ethiopian
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Thread is on P2 of Terms & Endearment , Title " ETHIOPIAN AIRLINES Pilot Jobs- WARNING ! ! " Best to read it.
Basically what it is saying is you will spend months on (contrived & unecessary) training & will not be paid for this period neither salary or perdiems.
Basically what it is saying is you will spend months on (contrived & unecessary) training & will not be paid for this period neither salary or perdiems.
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Ethiopian
Billy Currington sings a song where one of the lyrics goes "I don't want you, but I need you".
That is the basic concept for expats at Ethiopian. If you go there for an assessment, take a small voice recorder and record some of the comments that are made about you in the local lingo.....then have some one translate it. Then you can make up your own mind.
That is the basic concept for expats at Ethiopian. If you go there for an assessment, take a small voice recorder and record some of the comments that are made about you in the local lingo.....then have some one translate it. Then you can make up your own mind.
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The classic...
... management wants you, local pilots don't.
It is not such a good gig, considering other contract jobs available.
On the comment, about what the panel might say about you during assessment, I 've heard the same complaint-suspicion from another captain who went there for the MD-11F gig.
It is not such a good gig, considering other contract jobs available.
On the comment, about what the panel might say about you during assessment, I 've heard the same complaint-suspicion from another captain who went there for the MD-11F gig.
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It's not a unique attitude found only in Ethiopian Airlines. Expats aren't wanted in any African country for any reason. By African country I mean one that is controlled by Black skinned people. The only roll for 'expat' pilots is to fly in with C130's and drop off free food, after that, please leave.
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You're right oompilot, just like Europe is desperately longing for black skinned pilots.
Please get your facts straight.
You will discover that NATIONALS are usually favored, whether that be in Africa, America, Europe, India, China, Panama, Brazil, or wherever. If experienced locals can't be found, then expats are called.
And that's not just in aviation.
Please get your facts straight.You will discover that NATIONALS are usually favored, whether that be in Africa, America, Europe, India, China, Panama, Brazil, or wherever. If experienced locals can't be found, then expats are called.
And that's not just in aviation.
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johnnyringo42 what's wrong with saying that? If you haven't seen any in your life you shouldn't have a medical. There are lots of black people in Africa. Yes they have a skin colour. Are you sensitive about something? Got a hang up?
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oompilot i must say you must be one of those typical sheltered and narrow minded people who clearly does not see the big picture. Just as 737-NG has stated the choice of locals is a common theme across the world not just Africa. The colour of the skin has got nothing to do with local preferential whatsoever but clearly to you it does. Less of your type in the world can only be a plus. If your going to contribute useful information for those of us interested then do so but such BS bigoted post you can keep to yourself.
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It's not a unique attitude found only in Ethiopian Airlines. Expats aren't wanted in any African country for any reason. By African country I mean one that is controlled by Black skinned people. The only roll for 'expat' pilots is to fly in with C130's and drop off free food, after that, please leave.
funny because most of the airlines in country are begging for "expats" to come and fly... that should tell you something.
funny because most of the airlines in country are begging for "expats" to come and fly... that should tell you something.
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MD7 you want to call black people "local" and white people "expats", well good for you. There is no difference. You are also grouping people into categories. Smoke and mirrors don't fool anybody.
On the accusation of bigotry, I see you live in Australia. Isn't that where the aboriginal people were hunted as sport creating the majority white population we have living there today? Glass houses!
On the accusation of bigotry, I see you live in Australia. Isn't that where the aboriginal people were hunted as sport creating the majority white population we have living there today? Glass houses!
Last edited by oompilot; 26th Dec 2011 at 08:19.
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Oompilot this has nothing to do with grouping people but with your comment specifically attacking "black skinned people". What happened in Australia in the past is irrelevant to this thread whatsoever. Clearly your the type to dwell on the past. I see you live in South Africa well enough said the way you treated "black skinned people" Pretty sure if it weren't for Mandela this would still go on. At least Australia has made a formal apology to the Aboriginals.
PCLCREW you are right about expats being wanted. Friend of mine just informed me the need for expats pilots at Ethiopian Airlines. I know they are desperately looking for Q400 and 737NG rated captains. That's all i know so far.
PCLCREW you are right about expats being wanted. Friend of mine just informed me the need for expats pilots at Ethiopian Airlines. I know they are desperately looking for Q400 and 737NG rated captains. That's all i know so far.
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I referred to a group and used their skin colour as the common denominator. No malice attached regarding this what so ever. You however, oversensitive to colour, probably from your troubled history, decided to attack the comment.
By the way generalization is common place in the world. I would be interested if you are offended by all of them. Germans are precise, Japanese build computers, Americans are loud, French are stroppy, English are pompous, Italians are passionate, fair skinned people get sunburned, skinny people don't last long when lost in the dessert and fat people float well, the list goes on. Why then would someone react so badly to see a reference to a group by their skin colour? Maybe you feel black skin is something to be ashamed of. Shame on you.
By the way generalization is common place in the world. I would be interested if you are offended by all of them. Germans are precise, Japanese build computers, Americans are loud, French are stroppy, English are pompous, Italians are passionate, fair skinned people get sunburned, skinny people don't last long when lost in the dessert and fat people float well, the list goes on. Why then would someone react so badly to see a reference to a group by their skin colour? Maybe you feel black skin is something to be ashamed of. Shame on you.
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Why is it that misplaced perceptions of political correctness spoil so many discussions. Some people are black, or dark brown, what is wrong with describing them as such? They would so the same! Some people are fat, but we have to say 'dimensionally challenged', but that could mean they are midgets as well as fat, so we can't win.
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Description isn't the problem Capetonian, it's when malice is clearly intended as with Oompilot. making negative generalized statement about a group of people and then trying to hide behind an obvious fact as skin color.
The thread started on Ethiopian need for Expat pilots and it slid to the need of Expat pilots in Africa, at which point Oompilot felt the need to shed light on his bigoted skewed mentality of the continent, pointing out that by Africa he meant countries controlled by black skinned people, is he aware there are countries that are controlled by black skinned people that aren't African or are not even in this continent. U.S is under the leadership of a not so fair person.
The point he was actually trying to drive home was expats in this case ''foreign caucasian pilots'' aren't wanted in ''black Africa''. He forgets there are black expat pilots as well that is why he felt the need to include color in his description hence sliding the thread further to the irrelevant.
As someone wisely tried to educate him ''Nationals" always take priority be it in Black Africa, Arab Africa, Americas or White Europe and i'm not trying to be politically correct, the airline i fly for has people of Asian descent, Caucasian descent and obviously a majority are black descendants but they all have the common denominator, Nationals.
Obviously he does not get that, he is keen to portray Africa "the one controlled by black skinned people" as vile and their only need for expats i.e white pilots is when they are starving and need food aid, he fails to see the bigger picture, who is an expat? the need for them within the continent and beyond, and protectionism of local jobs by all governments including those not controlled by black skinned people.
That's why he is a BIGOT not because he called someone who is black, 'black'.
The thread started on Ethiopian need for Expat pilots and it slid to the need of Expat pilots in Africa, at which point Oompilot felt the need to shed light on his bigoted skewed mentality of the continent, pointing out that by Africa he meant countries controlled by black skinned people, is he aware there are countries that are controlled by black skinned people that aren't African or are not even in this continent. U.S is under the leadership of a not so fair person.
The point he was actually trying to drive home was expats in this case ''foreign caucasian pilots'' aren't wanted in ''black Africa''. He forgets there are black expat pilots as well that is why he felt the need to include color in his description hence sliding the thread further to the irrelevant.
As someone wisely tried to educate him ''Nationals" always take priority be it in Black Africa, Arab Africa, Americas or White Europe and i'm not trying to be politically correct, the airline i fly for has people of Asian descent, Caucasian descent and obviously a majority are black descendants but they all have the common denominator, Nationals.
Obviously he does not get that, he is keen to portray Africa "the one controlled by black skinned people" as vile and their only need for expats i.e white pilots is when they are starving and need food aid, he fails to see the bigger picture, who is an expat? the need for them within the continent and beyond, and protectionism of local jobs by all governments including those not controlled by black skinned people.
That's why he is a BIGOT not because he called someone who is black, 'black'.
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Gentleman-it appears that this thread has rapidly moved away from the original topic into nothing more than a slinging match based on difference of opinion. Having been fortunate enough in my career to date to have worked in many places around the world and predominantly in Africa, I can say that the latter it is an entirely unique place to work. There are a different set of rules here and in many cases there is unfortunately still a deep underlying sense of racism that exists from both sides. Having said that, there are still many “expat Pilots” flying throughout Africa for a variety of operators. The simple fact that they are there illustrates the need for some form of external assistance be it because of insufficient suitably qualified local pilots or ambitious growth plans that outstrip the training capabilities of the various operators. Whether the airlines that employ these contractors like it or not, they still need them for the foreseeable future and as a result there is always going to be some form of animosity that exists from the local pilots.
I found a comment from MD7 rather interesting in that he referred to Australians having “apologized” to the Aboriginals for past atrocities-does that make it ok then?.Australia is still in effect a colony but the subtle difference is that power has never been returned to the local Aboriginal community in the form of governance. After all they are the original inhabitants of that country. This has happened in Africa and in so many cases the country has been ruined by so called ‘Democratically elected presidents” who have done nothing but line their own pockets to the detriment of their own people and taken the country back 100 years not to mention changing the constitution so as to hold onto that power .Would you still be such a proud Australian if this was the case in your country?. I doubt a simple apology would suffice. In general Africa is still an awesome place to work/live and it is only the minority that gives it a bad name. For sure widespread corruption is endemic to the continent on a whole but where in the world these days is that not the case? .It’s just on this continent that there is invariably no accountability. Now for a return to the original thread. From what I understand Ethiopian Airlines is a very good airline to work for. There is an issue in that you do not get paid during the training period which can last for anything up to six weeks and this naturally puts many prospective pilots off. There is like so many things a reason for this. They have had numerous pilots attempting to pull the wool over their eyes by fudging their credentials or by simply not making the grade. The failure rate of candidates has been as high as 50% so their attitude is justifiably that you get paid once you have made the grade. Their standards are high and most of the disgruntled pilots that have posted threads have simply not made that grade or have not been willing to adhere to their SOP’s. It is a rapidly expanding Airline with one of the best commuting options in the business. Sure the money isn’t the best but if you work out that it is effectively for only 20 days work in the month then it’s a good deal.
Bottom line is that if you want to work in Africa then come with an open mind and be flexible enough to conform to what is asked of you.
I found a comment from MD7 rather interesting in that he referred to Australians having “apologized” to the Aboriginals for past atrocities-does that make it ok then?.Australia is still in effect a colony but the subtle difference is that power has never been returned to the local Aboriginal community in the form of governance. After all they are the original inhabitants of that country. This has happened in Africa and in so many cases the country has been ruined by so called ‘Democratically elected presidents” who have done nothing but line their own pockets to the detriment of their own people and taken the country back 100 years not to mention changing the constitution so as to hold onto that power .Would you still be such a proud Australian if this was the case in your country?. I doubt a simple apology would suffice. In general Africa is still an awesome place to work/live and it is only the minority that gives it a bad name. For sure widespread corruption is endemic to the continent on a whole but where in the world these days is that not the case? .It’s just on this continent that there is invariably no accountability. Now for a return to the original thread. From what I understand Ethiopian Airlines is a very good airline to work for. There is an issue in that you do not get paid during the training period which can last for anything up to six weeks and this naturally puts many prospective pilots off. There is like so many things a reason for this. They have had numerous pilots attempting to pull the wool over their eyes by fudging their credentials or by simply not making the grade. The failure rate of candidates has been as high as 50% so their attitude is justifiably that you get paid once you have made the grade. Their standards are high and most of the disgruntled pilots that have posted threads have simply not made that grade or have not been willing to adhere to their SOP’s. It is a rapidly expanding Airline with one of the best commuting options in the business. Sure the money isn’t the best but if you work out that it is effectively for only 20 days work in the month then it’s a good deal.
Bottom line is that if you want to work in Africa then come with an open mind and be flexible enough to conform to what is asked of you.