Hawker 748 crash
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: jhb
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Don't you guys find it sad that all you hear is Hansie , Hansie , Hansie ? What about the familly's of the pilots that are left out of the picture. The media can sometimes stink !!! Bastads !!!
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Johannesburg,South Africa
Posts: 13
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Senseless Speculation
Virtually all pilots I have come accross cannot resist the temptation to speculate as to the causes of aviation accidents. In some respect this is natural as we all mentally try to understand something we would want to avoid.
However I cannot, understand why professionally trained pilots join in the media frenzy of "expert opinions" which try to guess, often on partial information at best, what caused an accident. All pilots should understand that most accidents have a complex chain of events and simplistic and worse still,hoplessly misinformed scenarios, only does our industry more harm than good.
Having visited the crash site in George on Saturday afternoon and monitored the progress of the CAA investigation, I cannot but be struck by the sheer insensitivity towards our fallen colleagues (the Cpt previously worked for the CAA) exhibited by a number of aviators which offered their "expertise" to the media in the latter's rush to get a scoop on the causes of this accident.
This accident is both sad for the resultant loss of life and the puzzling circumstances around the aircrafts trajectory into the mountains. The FDR, CVR and GPS have been recovered and will hopefully yield information with which we can reconstruct the final moments of this flight more accurately.
Until then, could fellow aviators at least allow their former colleagues to be buried in peace without their contributions to the uninformed media speculation.
However I cannot, understand why professionally trained pilots join in the media frenzy of "expert opinions" which try to guess, often on partial information at best, what caused an accident. All pilots should understand that most accidents have a complex chain of events and simplistic and worse still,hoplessly misinformed scenarios, only does our industry more harm than good.
Having visited the crash site in George on Saturday afternoon and monitored the progress of the CAA investigation, I cannot but be struck by the sheer insensitivity towards our fallen colleagues (the Cpt previously worked for the CAA) exhibited by a number of aviators which offered their "expertise" to the media in the latter's rush to get a scoop on the causes of this accident.
This accident is both sad for the resultant loss of life and the puzzling circumstances around the aircrafts trajectory into the mountains. The FDR, CVR and GPS have been recovered and will hopefully yield information with which we can reconstruct the final moments of this flight more accurately.
Until then, could fellow aviators at least allow their former colleagues to be buried in peace without their contributions to the uninformed media speculation.
GunsssR4ever
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: Out there somewhere ...
Posts: 3,816
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Lessons to be learned AGAIN
CAACHIEF,
Could not have said it better ....
Lessons can and will be learned AGAIN about the accident .. but the media speculation (and the "who will be invited to Hansie's funeral saga") is SICK !!!
After flying 25 years and 7000 hours I had the misfortune of loosing a pax in a double engine cut in an aircraft that CAN NOT fly on one engine even when it is light.
In the beginning all was ok and I was the national hero but now - Media speculation and fellow aviators (so called friends) starts rumours and specualtions that will drive anybody insane.
Two Board of Inquiries (one by British Mil Specialists) get's overturned by the media ... is this right ???
I feel for the families .... please let it sink in before we speculate again !
Could not have said it better ....
Lessons can and will be learned AGAIN about the accident .. but the media speculation (and the "who will be invited to Hansie's funeral saga") is SICK !!!
After flying 25 years and 7000 hours I had the misfortune of loosing a pax in a double engine cut in an aircraft that CAN NOT fly on one engine even when it is light.
In the beginning all was ok and I was the national hero but now - Media speculation and fellow aviators (so called friends) starts rumours and specualtions that will drive anybody insane.
Two Board of Inquiries (one by British Mil Specialists) get's overturned by the media ... is this right ???
I feel for the families .... please let it sink in before we speculate again !
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: jhb
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Funeral F/Officer
The funeral service for Ian (Neddy) Noakes will be held on Tuesday 11 June 2002 at 14h00 in the Methodist Church, Cresta road, Sunward Park
Neddy, you have just changed your metal wings for feathered ones.........
Neddy, you have just changed your metal wings for feathered ones.........
Join Date: May 2002
Location: south africa
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The real hero's
RIP Willy and Neddy - we will miss you both.
GENTLEMEN! ................. they both were!
I had the honour of flying many hours on the HS 748, on that route with Willy - It just does not add up - As my captain he would ALLWAYS make sure the "let-down and go-around" was briefed - not once but twice into, as he called the, "Killers" (GEORGE, PMB, MATSAPA, PILANSBURG and ULUNDI).
He would always say " Man those stones are VERY hard and Very HIGH - " (always followed with a typical Willy Meyer joke or story of an experience in his 20 000 hrs). (........those stories WILL save my life one day................a wealth of information...that only experience can teach a man).
WILLY MEYER is a legend. and will stay with us 4ever.
Willy and Neddy : what every happend - WHO KNOWs? - But I know that you guys would have tried your best. (Something increadably out of this world must have happened that morning, to have caused the crash??????????????????)
You were both fine men (Officers and gentlemen) and will be missed by aviation and your families.
RIP
Your Friend
GENTLEMEN! ................. they both were!
I had the honour of flying many hours on the HS 748, on that route with Willy - It just does not add up - As my captain he would ALLWAYS make sure the "let-down and go-around" was briefed - not once but twice into, as he called the, "Killers" (GEORGE, PMB, MATSAPA, PILANSBURG and ULUNDI).
He would always say " Man those stones are VERY hard and Very HIGH - " (always followed with a typical Willy Meyer joke or story of an experience in his 20 000 hrs). (........those stories WILL save my life one day................a wealth of information...that only experience can teach a man).
WILLY MEYER is a legend. and will stay with us 4ever.
Willy and Neddy : what every happend - WHO KNOWs? - But I know that you guys would have tried your best. (Something increadably out of this world must have happened that morning, to have caused the crash??????????????????)
You were both fine men (Officers and gentlemen) and will be missed by aviation and your families.
RIP
Your Friend
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Europe
Posts: 655
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Rest Well!
You know, reading this post alongside all the rest on the Africa forum brings home a fact: us African okes care about our mates big time! We do our best not to slag them off, and we talk of their good points when they're gone. In 1994 on July 23rd, I lost a good mate in an aircraft accident in the Zambezi Valley. I miss him that much that I've named my son after him.
What I read in some of the other forums on PPRuNe doesn't even warrant much talk here. I'm just proud to be one of us. I knew Willie but not Neddy. I'm sure glad though that they had mates like us.
Rest well guys! You'll be missed something huge!
What I read in some of the other forums on PPRuNe doesn't even warrant much talk here. I'm just proud to be one of us. I knew Willie but not Neddy. I'm sure glad though that they had mates like us.
Rest well guys! You'll be missed something huge!
Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Hilton, Sheraton or Marriott
Posts: 1,817
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Cashing in on the Hansie crash
Even in death, cricket's fallen hero remains bankable as businessman plans an extraordinary memorial using plane's wreckage. EDWIN LOMBARD
A BUSINESSMAN is planning a bizarre memorial to Hansie Cronjé - the wreckage of the plane he died in, arranged on fake mountain rocks, at his new R100-million shopping complex. And he is planning to charge the public to look at the mangled fuselage of the plane, which crashed into a George mountainside in June.
Cronjé's parents said this week that they were in the dark about the plans. Businessman Leon Dorfling has spent "several hundred thousand rands" recovering the wreckage of the Hawker Siddeley 748 freighter aircraft in which Cronjé died. Cronjé's father, Ewie, said Dorfling had promised to call to arrange a meeting with the family after initially speaking to Hansie's mother, San-Marie, last Friday about his plans. "I don't have any idea about his plans. I haven't seen them. We can't say anything on the wreckage because it doesn't belong to us," Cronjé snr said. The family had not agreed or disagreed to the museum idea yet, he said. But he indicated they were planning their own memorial - an indoor sports centre for the disabled in George.
Dorfling said he did not need the family's permission for the museum. Nevertheless, he claimed Cronjé's widow, Bertha, had given her blessing through her lawyer, Leslie Sackstein.
However, Sackstein said his discussion with Dorfling had only to do with the removal of the wreckage from the mountain.
"He phoned me and said do I have any objection to him taking the wreckage off. I said: 'The wreckage is not ours, we can't stop you.' He asked what would Bertha's attitude be and when I spoke to Bertha and mentioned it to her, she said yes. "He said he wanted to put up a little memorial in George and I said: 'I can't stop you.' "
Sackstein said it was the first time he had heard of Dorfling's shopping-mall plan and described it as "absolutely dreadful" and "bizarre". Sackstein said the Cronjé family, including Bertha, would never agree to Dorfling's plans. Bertha Cronjé could not be reached for comment. Dorfling said that although he had never met the cricketer, he was a cricket enthusiast and Cronjé fan.
"The wreckage will be displayed just as it lay on the mountain. We will use fake rocks and possibly a small statue of Hansie. Nothing that will offend the family," he said.
He has acquired an old factory complex in Mossel Bay on which he plans to build a shopping mall with 168 shops, a gym , a swimming pool and cinemas. He said part of the experience would be a visit to the museum where fans could pay homage to their hero. "This is an Afrikaans-speaking community and Hansie was Afrikaans-speaking, so they will visit the museum," said Dorfling. George's mayor, Marius Swart, said he was in favour of the museum but found "the shopping-mall part a bit much".
Herschelle Gibbs, who was Cronjé's close friend, said he also supported the idea of a museum and had no objections to fans being charged an entrance fee to view the wreckage.
"If they can do it for Elvis Presley, why not?" he said.
Even in death, cricket's fallen hero remains bankable as businessman plans an extraordinary memorial using plane's wreckage. EDWIN LOMBARD
A BUSINESSMAN is planning a bizarre memorial to Hansie Cronjé - the wreckage of the plane he died in, arranged on fake mountain rocks, at his new R100-million shopping complex. And he is planning to charge the public to look at the mangled fuselage of the plane, which crashed into a George mountainside in June.
Cronjé's parents said this week that they were in the dark about the plans. Businessman Leon Dorfling has spent "several hundred thousand rands" recovering the wreckage of the Hawker Siddeley 748 freighter aircraft in which Cronjé died. Cronjé's father, Ewie, said Dorfling had promised to call to arrange a meeting with the family after initially speaking to Hansie's mother, San-Marie, last Friday about his plans. "I don't have any idea about his plans. I haven't seen them. We can't say anything on the wreckage because it doesn't belong to us," Cronjé snr said. The family had not agreed or disagreed to the museum idea yet, he said. But he indicated they were planning their own memorial - an indoor sports centre for the disabled in George.
Dorfling said he did not need the family's permission for the museum. Nevertheless, he claimed Cronjé's widow, Bertha, had given her blessing through her lawyer, Leslie Sackstein.
However, Sackstein said his discussion with Dorfling had only to do with the removal of the wreckage from the mountain.
"He phoned me and said do I have any objection to him taking the wreckage off. I said: 'The wreckage is not ours, we can't stop you.' He asked what would Bertha's attitude be and when I spoke to Bertha and mentioned it to her, she said yes. "He said he wanted to put up a little memorial in George and I said: 'I can't stop you.' "
Sackstein said it was the first time he had heard of Dorfling's shopping-mall plan and described it as "absolutely dreadful" and "bizarre". Sackstein said the Cronjé family, including Bertha, would never agree to Dorfling's plans. Bertha Cronjé could not be reached for comment. Dorfling said that although he had never met the cricketer, he was a cricket enthusiast and Cronjé fan.
"The wreckage will be displayed just as it lay on the mountain. We will use fake rocks and possibly a small statue of Hansie. Nothing that will offend the family," he said.
He has acquired an old factory complex in Mossel Bay on which he plans to build a shopping mall with 168 shops, a gym , a swimming pool and cinemas. He said part of the experience would be a visit to the museum where fans could pay homage to their hero. "This is an Afrikaans-speaking community and Hansie was Afrikaans-speaking, so they will visit the museum," said Dorfling. George's mayor, Marius Swart, said he was in favour of the museum but found "the shopping-mall part a bit much".
Herschelle Gibbs, who was Cronjé's close friend, said he also supported the idea of a museum and had no objections to fans being charged an entrance fee to view the wreckage.
"If they can do it for Elvis Presley, why not?" he said.
