Duo plans to expand operations to the South
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Duo plans to expand operations to the South
Birimingham based Duo plans to expand operations to the South of England by
the end of the year
The airline , created from a management buyout of former BA franchise Maersk
Air , plans to open two new bases
Sales and marketing director Rob Rees said one base would be near a large
conurbation and another on the south coast
Leasing more aircraft was likely , he added , as the airlines eight strong
fleet was almost fully used
The carrier plans to station aircraft at Edinburgh , its second base , once
the fleet is expanded
the end of the year
The airline , created from a management buyout of former BA franchise Maersk
Air , plans to open two new bases
Sales and marketing director Rob Rees said one base would be near a large
conurbation and another on the south coast
Leasing more aircraft was likely , he added , as the airlines eight strong
fleet was almost fully used
The carrier plans to station aircraft at Edinburgh , its second base , once
the fleet is expanded
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DUO going down South?
Please please please consider BOH! A large, wealthy conurbation sprinkled with students (foreign and local) who like to explore Europe during their studies.
Not sure if the 'purple rinse brigade' will like the CRJ's though. Just checked their route map, no destinations in the warmer climate, these would appeal to those 'purple rinsers'.
Fingers crossed ................. we'd need another cash machine though!
Have heard that FR are still considering adding more flights later in the year.
Not sure if the 'purple rinse brigade' will like the CRJ's though. Just checked their route map, no destinations in the warmer climate, these would appeal to those 'purple rinsers'.
Fingers crossed ................. we'd need another cash machine though!
Have heard that FR are still considering adding more flights later in the year.
Duo will have to be clever to avoid becoming another JetMagic.
Their CRJs can't compete with the locos and the payload/range would probably prevent introduction of 'sunshine' destinations (although I am open to advice on this).
So, if my suppositions are correct, it's business-type destinations at business fares. That is likely to mean competing with BA and the majors to destinations like Brussels, Stuttgart, Lyons, etc.
How about a sprinkling of 'business' routes from Luton? Massive catchment area, less congestion than LHR, slot availability, quick turnrounds etc. And the only competitor will only go to 'big' airports like CDG, AMS, GVA & ZRH.
Think about it, Duo, we'd like to see you on the Costa del Beds.
Their CRJs can't compete with the locos and the payload/range would probably prevent introduction of 'sunshine' destinations (although I am open to advice on this).
So, if my suppositions are correct, it's business-type destinations at business fares. That is likely to mean competing with BA and the majors to destinations like Brussels, Stuttgart, Lyons, etc.
How about a sprinkling of 'business' routes from Luton? Massive catchment area, less congestion than LHR, slot availability, quick turnrounds etc. And the only competitor will only go to 'big' airports like CDG, AMS, GVA & ZRH.
Think about it, Duo, we'd like to see you on the Costa del Beds.
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Duo certainly are aiming more for business routes. Though they pride themselves for offering business class service at economy prices. They will be starting Nice from EDI soon, that's the closest to a 'sunshine destination' for the time being.
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LGS:
You're right about the RJ seat-mile costs compared with e.g. 737s. However there's another way to look at it. A loco (or, as I've seen it referred to elsewhere, a "NMA" or New Model Airline
) will want, let's say, at least a 75% seat factor on a route. With a 150-seat aircraft operating once-daily (110000 seats), that means they need a route that has upwards of 80000 one-way passengers a year. And if it's a once-daily schedule, chances are that it'll be somewhere in the middle of the day, as the prime morning and evening hours will be used for service on prime routes that warrant higher frequency.
I'd suggest that routes much below this size, especially routes which have a high proportion of business traffic which is looking for convenient schedules, are not going to be so attractive to locos, who have better pickings elsewhere.
Compare a 48-seater operating twice daily, 6 days a week. That's about 60000 seats in a year. Assume a 60% load factor is verging on satisfactory (because yields are higher) - that's 36000 passengers/year for the route to be interesting to the RJ-operating airline. And that's with a twice-daily frequency which is attractive to business passengers, so the yields should be better.
(Incidentally Duo has used the CRJs for Birmingham-Athens, currently uses them for Birmingham-Helsinki, and is running Birmingham-Murcia charters in the summer, so it's likely not the range that precludes sunshine destinations.)
Of course a loco can offer some headline-grabbing fares and grow the price-sensitive market, but there are limits to how far it can be grown - as Ryanair is finding. Business travellers are not quite so headline-price-driven and, I would suggest, *do* want a good-value fare, but tend to look at overall value (e.g. do I have to waste an entire day because of the flight times? do I have to drive an extra hour to get to the airport? do I have to allow an extra hour in case of motorway traffic? etc.)
Where would you suggest Duo should fly to from Luton, then?
C.
You're right about the RJ seat-mile costs compared with e.g. 737s. However there's another way to look at it. A loco (or, as I've seen it referred to elsewhere, a "NMA" or New Model Airline
) will want, let's say, at least a 75% seat factor on a route. With a 150-seat aircraft operating once-daily (110000 seats), that means they need a route that has upwards of 80000 one-way passengers a year. And if it's a once-daily schedule, chances are that it'll be somewhere in the middle of the day, as the prime morning and evening hours will be used for service on prime routes that warrant higher frequency.I'd suggest that routes much below this size, especially routes which have a high proportion of business traffic which is looking for convenient schedules, are not going to be so attractive to locos, who have better pickings elsewhere.
Compare a 48-seater operating twice daily, 6 days a week. That's about 60000 seats in a year. Assume a 60% load factor is verging on satisfactory (because yields are higher) - that's 36000 passengers/year for the route to be interesting to the RJ-operating airline. And that's with a twice-daily frequency which is attractive to business passengers, so the yields should be better.
(Incidentally Duo has used the CRJs for Birmingham-Athens, currently uses them for Birmingham-Helsinki, and is running Birmingham-Murcia charters in the summer, so it's likely not the range that precludes sunshine destinations.)
Of course a loco can offer some headline-grabbing fares and grow the price-sensitive market, but there are limits to how far it can be grown - as Ryanair is finding. Business travellers are not quite so headline-price-driven and, I would suggest, *do* want a good-value fare, but tend to look at overall value (e.g. do I have to waste an entire day because of the flight times? do I have to drive an extra hour to get to the airport? do I have to allow an extra hour in case of motorway traffic? etc.)
Where would you suggest Duo should fly to from Luton, then?
C.
"I cannot understand how you can operate such small a/c and make a good profit."
Well, hundreds of ERJs and CRJs have been built and sold, so some people must think it's possible!
Well, hundreds of ERJs and CRJs have been built and sold, so some people must think it's possible!
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RJ costs
Groundloop posted "Well, hundreds of ERJs and CRJs have been built and sold, so some people must think it's possible!"
Yes, but I think you'll find that the vast majority of ERJ's & CRJ's are operated (either directly or indirectly) for the major airlines, those smallest aircraft may be a B737.
The RJ's offer a cheaper solution to a major airline than using a B737 to serve thin routes, while keeping up the service levels / airline identity.
As has been said the costs of an RJ to a new airline are probably prohibitive - as in Jet Magic's case (?), wereas DUO are working on the base of the old Maersk/BA operation ex BHX, so are not really a new start-up operation.
In Europe the turbo-prop has started to make a return as the operation here is possibly more related to costs, rather than the model in USA where its related to market share? (I noted a comment that some airports in the US are trying to restrict the use of RJ's as its having an effect on passenger throughput)
Yes, but I think you'll find that the vast majority of ERJ's & CRJ's are operated (either directly or indirectly) for the major airlines, those smallest aircraft may be a B737.
The RJ's offer a cheaper solution to a major airline than using a B737 to serve thin routes, while keeping up the service levels / airline identity.
As has been said the costs of an RJ to a new airline are probably prohibitive - as in Jet Magic's case (?), wereas DUO are working on the base of the old Maersk/BA operation ex BHX, so are not really a new start-up operation.
In Europe the turbo-prop has started to make a return as the operation here is possibly more related to costs, rather than the model in USA where its related to market share? (I noted a comment that some airports in the US are trying to restrict the use of RJ's as its having an effect on passenger throughput)
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As there's probably a few Duo types reading this I just though I'd chip in and say how nice a trip it was back from CGN the other day. Bacon an egg roll was top, load factor looked good (bout 75% full) very friendly. Nice landing in a very tricky crosswind from the right at brum. All in all good job and I will certainly be pushing the company to use them whenever we can.
Straight & Level -
EZY already fly Luton to Palma, Barcelona and Madrid, Monarch fly Luton-Gibraltar. And I reckon there will be LTN-Poland flights soon.
Cyrano -
Where should Duo fly from Luton?
Well, how about Stuttgart? Already a Duo destination, and Stuttgart-based Mercedes-Benz's UK head office is in nearby Milton Keynes. To say nothing of other commercial links.
Lisbon is a European capital that has attracted some Lo-Cos without great success (Go and AB). So how about LIS?
Vienna, Oslo and Stockholm are other possibilities - no LoCos and all are European capital cities.
Rome isn't served from Luton although EZY and FR both fly there from STN. There's a service from Luton to Milan (Bergamo), but not to Turin.
Cork hasn't been served from Luton for 10 years, and Ireland is enjoying something of a commercial renaissance.
Strasbourg, having lost its FR flights, could be a possibility for the Eurocrats, as could Luxembourg.
At this rate, Duo will become bigger than EZY!!
EZY already fly Luton to Palma, Barcelona and Madrid, Monarch fly Luton-Gibraltar. And I reckon there will be LTN-Poland flights soon.
Cyrano -
Where should Duo fly from Luton?
Well, how about Stuttgart? Already a Duo destination, and Stuttgart-based Mercedes-Benz's UK head office is in nearby Milton Keynes. To say nothing of other commercial links.
Lisbon is a European capital that has attracted some Lo-Cos without great success (Go and AB). So how about LIS?
Vienna, Oslo and Stockholm are other possibilities - no LoCos and all are European capital cities.
Rome isn't served from Luton although EZY and FR both fly there from STN. There's a service from Luton to Milan (Bergamo), but not to Turin.
Cork hasn't been served from Luton for 10 years, and Ireland is enjoying something of a commercial renaissance.
Strasbourg, having lost its FR flights, could be a possibility for the Eurocrats, as could Luxembourg.
At this rate, Duo will become bigger than EZY!!
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Well, hundreds of ERJs and CRJs have been built and sold, so some people must think it's possible!
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Lads oh Lads, I fly erj's for a major uk carrier and our bit of the pie is the only bit of that's making proper money. Fly a small aircraft around, fullish,(in fact the beancounters tell us we only need 5 full payers each way to make money over the DOC's) offer a proper service and charge loads of money. It works. (for us anyway) True enough, were on a pay freeze, self drive all over the show, no crew food(even on a 9 1/2 hour duty) etc etc., but thats for another thread. The point is, regional jets work in the right place at the right time. We are in business anyway.
must get that airbus rating!
cheers.
must get that airbus rating!
cheers.
Last edited by checkthrust; 13th Feb 2004 at 17:46.
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I always wonder about new startups that rely on business passengers. Most of the huge corporates (Shell, BP, Glaxo etc.) have their travel deals with the major alliances so as to access their global networks.
Is there really enough of a market without the huge conglomerates? I hope so.
Is there really enough of a market without the huge conglomerates? I hope so.
