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Cork Airport - a summer of decline?

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Old 6th Aug 2004, 12:36
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Cork Airport - a summer of decline?

Hi all.

There is presently an interesting thread about Dublin Airport on this forum. It is a good thread. I am fond of Dublin Airport. A visit to Dublin Airport at an early age definitely contributed to my love of aviation. So, I do not want to sidetrack anything discussed on the Dublin thread by starting a thread about Cork.

Now, I must go on. There is a new terminal being built at Cork at present along with with lots of related civil engineering projects like new roads, multi-storey carparks etc which all contribute to a certain amount of day to day disruption. All quite understandable to a degree.

That said the plot has been lost big time at Cork Airport this summer. There has been no ILS to runway 17 since June. It has been decommissioned so as to install a new system which will not be ready until some time in September. Yesterday, the weather was bad once again and three flights diverted to Shannon, the FR 905 and the bmi baby flights from Gatwick and Manchester. To date about 1,600 passenegers have been diverted to Shannon since the decommissioning of the ILS. This is a shambles. Why has the Cork Airport passenger been shown this contempt at the busiest time of year? What was wrong with the old ILS? The Irish Aviation Authority are responsible for the ILS at Cork. Why was the decision taken to remove the ILS at the busiest time of year? Was Aer Rianta Cork included in any discussions leading up to the decision to remove the ILS at the busiest time of the year? Could the IAA have offered PAR approaches to aircraft in poor weather? Cork Airport must be the laughing stock at the moment with this kind of bad publicity being created with so many passengers being lost due to diversions. Shannon could not pay for this kind of anti-Cork publicity and to think that it is self inflicted!

It gets worse. Corporate aircraft have been regularly and needlessly refused overnight parking at Cork over the last few months. Aircraft dropping their corporate passengers at Cork and then the aircraft having to fly on to Shannon for overnight parking before returning once again to Cork for their passengers. Even the visiting MD80 series aircraft of the Romaninan PM had to park at Shannon for the night! A few visiting German Do-328s were also refused parking and had to park at Kerry for the weekends involved. Is Aer Rianta Cork a properly run business wanting to make a profit or not? I imagine the overnight parking fees for a Global Express or a Gulfstream must be a lucrative sum? The Aer Rianta workers groups are quick to remind us that Cork and Shannon could not survive on their own financially without Dublin support. Well, with the business example of Cork this summer you can see how that could be the case all right!

Cork has lost many routes this summer too. The downgrading of CDG, AMS, MAN, BHX, LHR and STN speaks volumes when at the same time you see Dublin cramming in more and more new airlines. Now, you have FR hawking around the Irish airports with new 737-800s so they can get someone to pay for them! Thomsonfly will shortly be a new entrant to Cork from Coventry. Who in their right mind will want to depart Coventry at 7 am for Cork. Come on, get those timings changed before there is another failure!

Historically, there was a kind of culture at Cork during the bad old days due to boredom and little traffic. Again, understandable to a degree. The last ten years of growth have been great and is a credit to all the hard work. However, there is still more to do and now is not the time to take the eye off the sliothar! One more thing, can we drop one of those crazy new approach roads in favour of another 200 metres on 17/35. It would be money very well spent.

Corcaigh Abu!
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Old 6th Aug 2004, 12:48
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Angel

Tom

Slightly off topic, I know - have you any idea what support the RE Cork - Belfast City is getting - gather quite a lot of leisure users as well as business - maybe a chance for weekend rotations to be added.
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Old 6th Aug 2004, 12:58
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I am getting mad now and I do not wish to be taking up any more bandwith than I have all ready done but I have just been advised by a Captain who was witness to another dreadful carry on at Cork last week. A pilgrimage flight to Lourdes was awaiting her passengers on Stand 9, the heavens opened and the pilgrims got absoutely drenched. Now, I imagine some of the pilgrims could well be very ill people wanting to travel to Lourdes for spiritual reasons. The rub here is that closer stands were free and could have been used but no, Cork has a thing about wanting to shove charters as far away as possible from the terminal away from the scheduled aircraft operatios. No buses at Cork. Why not? Again, another example of the shabbiness being dished out to the Cork Airport passenger.

This is dreadful.
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Old 7th Aug 2004, 23:52
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Saturday, 7th August, 2004 - A day of disgrace for Cork Airport

Today, Saturday, 7th August, 2004 has been a day of disgrace for Cork Airport. It has also been a day of disgrace for the city, the county and the people of Cork.

Just after 1 pm today the chaos and the diversions begun. Around the time the wind was 110 degrees, 12 knots. Visibility was 5 Kms in showers and cloud was at 200 to 500 feet.

The ILS to runway 17 remains off the air.

The bmi baby from LGW was first and made two attempts at approach before diverting to Shannon. She was followed on approach by an Icebird flight and she later diverted as did a NetJets flight that stuck it out for a good while before she too headed to Shannon.

The next aircraft BD471 from LBA also showed up but later also diverted to Shannon.

Two Aer Lingus flights from LHR, EI713 & EI715 also ended up diverting to Shannon.

Later when the weather improved somewhat the Icebird flight returned to land at Cork minus her passengers. At Shannon the pax chose to quit their flight in spite of the Captain encouraging them to hold on for the weather to break at Cork. The WW flight also returned to Cork. She did one more go around before eventually landing at Cork.

The EI713 left Shannon and headed south for Cork and she was passed by EI715 on her way north to Shannon! The EI713 eventually returned to Cork possibly with her passengers. Not sure, sorry. Meanwhile, EI715 disembarked her passengers at Shannon and insult upon insult these disembarked passengers had to wait for another 2 hours at Shannon before being recovered to Cork by coaches despatched from Cork!

Up to 800 or so passengers have been lost to Cork today. The passengers are people whom have been inconvenienced in a gross, disgusting manner and whom have been shown the greatest disrespect.

The ILS was not working at Cork today. It is probable all of today's diverted flights would have landed safely at Cork today if the ILS had been in commission. There is speculation in Cork that the introduction of the new ILS has been put back again to late September. This is the second or third deferral. Why?

Would it not be appropriate now for Aer Rianta Cork to offer apologies and some explanations to the passengers and people of Cork?

Would it not also be appropriate for The Irish Aviation Authority to offer apologies and explanations of their role in the present debacle?
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Old 8th Aug 2004, 09:04
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As one who flies to Cork (as operating crew) once or twice a month, I enjoy the visit, albeit a 30 minute turn around. The ground staff and ATC ers are super friendly, really and sincerely. But it has a character all of it's own. Once someone has met the pax, the ground staff seem to disappear for ages. Probably because we park near the new terminal (under construction). And then the pax kind of shamble out, often with little or no guidance from ground people. But they are so friendly, the captains never get angry about it. Me: I'm just the FO, so it's not my place to be giving out instructions of that sort.

As I say, I enjoy Cork days. I might even get my backside in gear and come salmon fishing or bass fishing later in the year.

BTW: is it true that Cork is known as the Venice of Ireland? If so, why is Venice not referred to (in my hearing) as the Cork of Italy?
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Old 8th Aug 2004, 21:28
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Danger

I think I agree with everything that TOM THE TENOR has had to say so far.
The fact of the matter is that Summer is no doubt probably the best time to carry out non-precision approaches at Cork Airport.
The airfield elev' of 502' makes it the highest piece of ground in the vicinity of the city. This coupled with the prevailing north atlantic weather systems, make Cork almost unique among Irish airports, in that low cloud just loves to hang out there.

I personally see no reason why an ILS should take months to replace, but then again I don't work for Aer Rianta, the airports authority.
I wonder who picks up the bill for the disruption to literally thousands of passengers. All the usual players are staying most quiet.
Still only another month or so till winter gets going and then the disruption will really settle in.
Perhaps we could pray to the weather Gods for Northerlies 'til d'ILS is restored on 17.
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Old 9th Aug 2004, 12:22
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I know that First Choice won't be using ORK again after this summer.
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Old 9th Aug 2004, 14:42
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If I'm correct the regulatory authority which in this case is the IAA merely approve the ILS and associated plates. Although the airport is run by Aer Rianta....in theory the authority have nothing to do with selection of provider, installation, etc etc. Is this just a new ILS or is it new wiring also? Is is full new kit (localiser and glideppath)? Can't understand the length of time!!!
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Old 9th Aug 2004, 15:06
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All passengers travelling between Cork and London Heathrow yesterday on the entire EI schedule were told that the delays were due to the weather at Cork. That one must have been dreamt up by one of Blair's or Bertie's spin doctors.

Ms Spurtle, yes, Falcon are choosing not to base an aircraft in Cork next summer by all accounts. However, should not make any or v little difference.

Firestorm, the business district of Cork, the South Mall, would have been under water somewhat from flooding periodically during the 1700s/1800s and a lot of the buildings were built with little moorings and steps up to first floors. A very loose comparison with Venice I am sure! By the way do you have a Honda Firestorm?

Belfast is fine to the best of my knowlege. That is as much as I know as I have been working long hours recently. Last year when GX were on the route the numbers eased off a little in August but later picked up again from September. I would say RE might put weekend flights on if they had the spare capacity which they dont!

Work is in progress today on the installation of the ILS.

The Skibbereen Eagle is still watching though so no slacking off again!

Your are on the ball, runwaysedge. Aer Rianta hire the contractor to do the work on the installation of the ILS. However, some big shots from the IAA have to be on site to supervise the work being done. As for the kind of kit being put in it better be a new everything and no half jobs only to return again later. That prospect would totally wipe me out!
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Old 10th Aug 2004, 09:17
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It is interesting to record that there was a considerable media circus above at Cork last night for the return home of the self confessed athletics dope taker, Cathal Lombard, off the FR907 from STN. Could have done with the Press Pack's presense last Saturday and Sunday.

Looks like "They" are wriggling out of it again!

ALLMC, this afternoon's load on the RE303 to BHD was very strong.

Last edited by Tom the Tenor; 10th Aug 2004 at 20:15.
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Old 23rd Aug 2004, 10:24
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Just Saw this On Unsion.ie


Aer Lingus planning four new routes from Cork Airport



11:42 Monday August 23rd 2004



Aer Lingus has announced plans to establish four new routes between Cork Airport and contintental Europe from next summer. The airline said it was planning to operate direct flights from Cork to Munich, Rome, Nice and Faro. Aer Lingus already flies from Cork to seven other destinations.

Last edited by lowfaresbuster; 23rd Aug 2004 at 10:48.
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Old 23rd Aug 2004, 11:05
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If true, credit where credit is due! Hope the ILS will be working and that there is enough ramp space to handle all the extra welcome movements. Nice to see that Jetmagic's existance was not all for nothing. Made Willy think a bit, anyway! Even Milan looks like being kept on? A bit of surprise that but obviously very welcome.

Some updates now of the plans for the new routes next year:

Faro x 3/7
Munich x 3/7
Nice x 2/7
Rome FCO x 2/7

Barcelona up to x 3/7
Malaga up to x 4/7
Amsterdam up to x 9/7.

Alicante to stay x 2/7
Milan MXP to stay x 2/7.
Paris CDG to be reinstated at x7/7 beginning winter schedule.

There is every chance that London Heathrow will be fine tuned a bit so that the above can all be fitted in with the three based aircraft and with a fourth Dublin based aircraft doing a bit too. Cork should be quite a hectic place once again next summer. Wonder where all the bizjets will park?

Roll on the new terminal! If next year goes well the new terminal will be needed big time!

After the recent series of near circus clown antics at Cork it has to be acknowledged today's announcements have been one hell of an improvement.

Ar aghaidh leis an obair linn go leir!

Last edited by Tom the Tenor; 23rd Aug 2004 at 16:42.
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Old 24th Aug 2004, 16:40
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Thumbs up Flight Precision at Cork Airport

At last some firm progress on the work of installing the new ILS to runway 17 at Cork. A Beech Super King Air of Flight Precision was airbourne from Cork today for a number of hours making approaches and go arounds to runway 17 presumably in connection with the commissioning and calibrating of the long awaited new ILS.

Two consecutive days of good news from Cork! All very positive.
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Old 25th Aug 2004, 11:36
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Hi Tom,thanks for kicking off an interesting thread. Nice to see progress on the way at last. Hopefully the scenario of the victorious county team diverting to EINN in the early hours of last Sunday morning will not be repeated

I can throw in my two cents regarding the civil works at the airport entrance. My day job brought me up there on two occasions in the last few weeks and involved electrical alterations at the entrance roundabout, and from talking to engineers on site,apparently the access road required realignment to a lower level relative to the start of RW07. This was due to new IAA regs apparently,but according to the guy on site,even after works are completed the road elevation will still be too high! I should stress that this is second-hand info and as such is open to correction, as am I. Still, it seems just a tad inefficient,even when the associated road widening is taken into account. Hope this is not indicative of Aer Riant management culture in general

Regards
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Old 25th Aug 2004, 12:26
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Thanks for that. Funny that you should bring up the subject of the approach roads in from the gates to the terminal. Yesterday, I decided to walk the road in from the gates and was wondering why the roads are now being placed so much lower. What bothered me even more was the level of pedestrian safety available along the way. Gee, you would have to have your wits about you to be sure. A case for having an Airport Policeman on the beat between the Cargo Terminal roundabout and the gates? I should hate to think that they might get wet, though!

What team diverted to EINN?

Managment culture, is it? Mind you, this is a good week so credit where credit is due and not only that but the very deep gully in the Short Term Car Park that would have ripped off your exhaust and knacked your suspension last week has now also been fixed as well!
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Old 26th Aug 2004, 15:00
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Hi Tom T T.

It was the Sunday that Cork gave Wexford a lesson in hurling!!
Myself and ryan were out celebrating the Cork victory, and more importantly, the birth of his Daughter!
I was showing him my ATC scanner and we heard two A/C circling Cork airport. One was the FCA airbus that they have based up there, and the other was a RE from Dublin, with a call sign that is not one of the scheduled flight numbers from DUB. As far as I was aware at the time, the Cork team had flown up to DUB that morning on an RE atr (they regulary charter such lately now for games) and so by putting 2 + 2 together, I concluded that this must be their flight?
It was about 12.00am and eventually the two A/C gave up and diverted to EINN.

I heard 2nd hand that it was something like 5am before they got bussed back to Cork Airport.

I dont know if the ILS on 17 being out contributed to this, because the night in question was a pretty fine night, the only conclusion must have been that the airport was fog boung, so ILS on either runway wouldn't have helped inthis case?

As a side note, I heard the other day (Tuesday I think) that Beech Super King aircraft on the Cork ATC frequencies, couldn't make out what was going on (was only listening for a few mins, wuz late for work!!) but it all makes sense to me now once reading your post....
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Old 26th Aug 2004, 19:41
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Thumbs up

It was the hurlers on their way home from Croker after trouncing Wexford. I think it was an Aer Arann flight. Not sure what steps were taken to safeguard the pedestrians on the way in, but Rohcon to their credit did have the obligatory guy in a hi-vis keeping an eye on the traffic. He had a few wet days though!
Kudos to the airport management also on sorting that dreaded bump. I got overly familiar with it one dark night while negotiating the car park!

Here's to the continuation of good news!

Ryan

Just saw your contribution Eoin and had to acknowledge

Ryan
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Old 27th Aug 2004, 11:32
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Another bit of good news

Emerald airways will shortly be commencing Liverpool-Cork-Liverpool at a frequency of 9 flights per week
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Old 27th Aug 2004, 14:58
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Is this a wind up?

I thought Emerald Airways was an old defunct airline?

9 times a week from Cork? Holy smoke!

Sorry FlyCorkInternational, I owe you a big apology.


Didn\'t do me research, and when I did, found this http://www.flyjem.com

Interesting looking airline. Only doing LPL to Isle of man.

Wonder if anyone has any stats on how Jetmagic got on when the did this same route? Their freq was something like twice a day I thought or something like that?
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Old 27th Aug 2004, 16:50
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No its not a wind up - and no need to apologise.
Word is it will be officially anounced next week, and the equipment used will be ATP's
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