Excel airways & Air Atlanta Europe Merger.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: LGW-London
Age: 42
Posts: 17
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Excel airways & Air Atlanta Europe Merger.
Could anyone shed anymore light on this subject for us please?
We hear from the camps of AAE & XLA that the mother company of Air Atlanta Icelandic. Have this week bought a massive majority in the remaining stakes of Excel airways.
As we are all proberbly awear, Air Atlanta Icelandic already own 40% shares in the british charter company, & they have just purchased a futher 40% over the last week.
The press announcement ment is due at the end of this week or the beginning of the first week of October!
AAE & XLA crews are all reporting the same rumour of merger, of there two companies, of which that they have sourced from senior dept managers - to which they are being told to play down until the announcement has been made.
It would seem like a logical move for The viking mummy to mould her two british arms into 1. & would make Excel an even stronger driving force in the British charter market.
Is this good news for the AAE crews or The XLA crews or both? As XLA has the better Brand, but AAE have The longhaul routes & Aircraft.
The AAE crews are a small & close nit family, & may not take kindly to being taken off there mainly 747 longhaul fleets!
Yet the veteran Excel crew, we would think! to be desprate to transfer over to there newly aquired 747 longhaul fleet. (who wins?)
AAE crews are reporting that there 2 new 747-300s that are due to come on line at the end of Nov, to replace there older 200 series.
Are in the paint shop at the moment, & in particular the aircraft that is due to be based in LGW is being painted up in full Excel Airways colours over in Amsterdam at the time of us writing this message.
If anyone could help or to confirm to us the rumour of the merger, it would im sure put alot of minds at rest!!!
thanks.
We hear from the camps of AAE & XLA that the mother company of Air Atlanta Icelandic. Have this week bought a massive majority in the remaining stakes of Excel airways.
As we are all proberbly awear, Air Atlanta Icelandic already own 40% shares in the british charter company, & they have just purchased a futher 40% over the last week.
The press announcement ment is due at the end of this week or the beginning of the first week of October!
AAE & XLA crews are all reporting the same rumour of merger, of there two companies, of which that they have sourced from senior dept managers - to which they are being told to play down until the announcement has been made.
It would seem like a logical move for The viking mummy to mould her two british arms into 1. & would make Excel an even stronger driving force in the British charter market.
Is this good news for the AAE crews or The XLA crews or both? As XLA has the better Brand, but AAE have The longhaul routes & Aircraft.
The AAE crews are a small & close nit family, & may not take kindly to being taken off there mainly 747 longhaul fleets!
Yet the veteran Excel crew, we would think! to be desprate to transfer over to there newly aquired 747 longhaul fleet. (who wins?)
AAE crews are reporting that there 2 new 747-300s that are due to come on line at the end of Nov, to replace there older 200 series.
Are in the paint shop at the moment, & in particular the aircraft that is due to be based in LGW is being painted up in full Excel Airways colours over in Amsterdam at the time of us writing this message.
If anyone could help or to confirm to us the rumour of the merger, it would im sure put alot of minds at rest!!!
thanks.
Cool Mod
Join Date: Apr 1998
Location: 18nm N of LGW
Posts: 6,185
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Unless the rules have changed somewhat - I stand corrected if they have.
But, no-one other than another EU country can hold more than 49% in a British airline. Since Iceland is not a EU member.........
If this is the case the control of the airline must remain with the British board.
Time will tell.
But, no-one other than another EU country can hold more than 49% in a British airline. Since Iceland is not a EU member.........
If this is the case the control of the airline must remain with the British board.
Time will tell.
Chieftan o'the Pudden Race
Join Date: Nov 1997
Location: Scotland usually, and often other parts of Europe
Age: 55
Posts: 826
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
PPRuNe Pop,
Iceland is a member of the JAA.
It is also a member of the UN, NATO, The Council of Europe (CE), The European Economic Area (EEA), and The European Free Trade Area (EFTA) amongst others.
EC Council Regulation 2907/92 on on licensing of air carriers requires that operating licences may only be issued to undertaking owned directly or through majority ownership by Member States and/or nationals of Member States. It also requires that it shall at all times be effectively controlled by such States or such nationals. This Regulation has been extended by the EEA Agreement. So if I understand the situation correctly a UK airline can be owned and controlled by nationals of any EC/EEA state which includes Iceland.
I vaugely remember AAI set up a UK company Air Atlanta Europe Limited and applied for a UK AOC to operate a couple of 767's out of the UK.
Iceland is a member of the JAA.
It is also a member of the UN, NATO, The Council of Europe (CE), The European Economic Area (EEA), and The European Free Trade Area (EFTA) amongst others.
EC Council Regulation 2907/92 on on licensing of air carriers requires that operating licences may only be issued to undertaking owned directly or through majority ownership by Member States and/or nationals of Member States. It also requires that it shall at all times be effectively controlled by such States or such nationals. This Regulation has been extended by the EEA Agreement. So if I understand the situation correctly a UK airline can be owned and controlled by nationals of any EC/EEA state which includes Iceland.
I vaugely remember AAI set up a UK company Air Atlanta Europe Limited and applied for a UK AOC to operate a couple of 767's out of the UK.
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Surrey
Posts: 132
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The 747-300 are still with Corsair, and when they do arrive will eventually wear the colours of Travel City Direct, as they will be the main charterer of them.
The head office of AAE will relocate to a building next to XLA's in Mitre Court...as far as I know thats it...no merger on the cards..
Also heard that Atlanta want the rest of XLA....
The head office of AAE will relocate to a building next to XLA's in Mitre Court...as far as I know thats it...no merger on the cards..
Also heard that Atlanta want the rest of XLA....
Cool Mod
Join Date: Apr 1998
Location: 18nm N of LGW
Posts: 6,185
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hi Flypuppy,
But it isn't a member of the European Union. I am aware about EFTA. That has been around for several years. But I am still unconvinced that a British airline can be controlled by foreign nationals. I tried for several years to overcome this.
More info please.
It is also a member of the UN, NATO, The Council of Europe (CE), The European Economic Area (EEA), and The European Free Trade Area (EFTA) amongst others.
More info please.
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Dorset
Posts: 674
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Iceland or Norway are not EU members but are signatories to the EU Third Package that includes aviation freedoms. Both Icelandic and Norwegian carriers can therefore act as if they are EU carriers and an Icelandic or Norwegian shareholder can take a controlling stake in an airline in another EU country.
Now on to the rumours at hand.
It has been suggested for quite some time that the big man at the helm of AAI wants to take full control of Excel and buy out the remaining 40% shareholding from Libra. It gives him almost full control of Excel and you wonder if he is to merge Air Atlanta Europe and Excel. Why have two UK AOCs when you only need one? As far as the Icelanders are concerned then running one UK AOC is one too many based on the level of hassle that it is supposed to be causing for them.
What is amazing is the ability of Excel for things like this to happen but for the announcements to be delayed! You are supposed to announce things to the stock market first before letting them leak, but exactly the same rumours went before AA's original purchase of 40% of Excel. Half the world seemed to know what was going on before it was formally announced and so don't expect it to be any different this time.
Excel took the TravelCity contract on board with the AA 747s because they thought they could do better than European did. The operational record (even apart from the hurricane disruption which could have happened to anyone) has been actually worse than European's with major tech/crewing delays, disorganised on-board service and poor product. European wasn't perfect but it seemed to be able to do better than AA.
Also has anyone else heard rumours that the tour operator that went pop last week owed Excel quite a lot of money because they had not paid Excel and other airlines for a lot of their flying?
Now on to the rumours at hand.
It has been suggested for quite some time that the big man at the helm of AAI wants to take full control of Excel and buy out the remaining 40% shareholding from Libra. It gives him almost full control of Excel and you wonder if he is to merge Air Atlanta Europe and Excel. Why have two UK AOCs when you only need one? As far as the Icelanders are concerned then running one UK AOC is one too many based on the level of hassle that it is supposed to be causing for them.
What is amazing is the ability of Excel for things like this to happen but for the announcements to be delayed! You are supposed to announce things to the stock market first before letting them leak, but exactly the same rumours went before AA's original purchase of 40% of Excel. Half the world seemed to know what was going on before it was formally announced and so don't expect it to be any different this time.
Excel took the TravelCity contract on board with the AA 747s because they thought they could do better than European did. The operational record (even apart from the hurricane disruption which could have happened to anyone) has been actually worse than European's with major tech/crewing delays, disorganised on-board service and poor product. European wasn't perfect but it seemed to be able to do better than AA.
Also has anyone else heard rumours that the tour operator that went pop last week owed Excel quite a lot of money because they had not paid Excel and other airlines for a lot of their flying?
Cool Mod
Join Date: Apr 1998
Location: 18nm N of LGW
Posts: 6,185
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Albert Hall,
Thanks that seems to answer the question.
Iceland or Norway are not EU members but are signatories to the EU Third Package that includes aviation freedoms. Both Icelandic and Norwegian carriers can therefore act as if they are EU carriers and an Icelandic or Norwegian shareholder can take a controlling stake in an airline in another EU country.
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: UK
Posts: 76
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Rumour (for what it is worth) says that AAI is increasing the stake in Excel to 70%.
The moving spirit is a man called Magnus Thorsteinsson who made his money in booze in Russia. He's Icelandic but currently lives in UK. There's some English names as owners of Atlanta Europe but no-one knows who they are.
He owns most of AAI and Islandflug and now Excel.
As Branson said, to make a small fortune in the airline industry, start with a big one.
What's he up to?
The moving spirit is a man called Magnus Thorsteinsson who made his money in booze in Russia. He's Icelandic but currently lives in UK. There's some English names as owners of Atlanta Europe but no-one knows who they are.
He owns most of AAI and Islandflug and now Excel.
As Branson said, to make a small fortune in the airline industry, start with a big one.
What's he up to?
The Aquatone Article
Join Date: May 2004
Location: London
Posts: 167
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Albert Hall,
I heard the rumour two/three months ago that Excel were bankrolling Golden Sun big-style this summer, i.e. half-a-mill plus. GS is the the tour op that went down.
Foreign ownership and control issues are complicated. Monarch's ultimate ownership was (is?) Swiss, I believe.
The huge perceived difference between sched service and charter operations is also relevant here. With charter no one much minds. But try to use UK route authority for a sched service operation to a point outside the EU where the UK ATL holder concerned is majority-owned by a non-UK national. and the DCA at the other end of the route (and or the foreign reciprocating carrier), can stop you.
In this case it doesn't matter whether the non-UK national concerned is an EU citizen or not, obviously.
I heard the rumour two/three months ago that Excel were bankrolling Golden Sun big-style this summer, i.e. half-a-mill plus. GS is the the tour op that went down.
Foreign ownership and control issues are complicated. Monarch's ultimate ownership was (is?) Swiss, I believe.
The huge perceived difference between sched service and charter operations is also relevant here. With charter no one much minds. But try to use UK route authority for a sched service operation to a point outside the EU where the UK ATL holder concerned is majority-owned by a non-UK national. and the DCA at the other end of the route (and or the foreign reciprocating carrier), can stop you.
In this case it doesn't matter whether the non-UK national concerned is an EU citizen or not, obviously.
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Operate from Somerset International.
Age: 51
Posts: 64
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
A merger?!!
Hi all!!
We need the various other Ppruners who are working for XLA to add their input on this one.....
BUT! - As you're all aware some 18% of the XLA Group is owned by the Senior Management of the airline (Excel). The Libra part is down by 40% (bought by AAI some months ago). Libra has a "dodgy" reputation for its money and origins. Which coincidentily is the same rumour that I'd heard about Monarch (all beit some years ago!)
Now, a certain Chief Exec of Excel One/Excel 24 (the brokerage and Commercial side of the Excel Group - someone will no doubt will correct me if I'm wrong!) is also a member of the board of directors of Libra and from what I understand is a non-executive member of the board of Air Atlanta Icelandic......
Can you see where I'm going on this thought?!
Does anyone remember what happend to Peach Air and Caledonian.... the same people were involved then. Thats how Sabre Airways became Excel Airways. The name Excel existed before a good two years before the Airline was launched.
Now my way of thinking is that The same thing could happen to XLA/EUK/AAI (The 3 seperate companies as they are now). Would become one huge Airline. But there is no way that that Excel Airways could run all three in the current guise. The Ops/Crewing dept has a bad enough time just trying to run its own long haul op with their own C/crew but (and this is where the problem is) AAI run the F/crew side of things and is a constant thorn in the side of and Crew Controller.
So why try to create a mega charter carrier? The only thing that would end up happening is a complete bag of spanners which would be a black hole for cash! I really don't think that the Senior Management would except this outcome (a merger) as it would undermine everything that the company has worked for since its launch.
All employees of Excel should be aware of the "Employee Forum" - Thats the place to get your answers.......
We need the various other Ppruners who are working for XLA to add their input on this one.....
BUT! - As you're all aware some 18% of the XLA Group is owned by the Senior Management of the airline (Excel). The Libra part is down by 40% (bought by AAI some months ago). Libra has a "dodgy" reputation for its money and origins. Which coincidentily is the same rumour that I'd heard about Monarch (all beit some years ago!)
Now, a certain Chief Exec of Excel One/Excel 24 (the brokerage and Commercial side of the Excel Group - someone will no doubt will correct me if I'm wrong!) is also a member of the board of directors of Libra and from what I understand is a non-executive member of the board of Air Atlanta Icelandic......
Can you see where I'm going on this thought?!
Does anyone remember what happend to Peach Air and Caledonian.... the same people were involved then. Thats how Sabre Airways became Excel Airways. The name Excel existed before a good two years before the Airline was launched.
Now my way of thinking is that The same thing could happen to XLA/EUK/AAI (The 3 seperate companies as they are now). Would become one huge Airline. But there is no way that that Excel Airways could run all three in the current guise. The Ops/Crewing dept has a bad enough time just trying to run its own long haul op with their own C/crew but (and this is where the problem is) AAI run the F/crew side of things and is a constant thorn in the side of and Crew Controller.
So why try to create a mega charter carrier? The only thing that would end up happening is a complete bag of spanners which would be a black hole for cash! I really don't think that the Senior Management would except this outcome (a merger) as it would undermine everything that the company has worked for since its launch.
All employees of Excel should be aware of the "Employee Forum" - Thats the place to get your answers.......
Last edited by BlueEagle; 5th Oct 2004 at 13:39.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: LGW-London
Age: 42
Posts: 17
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
hi there,
Thank you for your imput on this one!
Its proving to be a very intresting subject, as there has been no announcements, Yet!!!
But both parties envovled (excel & Air Atalnta Europe) staff & crew all seem to be very awear of what is happing with there 2 copmanies.
The latest news from the crews at both airlines is that the 2 companies will be 1 single unit by next summer, & trading under the name of Excel Airways.
Air Atlanta Icelandic will retain its name & operation but will put people in place at Excel to run its British arm.
As we well know that Air Atlanta Icelandic, are a very wealthy company aswell as being very srude, this is how they have built there multi Billion Dollar empire over the past years.
So this is why - they will not think twice, about removing people from the top at excel & replacing them with there own.
They simply would not allow Excel to dictate to them the running of there airline. Running, meaning within the margins of CAA rules.
Thank you for your imput on this one!
Its proving to be a very intresting subject, as there has been no announcements, Yet!!!
But both parties envovled (excel & Air Atalnta Europe) staff & crew all seem to be very awear of what is happing with there 2 copmanies.
The latest news from the crews at both airlines is that the 2 companies will be 1 single unit by next summer, & trading under the name of Excel Airways.
Air Atlanta Icelandic will retain its name & operation but will put people in place at Excel to run its British arm.
As we well know that Air Atlanta Icelandic, are a very wealthy company aswell as being very srude, this is how they have built there multi Billion Dollar empire over the past years.
So this is why - they will not think twice, about removing people from the top at excel & replacing them with there own.
They simply would not allow Excel to dictate to them the running of there airline. Running, meaning within the margins of CAA rules.
PPRuNe Bashmeister
Join Date: Nov 1998
Location: Essex UK
Posts: 277
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Found this on the financial news wires
RNS Number:7588D
Excel Airways Group PLC
06 October 2004
6 October 2004
Excel Airways Group plc
Press Comment
The Board of Excel Airways Group plc (the "Company") have noted a press article
released yesterday and wish to comment as follows. The board is aware that
talks have taken place between Air Atlanta and Libra (the two major shareholders
of the Company) which could result in Air Atlanta acquiring the majority of
Libra's 39 per cent. shareholding. In this event Air Atlanta would acquire a
majority shareholding and will trigger the need to make a cash offer for all of
the outstanding share capital not already owned by it. The Board of Excel
Airways is aware that the price per share at which the share acquisition would
take place is materially below the current share price.
The Board will keep shareholders informed of future developments.
Contacts:
Teather & Greenwood Limited
Christopher Hardie/Jon Drage 020 7426 9000
Buchanan Communications
Richard Darby 020 7466 5000
This information is provided by RNS
The company news service from the London Stock Exchange
END
RNS Number:7588D
Excel Airways Group PLC
06 October 2004
6 October 2004
Excel Airways Group plc
Press Comment
The Board of Excel Airways Group plc (the "Company") have noted a press article
released yesterday and wish to comment as follows. The board is aware that
talks have taken place between Air Atlanta and Libra (the two major shareholders
of the Company) which could result in Air Atlanta acquiring the majority of
Libra's 39 per cent. shareholding. In this event Air Atlanta would acquire a
majority shareholding and will trigger the need to make a cash offer for all of
the outstanding share capital not already owned by it. The Board of Excel
Airways is aware that the price per share at which the share acquisition would
take place is materially below the current share price.
The Board will keep shareholders informed of future developments.
Contacts:
Teather & Greenwood Limited
Christopher Hardie/Jon Drage 020 7426 9000
Buchanan Communications
Richard Darby 020 7466 5000
This information is provided by RNS
The company news service from the London Stock Exchange
END
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Dorset
Posts: 674
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
This appeared in today's Sunday Times Business bit:
It looks like questions are finally being asked about the way that these people behave.
Stand by for more takeover denials
PRUFROCK is keeping a close eye on developments at Excel Airways, the quoted airline group. Our check-in spies tell us it is in talks with MyTravel, one of Britain’s biggest holiday companies, about taking over a chunk of its flying next year.
Not so, says Excel, there is absolutely no truth to the story. That should be the end of that, except we are nervous when it comes to Excel. When we called 10 days ago, after being told one of its major shareholders, the Icelandic tycoon Magnus Thorsteinsson, was about to take control by buying out Libra Holidays, we were told nobody was available to talk to us.
Imagine our surprise when on Tuesday, two trading days after our call, Excel told the stock market that Thorsteinsson was in talks to buy out Libra, a move that would trigger a bid for the entire company. What’s more, the offer would be “materially below the current share price” — a statement that unsurprisingly caused the shares to plummet. All of which begs the question why Excel did not make the statement sooner. If we were in a position to know about the talks (they had become something of an open secret in the small world of the holiday industry) then so were the market traders able to make money from the gossip. So, for the moment, Prufrock will reserve judgment on the veracity of the MyTravel rumours.
PRUFROCK is keeping a close eye on developments at Excel Airways, the quoted airline group. Our check-in spies tell us it is in talks with MyTravel, one of Britain’s biggest holiday companies, about taking over a chunk of its flying next year.
Not so, says Excel, there is absolutely no truth to the story. That should be the end of that, except we are nervous when it comes to Excel. When we called 10 days ago, after being told one of its major shareholders, the Icelandic tycoon Magnus Thorsteinsson, was about to take control by buying out Libra Holidays, we were told nobody was available to talk to us.
Imagine our surprise when on Tuesday, two trading days after our call, Excel told the stock market that Thorsteinsson was in talks to buy out Libra, a move that would trigger a bid for the entire company. What’s more, the offer would be “materially below the current share price” — a statement that unsurprisingly caused the shares to plummet. All of which begs the question why Excel did not make the statement sooner. If we were in a position to know about the talks (they had become something of an open secret in the small world of the holiday industry) then so were the market traders able to make money from the gossip. So, for the moment, Prufrock will reserve judgment on the veracity of the MyTravel rumours.
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Europe...the country?
Posts: 51
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Avion Group i.e AAI, Islandflug and Excel
Avion Group was just founded by combining the forces of Air Atlanta Icelandic, Air Atlanta Europe, Excel Airways and Islandflug into one enormous entity of wet lease operations. Apparently, one of the biggest airlines of the sort if not the biggest. Hide your virgins because the invasion of the flying vikings is in overdrive!
Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 58
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Say it ain't so!
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: UK
Posts: 76
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Heard a story at Gatwick yesterday that one of the main people behind Excel, name of Wyatt I think, is setting up a 767 airline to fly out of Gatwick next year.
No further details known.
No further details known.