Ryanair new routes
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Ryanair new routes
Hahn-Santander daily from 31.10.
Hahn-Riga daily from 31.10.
Stansted-Santander daily from 20.9.
Stansted-Riga daily from 31.10.
Stansted-Zaragoza daily from 1.12.
Rome-Ciampino-Santander daily from 20.9.
Rome-Ciampino-Eindhoven daily from 20.9.
Tampere-Riga daily from 31.10.
Source:
http://www.airliners.de/community/fo...8899&forum=9&0
Hahn-Riga daily from 31.10.
Stansted-Santander daily from 20.9.
Stansted-Riga daily from 31.10.
Stansted-Zaragoza daily from 1.12.
Rome-Ciampino-Santander daily from 20.9.
Rome-Ciampino-Eindhoven daily from 20.9.
Tampere-Riga daily from 31.10.
Source:
http://www.airliners.de/community/fo...8899&forum=9&0
Last edited by Nothrills; 28th Jul 2004 at 08:51.
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Some great routes there. Stansted to Zaragoza is a dream come true. No more long coach journeys from BCN when you are already knackered! Stansted to Santander will be a winner too I am sure.
There's plenty of traffic, both air and shipping, down the east side of the Baltic between Finland (established "western" EC state in the region) and the three new "liberated" countries of Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania. Riga is the largest city in these three countries, and Air Baltic, the Latvian airline, has made a poor showing from there with only a handful of jet services so far (nice livery though !)
Tampere is the second city of Finland, and Ryanair's focus city in the country. It's little further from Helsinki than Hahn is from Frankfurt (not saying much I know).
When will Ryanair or Easy bite the bullet and move on St Petersburg and Moscow ?
Tampere is the second city of Finland, and Ryanair's focus city in the country. It's little further from Helsinki than Hahn is from Frankfurt (not saying much I know).
When will Ryanair or Easy bite the bullet and move on St Petersburg and Moscow ?
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WHBM
I don't think RYR is interested to fly SNN-MOW or SNN-LED. No other route to Russia MoL can even dream about. This market is strictly ruled by bilateral agreements. Same with Easyjet.
Also, many bilaterals are written in such way that there is technically no place for LoCos even if they want to be a part.
I don't think RYR is interested to fly SNN-MOW or SNN-LED. No other route to Russia MoL can even dream about. This market is strictly ruled by bilateral agreements. Same with Easyjet.
Also, many bilaterals are written in such way that there is technically no place for LoCos even if they want to be a part.
CargoOne:
I think that's traditional thinking of the type that led the established European majors to have markets lost to new competitors before they realised it. There is considerable pressure from Russia, right from the top at Presidential level, to integrate their country much more into Europe, which is now seen as their natural trading area, while the now considerable penetration of European goods into Russia (not least Airbuses!) shows it is a two-way street.
It's not there yet but there's been so much change in the last 10 years and the next few will be equally volatile. A liberalised air agreement with the EU would be a tremendous place for them to start, and an airline that gets in at the beginning of that would stand to gain immensely.
I think that's traditional thinking of the type that led the established European majors to have markets lost to new competitors before they realised it. There is considerable pressure from Russia, right from the top at Presidential level, to integrate their country much more into Europe, which is now seen as their natural trading area, while the now considerable penetration of European goods into Russia (not least Airbuses!) shows it is a two-way street.
It's not there yet but there's been so much change in the last 10 years and the next few will be equally volatile. A liberalised air agreement with the EU would be a tremendous place for them to start, and an airline that gets in at the beginning of that would stand to gain immensely.
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I see the normal FR cr@p about BA's high fares appears on their website. Why do FR state BA's London - Riga fare as being £674 one way when it clearly isn't? I looked at 6 varying departures from LHR to Riga and the average fare is £140 RETURN inc taxes. Also, FR state the comparison is based on a BA departure of 14JUL04. Why compare it with their own flights which don't start until 31OCT04 ?
Also, which current FR routes are going to close as a result of the new ones starting? Someone somewhere is going to suffer a loss of service.....
Also, which current FR routes are going to close as a result of the new ones starting? Someone somewhere is going to suffer a loss of service.....
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Yes, but as I mentioned in previous FR threads, the -300's are more than likely going to vanish. That leaves certain destinations open to closure (if you see what I mean). Not all the remaining -200's will be able to cover the current lines.
LRH, AOC, LDY being just 3.....
LRH, AOC, LDY being just 3.....
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WHBM
Are you seriously thinking that RYR will be around in 10 years time? I don't think so. At least it would be a very different RYR from what is it now. Traditional carriers already made their step to change downwards in terms of costs. Believe me, in 1 or 2 years time RYR and similar lowcosts will either disappear or will make a step upwards in pricing, so finally it would be very similar price and service on al intra-European routes. RYR started to dive Q4/2003 so let's wait until March 2005 to see the total score...
LoCos are not competitive on medium and long haul routes, longer you fly more unavoidable costs you have (fuel/mx/irc/etc), and rates are already quite low.
Also if you consider macro economical issues, the LoCos are not making the whole market better. In fact they making it worse. All LoCos primary goal is to reduce costs and expenses. OK, it allows them to offer a cheaper rates to passengers who are happy about it. However on more wide perspective it means they paying/spending less money, which is mean that suppliers, staff etc are getting less. Money are not dissapearing to nowhere in any case, doesn't matter if it is BA money or FR money. If one company spent more money it means other earned more. In their turn suppliers have less money to pay to their staff etc. In next turn people then spending less money on their expenses, including air travel etc.
Russia and China are most restrictive countries on this planet in terms of bilaterals and I don't see it would change in nearest future.
It's not there yet but there's been so much change in the last 10 years and the next few will be equally volatile. A liberalised air agreement with the EU would be a tremendous place for them to start, and an airline that gets in at the beginning of that would stand to gain immensely.
LoCos are not competitive on medium and long haul routes, longer you fly more unavoidable costs you have (fuel/mx/irc/etc), and rates are already quite low.
Also if you consider macro economical issues, the LoCos are not making the whole market better. In fact they making it worse. All LoCos primary goal is to reduce costs and expenses. OK, it allows them to offer a cheaper rates to passengers who are happy about it. However on more wide perspective it means they paying/spending less money, which is mean that suppliers, staff etc are getting less. Money are not dissapearing to nowhere in any case, doesn't matter if it is BA money or FR money. If one company spent more money it means other earned more. In their turn suppliers have less money to pay to their staff etc. In next turn people then spending less money on their expenses, including air travel etc.
Russia and China are most restrictive countries on this planet in terms of bilaterals and I don't see it would change in nearest future.
Last edited by CargoOne; 28th Jul 2004 at 10:43.
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Not really, ryanair are here to stay, so are easyjet and they will still be operating exactly the same as they are today in 10 years time! These two airlines are the two major locos in europe and probably the biggest and most powerful locos in the world along with southwest.
In a few years other low costs will disappear, such as FlyBe, Mytravellite, possibly Jet2 etc. This will mean more markets for Ryanair and easyjet to exploit.
Also, you said traditional airlines have already made a dive down in ticket prices.
Not really - only BA and possibly Lufthansa have done this in order to compete with Ryanair and Easyjet!. Major airlines that are living of state handouts and controlling monoplies in their country aren't reducing tickets at all - look at Air France and Alitalia.
There is a long long way to go before Ryanair and Easy will hike their prices up.
In a few years other low costs will disappear, such as FlyBe, Mytravellite, possibly Jet2 etc. This will mean more markets for Ryanair and easyjet to exploit.
Also, you said traditional airlines have already made a dive down in ticket prices.
Not really - only BA and possibly Lufthansa have done this in order to compete with Ryanair and Easyjet!. Major airlines that are living of state handouts and controlling monoplies in their country aren't reducing tickets at all - look at Air France and Alitalia.
There is a long long way to go before Ryanair and Easy will hike their prices up.
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Eat your heart out Russell Grant! Perhaps the old adage "THE BIGGER THEY ARE THE HARDER THEY FALL" might be appropriate here - judging by the recent stock market performance of both Easyjet & to a lesser extent Ryanair there is little room for complacency in either camp.
You might like to share the rationale behind such a sweeping prediction!
You might like to share the rationale behind such a sweeping prediction!
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CargoOne
So what is to stop them for applying for flights from Sansted ?
I don't think RYR is interested to fly SNN-MOW or SNN-LED. No other route to Russia MoL can even dream about. This market is strictly ruled by bilateral agreements
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Findo
Before Ryanair's application for regular traffic rights from STN to Russia could be even considered, MoL should complete all of the following steps:
1) establish a company incorporated under the law of England and Wales
2) get UK AOC
3) prove that 51%+ of this company is effectively owned/controlled by UK citizens/residents.
Otherwise he is not elegible even to apply under bilateral agreement terms.
Don't forget: open skies exist only WITHIN EU. Russia, China, USA and others are not considering EU as a single country, but treat it country by country. Any EU carrier operating from EU country (other than country of AOC) to non-EU country is effectively operating 5th freedom flights and should seek the rights for that. 5th freedom and Russia... Just forget about it.
Before Ryanair's application for regular traffic rights from STN to Russia could be even considered, MoL should complete all of the following steps:
1) establish a company incorporated under the law of England and Wales
2) get UK AOC
3) prove that 51%+ of this company is effectively owned/controlled by UK citizens/residents.
Otherwise he is not elegible even to apply under bilateral agreement terms.
Don't forget: open skies exist only WITHIN EU. Russia, China, USA and others are not considering EU as a single country, but treat it country by country. Any EU carrier operating from EU country (other than country of AOC) to non-EU country is effectively operating 5th freedom flights and should seek the rights for that. 5th freedom and Russia... Just forget about it.
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CargoOne.
What you have written above is in the course of changing. The EU has established that it has the sole authority for negotiating air service agreemnets on behalf of EU states. It is currently doing this with the USA and is intervening in other negotiations. The recent agreement between the UK and Hong Kong/Australia needed EU approval.
It is only a matter of time before other states sign up to EU wide agreements. When that happens it will be possible for RYR/EZY and many others to take advantage of new rights. Two such agreements already exist in Europe (with Norway and Switzerland) . RYR uses the agreement with Norway. EZY uses the agreement with Switzerland.
What you have written above is in the course of changing. The EU has established that it has the sole authority for negotiating air service agreemnets on behalf of EU states. It is currently doing this with the USA and is intervening in other negotiations. The recent agreement between the UK and Hong Kong/Australia needed EU approval.
It is only a matter of time before other states sign up to EU wide agreements. When that happens it will be possible for RYR/EZY and many others to take advantage of new rights. Two such agreements already exist in Europe (with Norway and Switzerland) . RYR uses the agreement with Norway. EZY uses the agreement with Switzerland.
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colegate
Yes I know. But could you remind me when EU-USA negotiations has been initiated? Was that a Ronald Reagan time or even earlier?
Don't forget that is EU intension to make other countries to treat EU (Brussels) as a signle HDQ for all member states. It doesn't mean other countries (especially China and Russia) will agree. To be honest I don't see legal grounds which may force other countries to accept it apart from good will. EU is not a country, it is just a Union so technically all member states should be treated separately.
Ofcourse things are changing but not that fast. Would it take 5 years or 10 years or 15 no one really knows.
Yes I know. But could you remind me when EU-USA negotiations has been initiated? Was that a Ronald Reagan time or even earlier?
Don't forget that is EU intension to make other countries to treat EU (Brussels) as a signle HDQ for all member states. It doesn't mean other countries (especially China and Russia) will agree. To be honest I don't see legal grounds which may force other countries to accept it apart from good will. EU is not a country, it is just a Union so technically all member states should be treated separately.
Ofcourse things are changing but not that fast. Would it take 5 years or 10 years or 15 no one really knows.
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It would be a very risky strategy for the locos to tackle destinations where arriving passengers face stringent visa requirements. I believe Russia is still such a country. Devastates a market's "short-break" appeal.
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Could Russian flights operate using Buzz or is that finally defunct? I seem to recall some folk on proon musing on extra-EU flights when Buzz was bought...