why go by train, when you can go by plane?
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why go by train, when you can go by plane?
"City may lose out over new airline Dec 19 2003
By Neil Hodgson Liverpool Echo
A NEW UK domestic airline wants to set up in Liverpool flying to 41 UK and Irish destinations in direct competition with the rail industry.
Air-Train proposes to use 32 200-seat jets with 16 permanently based here, creating almost 600 jobs at Liverpool John Lennon airport.
But airport chiefs say they do not have the capacity to handle the ambitious scheme and Air-Train founder Neil Bellion says he may now have to take his proposal to Manchester.
Airline consultant Mr Bellion, 39, from Liverpool, is part of a four-strong team aiming to raise £65m on the Alternative Invesment Market, the junior stock market, in the first quarter of 2004 to fund their plans.
He sees no shortage of investors: "Richard Branson recently floated an airline in Australia which was 10-times over subscribed, and easyJet's flotation was also oversubscribed.
"We want to get our funding away in the first quarter of the year and we have to have an airport in our prospectus. Manchester is looking more likely."
Mr Bellion, whose last project was setting up an airline in Kurdistan, said Liverpool has turned down his proposal but offered to help him set up at Finningley in York-shire, a small airport which parent company Peel bought earlier this year.
He said: "I've been talking with Liverpool for two years and I'm still looking at JLA, but they say they don't have the capacity.
"They need to raise their ambitions in terms of their infrastructure and their airport. There's bags of land available."
He added: "They don't want to spend the money on the infrastructure we need. Finningley isn't an option because it won't be open for another year."
He explained the idea behind using Liverpool as a "hub and spoke" operation is because it is ideally located in the middle of the country.
Planes would link virtually all the UK, from Northern Ireland to the tip of Scotland, London and the Channel Islands.
Mr Bellion said: "For example, if someone from Newcastle wanted to get to Birmingham they would fly to Liverpool and change planes onward to Birmingham.
"Liverpool would be like the Crewe station of the air industry."
Tickets would range from as little as £9 one way, with the most expensive return fare priced at £128.
"All fares will be lower than the train," said Mr Bellion.
"Flights will be ticketless. We'd issue smart cards. Passengers would book online and we would credit their smart card for the flight. Electronic readers would then allow their card access at the gate."
He said the business could handle 256 flights a day, carrying 22 million passengers a year, making Liverpool the country's fourth busiest airport.
And because most passengers would not carry luggage there was an opportunity to make Liverpool the UK's premier hub for same day mail and parcel delivery.
Although Air-Train would be a domestic operation he said it represents a fantastic opportunity for Liverpool to take long-haul transatlantic flights and offer passengers onward planes to anywhere in the country.
Mr Bellion says he has already been offered 33 Boeing 757s by Thomas Cook Airlines: "Because of the state of the holiday industry they are using smaller planes."
Liverpool JLA corporate affairs manager Robin Tudor said: "We're talking to a number of start-up operations and would include Neil Bellion in that.
"We do have a problem in that what he is proposing we couldn't accommodate in time.
"Our expansion plans have been agreed with the local authority and we can't divert from that.
"We have to be realistic as to what we can accommodate within the guidelines as agreed with the local authority. There's no point in kidding anybody if we can't cope with it. Parking the planes was a problem in itself.
"Finningley is a new airport with huge potential but we're still in discussions and we are certainly not saying 'go away we're not interested'."
By Neil Hodgson Liverpool Echo
A NEW UK domestic airline wants to set up in Liverpool flying to 41 UK and Irish destinations in direct competition with the rail industry.
Air-Train proposes to use 32 200-seat jets with 16 permanently based here, creating almost 600 jobs at Liverpool John Lennon airport.
But airport chiefs say they do not have the capacity to handle the ambitious scheme and Air-Train founder Neil Bellion says he may now have to take his proposal to Manchester.
Airline consultant Mr Bellion, 39, from Liverpool, is part of a four-strong team aiming to raise £65m on the Alternative Invesment Market, the junior stock market, in the first quarter of 2004 to fund their plans.
He sees no shortage of investors: "Richard Branson recently floated an airline in Australia which was 10-times over subscribed, and easyJet's flotation was also oversubscribed.
"We want to get our funding away in the first quarter of the year and we have to have an airport in our prospectus. Manchester is looking more likely."
Mr Bellion, whose last project was setting up an airline in Kurdistan, said Liverpool has turned down his proposal but offered to help him set up at Finningley in York-shire, a small airport which parent company Peel bought earlier this year.
He said: "I've been talking with Liverpool for two years and I'm still looking at JLA, but they say they don't have the capacity.
"They need to raise their ambitions in terms of their infrastructure and their airport. There's bags of land available."
He added: "They don't want to spend the money on the infrastructure we need. Finningley isn't an option because it won't be open for another year."
He explained the idea behind using Liverpool as a "hub and spoke" operation is because it is ideally located in the middle of the country.
Planes would link virtually all the UK, from Northern Ireland to the tip of Scotland, London and the Channel Islands.
Mr Bellion said: "For example, if someone from Newcastle wanted to get to Birmingham they would fly to Liverpool and change planes onward to Birmingham.
"Liverpool would be like the Crewe station of the air industry."
Tickets would range from as little as £9 one way, with the most expensive return fare priced at £128.
"All fares will be lower than the train," said Mr Bellion.
"Flights will be ticketless. We'd issue smart cards. Passengers would book online and we would credit their smart card for the flight. Electronic readers would then allow their card access at the gate."
He said the business could handle 256 flights a day, carrying 22 million passengers a year, making Liverpool the country's fourth busiest airport.
And because most passengers would not carry luggage there was an opportunity to make Liverpool the UK's premier hub for same day mail and parcel delivery.
Although Air-Train would be a domestic operation he said it represents a fantastic opportunity for Liverpool to take long-haul transatlantic flights and offer passengers onward planes to anywhere in the country.
Mr Bellion says he has already been offered 33 Boeing 757s by Thomas Cook Airlines: "Because of the state of the holiday industry they are using smaller planes."
Liverpool JLA corporate affairs manager Robin Tudor said: "We're talking to a number of start-up operations and would include Neil Bellion in that.
"We do have a problem in that what he is proposing we couldn't accommodate in time.
"Our expansion plans have been agreed with the local authority and we can't divert from that.
"We have to be realistic as to what we can accommodate within the guidelines as agreed with the local authority. There's no point in kidding anybody if we can't cope with it. Parking the planes was a problem in itself.
"Finningley is a new airport with huge potential but we're still in discussions and we are certainly not saying 'go away we're not interested'."
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Not forgetting what it would cost to get to LPL and then from which ever LON airport the service would fly into. If it's STN, then that'll add another £20 (and an hours journey time) on, just for the Stansted Express. Including check-in, transfer and in-flight time, you'd probably be looking at a similar journey time to that of the train. Plus there'd be the tax to add on as well.
"Flights will be ticketless. We'd issue smart cards."
Why? Whats wrong with having the PAX turn up with some form of ID, and save the outlay of having to provide every passenger with a smart card.
Mr Bellion said: "For example, if someone from Newcastle wanted to get to Birmingham they would fly to Liverpool and change planes onward to Birmingham.
Who's going to fly from Liverpool to Birmingham when the train takes 1hr 45 mins from city centre to city centre?
"Liverpool would be like the Crewe station of the air industry."
Erm, don't think a great deal of passengers change trains in Crewe, Birmingham New Street or something, maybe.
Mr Bellion says he has already been offered 33 Boeing 757s by Thomas Cook Airlines: "Because of the state of the holiday industry they are using smaller planes."
Doubt it.
"Flights will be ticketless. We'd issue smart cards."
Why? Whats wrong with having the PAX turn up with some form of ID, and save the outlay of having to provide every passenger with a smart card.
Mr Bellion said: "For example, if someone from Newcastle wanted to get to Birmingham they would fly to Liverpool and change planes onward to Birmingham.
Who's going to fly from Liverpool to Birmingham when the train takes 1hr 45 mins from city centre to city centre?
"Liverpool would be like the Crewe station of the air industry."
Erm, don't think a great deal of passengers change trains in Crewe, Birmingham New Street or something, maybe.
Mr Bellion says he has already been offered 33 Boeing 757s by Thomas Cook Airlines: "Because of the state of the holiday industry they are using smaller planes."
Doubt it.
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Hmmm...
Did a search on 'Neil Bellion' on Google and found...
http://www.btinternet.com/~neil.bellion/index.swf
Check those pictures out - good to see he's got plans for a 'real' aircraft to operate the routes, and none of those 757s....
Did a search on 'Neil Bellion' on Google and found...
http://www.btinternet.com/~neil.bellion/index.swf
Check those pictures out - good to see he's got plans for a 'real' aircraft to operate the routes, and none of those 757s....
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Some interesting routes on that website such as Coventry>Birmingham. It should be fun watching them try to get a 757 into LCY.....think a different fleet will be required for those routes 
.
I like the idea though, I'm sure if they can make the fares around the same price as the train people will use it. Not sure about the change over at LPL....what benefit does that give?
. I like the idea though, I'm sure if they can make the fares around the same price as the train people will use it. Not sure about the change over at LPL....what benefit does that give?
EZY and Virgin raised money on the Stock Market once they were under way and successful. The City likes a track record.
This is an unproven model, with some questionable economics. IMHO it would not impress City types enough to raise £65m or even £650k.
Now has apparently struggled to obtain finance - one wonders why this operator would do any better.
My money would bet against this airline ever starting, with even longer odds against it surviving a year.
But there is a certain appeal to airlines stealing rail business - after all the rail industry seems to be trying to self-destruct by having to 'invest' so much of our money in 1830s technology.
This is an unproven model, with some questionable economics. IMHO it would not impress City types enough to raise £65m or even £650k.
Now has apparently struggled to obtain finance - one wonders why this operator would do any better.
My money would bet against this airline ever starting, with even longer odds against it surviving a year.
But there is a certain appeal to airlines stealing rail business - after all the rail industry seems to be trying to self-destruct by having to 'invest' so much of our money in 1830s technology.
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Is this a hoax? 049 pictures especially the quaint one headed Parcels, this is a joke; right? B757 Cardiff to newquay and what will Continental have to say about providing the airplanes??
Remember the BA/Bcal shuttle helicopter LHR-LGW vv. Great idea but it didn't work did it
FEBA
Remember the BA/Bcal shuttle helicopter LHR-LGW vv. Great idea but it didn't work did it
FEBA
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Just a thought,
Heard Mr B was obtaining his aircraft from Thomas Cook Airlines who, due to a down turn in the holiday market, did not require the B757s.
Um....what happens when they want them back?
Will we see a couple of Emerald ATPs filling the gaps?
Total Fiction Methinks.
Heard Mr B was obtaining his aircraft from Thomas Cook Airlines who, due to a down turn in the holiday market, did not require the B757s.
Um....what happens when they want them back?
Will we see a couple of Emerald ATPs filling the gaps?
Total Fiction Methinks.
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Dan Air....Did it yonks ago with one a/c [Nord262]
Today? Slots....both enroute, and certain Airports "probably" make it a non-starter, more's the pity.
watp,iktch
Today? Slots....both enroute, and certain Airports "probably" make it a non-starter, more's the pity.
watp,iktch
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???
Surely this will not commence!!! Surely if they operate B757 aircraft these "low" prices cannot be produced.... Surely they will have to use hefty fares to pay up the landing fees and other charges that come with the B757... i really do not see this happening!!!
Madtoonfan - http://www.gallery32137.fotopic.net/
Madtoonfan - http://www.gallery32137.fotopic.net/
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Sligo Airport!!
I work for Aer Arann and we fly ATR42's into sligo and due to the size of the runway and the local area it's a captain only landing.
Thats in and ATR a Turboprop, there is not a chance that a 757 or even a 737 could get in there.
We don't even take our 72's in there it's that limiting!!!
As for the routes out of dublin most of them are already served by Ryan air, and those that are not would be if they get wind of it.
To be honest if they are starting up good luck to them and I hope they do, more pilot jobs to go around and less of my friends will be searching for jobs.
Oh and Merry Xmas Everyone.
Thats in and ATR a Turboprop, there is not a chance that a 757 or even a 737 could get in there.
We don't even take our 72's in there it's that limiting!!!
As for the routes out of dublin most of them are already served by Ryan air, and those that are not would be if they get wind of it.
To be honest if they are starting up good luck to them and I hope they do, more pilot jobs to go around and less of my friends will be searching for jobs.
Oh and Merry Xmas Everyone.
I think some of you are taking this Air-Train thing a little too seriously. Nice website though. When I was a little kid (no PCs then) I used to invent airlines and plan schedules. In fact, I invented Air UK long before the real one came along. Strangely enough the livery was uncanningly similar too.
