaguely remember Nation Air operating to YYZ in the 80s from BRS and I certainly remember Odyssey International doing so around 89/90 with 757s. At first they went via NCL to pick up pax en route but it was quickly realised they could fill the aircraft from BRS so stopped at (I think) PIK to take on fuel, but not pax. Can't remember which tour operator (s) Odyssey carried for but the airline went bust after, I believe, the first season.
Can't recall another operator until 2000 when Royal Air did the route with A 310s via GLA. The next year Canada 3000 took over Royal Air and the equipment became 757s also via GLA. Canada 3000 then ceased to operate at the end of that summer season and the Canada cupboard has been bare since.
Apart from CWL, the airport down the road at EXT has had a weekly summer YYZ for many years, usually via another airport, I believe BHX this year. Now there must be a reason why no-one is jumping in to fill the void at BRS. I remember speaking to someone fairly senior at BRS just before the new terminal was built asking why there was a dearth of transatlantic routes (in fact there weren't any then). The answer was that airlines would be "falling over themselves" to launch such routes when the new terminal was finished. Apart from CO we are still waiting!
I don't believe that a lack of potential pax is the problem. The BRS area is far more populous than EXT and more so than CWL and it is a well-off area too - just read Barbara Cassani's book on 'Go' to see it was BRS's exceptional access to a populous, well-heeled clientele, many with oodles of disposable income, that made the airline such a success there from day one.
The airport seems to attract pax for most of its routes like the proverbial bees and honeypots so why is the Atlantic ignored? Both the present MD and his predecessor have assured me in letters that the runway is not the problem so what is the problem?
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Thats a true point, CWL had more long haul route for years. yet BRS has always had the pax numbers I.E. more pax a year than CWL. BRS last year handled 4.5million and this year prob be 5.5million yet doesnt since to attract long haul route, but on the charter and european market it seems to be going from strenght to strenght. How far is CWL behieve BRS is Pax numbers? If AA are using smaller equipement like 757s to NCL nxt year to JFK and MAN to BOS, BRS could attract other american carriers. EK weather its BRS or prob CWL it will not be long til they come to the south west. Would TCX ever operate at 757 to YYZ from BRS like GLA and BHX, LGW like they have been this summer. I mean alot of carriers using the 757 with ESTOPs, have found it a ideal aircraft for the long haul sector.
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rampboy
I think you are asking about CWL pax numbers.
The latest CAA stats for July this year show CWL having a total of just under 1.8 million pax for the rolling 12 months ending 31 July 2005, down 6.8% on the total twelve months previously.
As a comparison BRS is showing just under 4.9 million pax, up 13.2% and EXT 745,000, up a massive 49.7%.
I believe LGS 6753 may be correct in saying that Dubai will become the new Benidorm, albeit a more up market version. I saw a TV programme earlier this year that prophesied that Dubai would become the biggest single holiday destination in the world within a decade.
If it happens I expect there will be charter or scheduled flights there from most UK regional airports by that time.
I think you are asking about CWL pax numbers.
The latest CAA stats for July this year show CWL having a total of just under 1.8 million pax for the rolling 12 months ending 31 July 2005, down 6.8% on the total twelve months previously.
As a comparison BRS is showing just under 4.9 million pax, up 13.2% and EXT 745,000, up a massive 49.7%.
I believe LGS 6753 may be correct in saying that Dubai will become the new Benidorm, albeit a more up market version. I saw a TV programme earlier this year that prophesied that Dubai would become the biggest single holiday destination in the world within a decade.
If it happens I expect there will be charter or scheduled flights there from most UK regional airports by that time.
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I know it will dissapoint a lot of people but BRS is NOT going to extend teh runway. Not now not for 2015 and not for 2030. There is no need to a quick look on Boeings website at their new 787 will show you why there is just no need to do it. It would cause so many problems with the locals and the terraine at each end doesnt support this.
BRS will see increase in the Long Haul market in the next few years but somestic a european is going to see the most expansion services which will complement not compete with existing routes. If CWL do get their EK flight I think you might probably see it 3 a week who is to say that they wont throw in BRS 3 a week as well I know they are working on something maybe even Gulf air Dubai.
How are CO's CAA stats looking MV they seem to be around the 80-85% mark this month.
I think we will see several new French routes coming up for the summer season coming not to mention an increase in German routes for the World cup.
Id also be suprised if we dont see a couple Scandanavian routes soon.
T21
BRS will see increase in the Long Haul market in the next few years but somestic a european is going to see the most expansion services which will complement not compete with existing routes. If CWL do get their EK flight I think you might probably see it 3 a week who is to say that they wont throw in BRS 3 a week as well I know they are working on something maybe even Gulf air Dubai.
How are CO's CAA stats looking MV they seem to be around the 80-85% mark this month.
I think we will see several new French routes coming up for the summer season coming not to mention an increase in German routes for the World cup.
Id also be suprised if we dont see a couple Scandanavian routes soon.
T21
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Fernando,
You have confused me here (I am easily confused though).
Is there a suggestion that Gulf Air (GF) is interested in BRS or CWL?
Thus far the only rumour is I am aware of is Emirates (EK) from CWL.
terrier,
I note your remarks about the runway extension and I agree with you that at present it is in the too-hard-to-do-basket and is unlikely even to be contemplated for at least a decade and then, as you suggest, it might not be necessary anyway.
However, I hadn't realised there was a problem with the terrain to the east from a physical point of view - the land seems flat although the A 38 would have to be covered. NIMBY-wise certainly there would be a problem because it would mean encroaching on the common land.
You have confused me here (I am easily confused though).
Is there a suggestion that Gulf Air (GF) is interested in BRS or CWL?
Thus far the only rumour is I am aware of is Emirates (EK) from CWL.
terrier,
I note your remarks about the runway extension and I agree with you that at present it is in the too-hard-to-do-basket and is unlikely even to be contemplated for at least a decade and then, as you suggest, it might not be necessary anyway.
However, I hadn't realised there was a problem with the terrain to the east from a physical point of view - the land seems flat although the A 38 would have to be covered. NIMBY-wise certainly there would be a problem because it would mean encroaching on the common land.
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If AA are using smaller equipement like 757s to NCL nxt year to JFK and MAN to BOS, BRS could attract other american carriers
Although, I personally think Bristol is not an airport for long-haul. That is more likely Cardiff's job.
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Although, I personally think Bristol is not an airport for long-haul. That is more likely Cardiff's job.
It would be instructive if you were to give your reasons for this opinion.
I sometimes think of BRS and CWL in football terms. BRS gets the bigger crowds but CWL has the better ground (terminal building excepted).
As for New York, I thought it would have been a more instant success but there are signs that things might be beginning to improve. We have debated possible reasons for the slowish start to the route in this thread previously so I won't go over old ground.
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Nice FCA delay the last couple of days G-OOAH with major tech problems, FUE was ment to go 0705 weds morn but eventually pushed 1015 thurs morning.
A/C went tech and needed engine runs, once work was complete and after storms weds afternoon it couldnt get out in time for FUE closing so pax hoteled.
Most pax seemed good as gold about the whole thing, total delay of 27 hrs, biggest FCA have ever copped at BRS.
A/C went tech and needed engine runs, once work was complete and after storms weds afternoon it couldnt get out in time for FUE closing so pax hoteled.
Most pax seemed good as gold about the whole thing, total delay of 27 hrs, biggest FCA have ever copped at BRS.
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WATABENCH
Has someone at FCA got a great sense of humour basing G-OOAH at BRS? I believe this a/c has been around the Lulsgate prairies for quite some time.
There seems to have been a number of delays with both FCA 321s out of BRS for several days according to Ceefax and the BRS webarrivals/departure board.
Has someone at FCA got a great sense of humour basing G-OOAH at BRS? I believe this a/c has been around the Lulsgate prairies for quite some time.
There seems to have been a number of delays with both FCA 321s out of BRS for several days according to Ceefax and the BRS webarrivals/departure board.
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Well either AH or they'd send AF down which is just as bad!
Lets start a campaign - Bring back AV, Bring back AV!
Your right though MV, the FCA 321s seem to be struggling this year
Lets start a campaign - Bring back AV, Bring back AV!
Your right though MV, the FCA 321s seem to be struggling this year
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Would have struggled a lot less if servisair had supplied some ramp staff to handle it last night......but hey thats a different story.
Thanks to the fire staff who stepped in any how
Apparently an a/c operating out of schedule is not allowed at BRS, all the staff go home. Cheers
Thanks to the fire staff who stepped in any how
Apparently an a/c operating out of schedule is not allowed at BRS, all the staff go home. Cheers
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Windsheer: I think you'll find that it's SOP at any/every airport that an off-schedule flight doesn't get priority ahead of an on-schedule one. It's not a question of the handling agent being "unable to provide ramp staff"; they can't be forced to stay back at work. Anyway, the whole delay thing started when 'AH went tech and the a/c were switched round so that the first departure operated with the first available chariot 'AE and then 'AH went tech down-route in Funchal and came back even later which knocked onto the BOJ (or BJV - can't remember) and subsequently the FUE on top of which BY's CDUO went tech as well and they brought a spare a/c in and BRS ended up with 4 757's in the area at the same time and I've lost the plot....roll on the winter season!
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People are not going to stay on for overtime for one delayed flight late at night and i had another busy, hard day on the ramp. The manings levels is due to night stift and another late crew being the only staff at nite, and with the easyjet night stoppers and other charters and the mail so people are working on aircraft anyway. Wow the fire section came out of their station, i bet they were slow offloading that FCA i bet they didnt have a clue and they prob charged the airline a fair bit of money. lol 
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My opinions differ to yours redfield.
None of us want a/c to go tech, and certainly dont want delays of 27 hours plus. In these cases airlines need the backing of their handling agents (that incidentally get business from FCA 12 months of the year at BRS), to help prevent delays creeping further. If an a/c is out of schedule the last thing you want is a 90 minute turnaround due to lack of ground staff.
Its very apparent that servisair take their monopoly of Bristol airport for granted, if there was an alternative handling agent in attendance would they have such a relaxed attitude. I think not. 12 months of neglect in delay situations would force airlines to 'switch'.
Besides, passenger handling staff and dispatchers have no issues with staying on to handle delayed flights so why is there an issue outside the terminal building. Thanks again to the fire staff!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
None of us want a/c to go tech, and certainly dont want delays of 27 hours plus. In these cases airlines need the backing of their handling agents (that incidentally get business from FCA 12 months of the year at BRS), to help prevent delays creeping further. If an a/c is out of schedule the last thing you want is a 90 minute turnaround due to lack of ground staff.
Its very apparent that servisair take their monopoly of Bristol airport for granted, if there was an alternative handling agent in attendance would they have such a relaxed attitude. I think not. 12 months of neglect in delay situations would force airlines to 'switch'.
Besides, passenger handling staff and dispatchers have no issues with staying on to handle delayed flights so why is there an issue outside the terminal building. Thanks again to the fire staff!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Windsheer: You misunderstand. I didn't state my opinion, merely a fact. It's not a "lack of ground staff." It's not a question of "neglect in a delay situation." It's not a question of "need the backing of their handling agents." You can't force people to stay back for delayed flights and work sixteen hour shifts as a result. Flight decks don't work sixteen hour shifts, they have legal limits on what they can work and once those limits are exceeded they can't fly. Flights are frequently delayed because crews are out of hours. Standard Operating Procedure at any airport is that the handling agent will safeguard an on-time departure ahead of handling a delayed flight. All handling agents do this.
Unfortunately I can't really comment on "passenger agents and dispatchers not having any issues with staying back and why should there be an issue on the ramp." You may be right, but then again there probably are issues that neither of us are aware of. Most of the ramp staff are represented by a different union, maybe it's something to do with that.
A few questions out of interest. Which flight or flights would you have had delayed to release a crew for your flight? How do you think their flight decks would feel about this? More to the point, how would YOU feel if Servisair delayed your flight because they handled an a/c that was delayed ahead of loading yours?
On the subject of a second handling agent, It would be interesting to see what would happen if someone like Menzies/Swissport etc did move into Bristol, however I doubt that it'll happen in the near future. There's too many issues to address that the airport would have problems with in the short term. Where to house their check-in and ramp crews offices to start with, and where do they park their equipment? Space is at a premium. You can't have one agent doing all the marshalling, bus driving, ambulifts etc if there's two agents, so who does this and who carries out the training? It's all very well speculating about a second agent arriving, but so many people forget about all the associated issues that would need to be addressed as a result.
Unfortunately I can't really comment on "passenger agents and dispatchers not having any issues with staying back and why should there be an issue on the ramp." You may be right, but then again there probably are issues that neither of us are aware of. Most of the ramp staff are represented by a different union, maybe it's something to do with that.
A few questions out of interest. Which flight or flights would you have had delayed to release a crew for your flight? How do you think their flight decks would feel about this? More to the point, how would YOU feel if Servisair delayed your flight because they handled an a/c that was delayed ahead of loading yours?
On the subject of a second handling agent, It would be interesting to see what would happen if someone like Menzies/Swissport etc did move into Bristol, however I doubt that it'll happen in the near future. There's too many issues to address that the airport would have problems with in the short term. Where to house their check-in and ramp crews offices to start with, and where do they park their equipment? Space is at a premium. You can't have one agent doing all the marshalling, bus driving, ambulifts etc if there's two agents, so who does this and who carries out the training? It's all very well speculating about a second agent arriving, but so many people forget about all the associated issues that would need to be addressed as a result.