Air Nigeria to resume long haul ops.
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Air Nigeria to resume long haul ops.
Here we go again, rumour has it that plans are at an advanced stage for VK to re-launch into the long haul arena, but going by the troubles they,ve been goiing through in recent past ( lack of funds to purchase fuel, flight delays and cancellations, free for all fights at check in counters, debts owed to Gecas, Oxford, Lufthansa technic etc. Late salaries, staff retrenchments, pay cuts, the list goes on and on)
Do they have what it takes to venture into the big boy's turf?
Do they have what it takes to venture into the big boy's turf?
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rumour has it that plans are at an advanced stage for VK to re-launch into the long haul arena
lack of funds to purchase fuel
free for all fights at check in counters
Late salaries, staff retrenchments, pay cuts
No staff retrenchment so far
Pay cut has been shelved, aint happening any longer.
There you go mate, all that glitters aint gold and not everything that smells is ****.
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Intresting, so if IJ is not releasing funds to procure fuel for narrow body short haul AC, how will he get long haul wide body equipments to stay in the air? Or other costs like maintainance reserves, paying expart crew since I am sure all the locals who flew the A340 and B767 must have left for greener pastures.
Talk less of other costs incured abroad as those government agencies dont tolerate airlines not living up to their financial obligations.
Talk less of other costs incured abroad as those government agencies dont tolerate airlines not living up to their financial obligations.
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There's empirical data to prove that Lagos-London is a gold mine by default.
However, you tilt the balance either way:
Starting without adequate Planning for contingencies leading to Ooops! and huge loses, or carry out due diligence and consider a commercial agreement with a robust partner to improve connectivity for clients with a final destination out of the UK to improve chances of success.
I think VK has learnt from the first bad outing and has a clear picture that Long haul is no child's play.
However, you tilt the balance either way:
Starting without adequate Planning for contingencies leading to Ooops! and huge loses, or carry out due diligence and consider a commercial agreement with a robust partner to improve connectivity for clients with a final destination out of the UK to improve chances of success.
I think VK has learnt from the first bad outing and has a clear picture that Long haul is no child's play.
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Well VK can also learn from 'the only other Nigerian airline that goes long haul'. What a mentor to have in 'emirates of africa'!
Footnote:
'the only other Nigerian airline that goes long haul' quote from eagleflier's post!
Footnote:
'the only other Nigerian airline that goes long haul' quote from eagleflier's post!
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Well VK can also learn from 'the only other Nigerian airline that goes long haul
I think VK has learnt from the first bad outing and has a clear picture that Long haul is no child's play.
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I'll bet the london ops will not take off in september, and when they do start, it will be in the red all through.
Like eagle said the man not only doesnt listen, he will not seek the counsel of his capable technocrats.
Bane of aviation in africa
Like eagle said the man not only doesnt listen, he will not seek the counsel of his capable technocrats.
Bane of aviation in africa
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Lets hope VK does'nt end up like EAS/NICON, JI's style is not very different from First Nation's KO or Ark's JA, which is not allowing the pros' (MD/COO/DFO,etc) to apply their expertise to the smooth running of the airline, but always interfere to the detriment of same.
Massive recruitment of expart A340 pilots is also raisinng some dust at VK as it does'nt appear that the locals with A340 type & experience are considered for the long haul opertions.
Massive recruitment of expart A340 pilots is also raisinng some dust at VK as it does'nt appear that the locals with A340 type & experience are considered for the long haul opertions.
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If JI is to be believed, I understand there will be between 3 and 4 A340s so I'm sure the locals will get an opportunity to fly them. I believe part of the current problem is that they don't have enough pilots on the short haul fleet so don't want to pull the guys from there. JI doesn't listen. Never has a truer statement being made.
They should look at coming to Abu Dhabi. Emirates has Dubai sewn up and there is a different and large market through Abu Dhabi especially if code shared with EY who have looked at starting LOS themselves.
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They ain't learnt from the first outing as they have selected Gatwick, using a 340 is a bad decision instead of the 767, London is a good route but you have to make sure you don't want for fuel or don't owe your ground handlers as VK is owing everyone who deals with them ( normal for major companies) but it helps to pay before the companies stop supplying you. I respect their intentions but they should consolidate and build a reputation on the short haul before trying to move onto the long haul scene. This situation is going to be like giving a 6 year old your new BMW to drive on a major highway.....
. We should all sit back and watch the ride.
. We should all sit back and watch the ride.
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A340 ex VS - Dream On
The first A340 is ex-TK and the second (proposed) is ex - AF, not exactly new birds or product - but does it really matter for a 'staff bus'?
The last time VK were on LOSLGW revenue pax were outnumbered by staff pax in low season and off-loaded for staff pax in peak season.
There is no way that this route can make money for VK at present. W3 can't make it work even with market competitive product, because they just can't get the corporate travellers in enough volume. Filling up Y at low yield just doesn't pay as soon as oil goes above USD80 per barrel - heaven knows how much Jet A1 is in Nigeria now.
This may just be a ploy to keep the VK staff believing after a 30% pay cut - the prospect of cheap travel to London might just do it
VK have the interline agreements and GDS distribution OK (set up when VS were helping out) but not the brand to capture the Business Class Corporate Traveller(Arik also have none of these properly set up). Hold on, didn't they have one of the most famous Global brands but didn't see the value in it, so gave it up
Only in Nigeria does anyone believe in ''if you build it, they will come''
The last time VK were on LOSLGW revenue pax were outnumbered by staff pax in low season and off-loaded for staff pax in peak season.
There is no way that this route can make money for VK at present. W3 can't make it work even with market competitive product, because they just can't get the corporate travellers in enough volume. Filling up Y at low yield just doesn't pay as soon as oil goes above USD80 per barrel - heaven knows how much Jet A1 is in Nigeria now.
This may just be a ploy to keep the VK staff believing after a 30% pay cut - the prospect of cheap travel to London might just do it
VK have the interline agreements and GDS distribution OK (set up when VS were helping out) but not the brand to capture the Business Class Corporate Traveller(Arik also have none of these properly set up). Hold on, didn't they have one of the most famous Global brands but didn't see the value in it, so gave it up
Only in Nigeria does anyone believe in ''if you build it, they will come''
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Westafrican air,
Though i agree with you on most of your post, i take an exception to the charge that vk's last LGW ops was a staff travel escapade.
As an ex-vk employee, i can confidently tell you that pax were never bumped for staff. In the off chance it ever happened, it most have been a fluke. At both ends the duty managers were vigilant as to who got on board and when.
Vk's challenges at the moment does not necessitate them jumping out and going back to LGW. The previous mgmt changed the business model and based it upon being a strong domestic regional carrier. There was a reason why they felt london wasnt worth the effort and expense.
JI decides he wants to go to london, the question is, has the model changed? has demand increased to necessitate an additional carrier? why not utilize your code share partners?
We have a company on a set course to a predictable failure.
Though i agree with you on most of your post, i take an exception to the charge that vk's last LGW ops was a staff travel escapade.
As an ex-vk employee, i can confidently tell you that pax were never bumped for staff. In the off chance it ever happened, it most have been a fluke. At both ends the duty managers were vigilant as to who got on board and when.
Vk's challenges at the moment does not necessitate them jumping out and going back to LGW. The previous mgmt changed the business model and based it upon being a strong domestic regional carrier. There was a reason why they felt london wasnt worth the effort and expense.
JI decides he wants to go to london, the question is, has the model changed? has demand increased to necessitate an additional carrier? why not utilize your code share partners?
We have a company on a set course to a predictable failure.
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Westafricanair,
As NDB has said, revenue pax were NEVER bumped off for staff. The main reason the route/routes never made money was due to the cost of the operation. The B767s were wet leased. Have a go at calculating wet lease rates plus per diems plus hotac etc etc and you'll see. At a time, VK was number 2 in Market share among the 4 direct carriers(VS, BA, VK, B3) although they also didn't get the corporate business but 88% average load factor in the last year of operation wasn't all that bad. The A340s are going to be much cheaper than the B767s were but that doesn't mean the route will be profitable. There are a few other things JI hasn't taken into consideration.
He has been advised by "high ups" in the company to wait a couple of years before going longhaul but his ego is driving this. It just remains to be seen how it will perform.
As NDB has said, revenue pax were NEVER bumped off for staff. The main reason the route/routes never made money was due to the cost of the operation. The B767s were wet leased. Have a go at calculating wet lease rates plus per diems plus hotac etc etc and you'll see. At a time, VK was number 2 in Market share among the 4 direct carriers(VS, BA, VK, B3) although they also didn't get the corporate business but 88% average load factor in the last year of operation wasn't all that bad. The A340s are going to be much cheaper than the B767s were but that doesn't mean the route will be profitable. There are a few other things JI hasn't taken into consideration.
He has been advised by "high ups" in the company to wait a couple of years before going longhaul but his ego is driving this. It just remains to be seen how it will perform.
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RE: Revenue Pax Offloaded
Hi NDB & REVNETWORK,
Sorry if I've touched a raw nerve - but I saw it with my own eyes at the airport. During July, August, Christmas, New Year and Easter - flights full and usually over booked because of a previous Technical Delay. Standby staff pitching up at LGW and being told no chance - only for them to come back 30 mins later with a Must Go authorised by HQ! Not all were repositioning flight crew with operational critical duties in Nigeria, but they were office staff who had an 'important' meeting. What on earth were they even doing, trying to travel standby during those periods when everyone knew the flights would be full?
There was little the airport DM's could do except go along with it and minimise the impact on the revenue pax. One of the reasons why the 'operational costs' were so high was the denied boarding compensation and HOTAC eventually ran into thousands.
Funny thing is, even with 88% load factor and strong support VK could only just get the pax to pay a sustainable fare, as soon as it went above a certain rate the pax went for BA or VS. The same is happening to W3 and it will be even worse for the new VK Op's - which will in fact resemble the old B3 within 6 months.
Sorry if I've touched a raw nerve - but I saw it with my own eyes at the airport. During July, August, Christmas, New Year and Easter - flights full and usually over booked because of a previous Technical Delay. Standby staff pitching up at LGW and being told no chance - only for them to come back 30 mins later with a Must Go authorised by HQ! Not all were repositioning flight crew with operational critical duties in Nigeria, but they were office staff who had an 'important' meeting. What on earth were they even doing, trying to travel standby during those periods when everyone knew the flights would be full?
There was little the airport DM's could do except go along with it and minimise the impact on the revenue pax. One of the reasons why the 'operational costs' were so high was the denied boarding compensation and HOTAC eventually ran into thousands.
Funny thing is, even with 88% load factor and strong support VK could only just get the pax to pay a sustainable fare, as soon as it went above a certain rate the pax went for BA or VS. The same is happening to W3 and it will be even worse for the new VK Op's - which will in fact resemble the old B3 within 6 months.
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You didn't touch any nerve. You have just extrapolated what you saw happen once maybe twice onto the whole LGW operation for the whole period of operation. I also know of ONE office staff who was given a Must Go in high season and agree there might have been more but not in the numbers you initially seemed to suggest. If NDB and myself didnt know better, I would have believed that there were literally hundreds of such situations. I personally had words about it with the CEO and was told things had changed. I also remember the CEO himself being offloaded for revenue pax at LGW as I was also standby on the same flight. He rode on the next flight in a jumpseat. I was also there and remember it slightly differently. Were you staff? I live in Crawley and know how many times members of staff stayed in my house because they had been trying to get on a flight for days on end. According to your account, they would have been boarded at the expense of revenue pax!
At the end of the day, we are saying the same thing. VK can make a profit on long haul ops if done properly. Unfortunately, I don't believe JI will allow it to be done properly.
At the end of the day, we are saying the same thing. VK can make a profit on long haul ops if done properly. Unfortunately, I don't believe JI will allow it to be done properly.
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At the end of the day, we are saying the same thing. VK can make a profit on long haul ops if done properly. Unfortunately, I don't believe JI will allow it to be done properly. 13th Jun 2011 17:52
At the end of the day, we are saying the same thing. VK can make a profit on long haul ops if done properly. Unfortunately, I don't believe JI will allow it to be done properly. 13th Jun 2011 17:52At the end of the day, we are saying the same thing. VK can make a profit on long haul ops if done properly. Unfortunately, I don't believe JI will allow it to be done properly. 13th Jun 2011 17:52
Who starts long haul operations in September with a four engine equipment? Someone with a big ego and not so big business sense.
So you start taking losses ab-initio.
Even the profitable domestic/regional ops suffer cos of strangulation in regards to spares for the planes (even for simple things like nose wheel tyres keeping planes on ground for days), pilots earning less than £4000/mth are owed salaries, how does JI hope to pay contract A340 pilots a.nd keep the planes serviceable in compliance with operations here into LHR/LGW
At the end of the day, we are saying the same thing. VK can make a profit on long haul ops if done properly. Unfortunately, I don't believe JI will allow it to be done properly. 13th Jun 2011 17:52At the end of the day, we are saying the same thing. VK can make a profit on long haul ops if done properly. Unfortunately, I don't believe JI will allow it to be done properly. 13th Jun 2011 17:52
Who starts long haul operations in September with a four engine equipment? Someone with a big ego and not so big business sense.
So you start taking losses ab-initio.
Even the profitable domestic/regional ops suffer cos of strangulation in regards to spares for the planes (even for simple things like nose wheel tyres keeping planes on ground for days), pilots earning less than £4000/mth are owed salaries, how does JI hope to pay contract A340 pilots a.nd keep the planes serviceable in compliance with operations here into LHR/LGW