The SAX Q400
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2004
Location: eastern europe
Posts: 40
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The SAX Q400
Howzit!
from what I´ve gathered the Q400 has arrived in SA. Any news on how the aircraft is performing at altitude? Any comments from the boys and girls that are flying it? Just curious...
cheers
from what I´ve gathered the Q400 has arrived in SA. Any news on how the aircraft is performing at altitude? Any comments from the boys and girls that are flying it? Just curious...
cheers
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: _
Age: 59
Posts: 29
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by knertius
Howzit!
from what I´ve gathered the Q400 has arrived in SA. Any news on how the aircraft is performing at altitude? Any comments from the boys and girls that are flying it? Just curious...
cheers
from what I´ve gathered the Q400 has arrived in SA. Any news on how the aircraft is performing at altitude? Any comments from the boys and girls that are flying it? Just curious...
cheers
Join Date: May 2006
Location: George, South Africa
Posts: 181
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The Q400 is flying into GRJ twice daily now, but it seems to me that it is struggling to keep up with the schedule. Most of the time since it started two weeks ago it was between 20 mins and an hour behind schedule. I get the idea that it is the south flight proving to be tight, scheduled for 2h15mins, doing it in about that or maybe few minutes less, depending on other aircraft arriving around the same time (in which case there is usually two other flights also scheduled to arrive in that half-hour window). The north flight is scheduled for 2h05 mins, and it seems that it can do it in 1h45 sometimes...? It only gets 20mins turnaround time at GRJ, which I think is also not enough, they struggle to do it, takes at the least 30mins. Strangely the other two SAX flights operated by F-28s (same amount of seats...) gets 70mins and 45mins scheduled turnaround times respectively??? Explain that, even the CRJs got 45mins before, the only CRJ flight now being operated on Sundays gets 30mins? Someones calculations is proving not to be working out?
Another point bothering me on this route, is the morning flight from JNB-GRJ is the first one departing at 07:20, but arrives 3rd at 09:35, after BA which departs 07:30 arriving 09:25 and Nationwide departing 07:40 arriving 09:30. OK all three within 10 mins, but still if I'm a business traveller asking for the earliest flight, I expect it to be the first arriving also...?
Another point bothering me on this route, is the morning flight from JNB-GRJ is the first one departing at 07:20, but arrives 3rd at 09:35, after BA which departs 07:30 arriving 09:25 and Nationwide departing 07:40 arriving 09:30. OK all three within 10 mins, but still if I'm a business traveller asking for the earliest flight, I expect it to be the first arriving also...?
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2004
Location: eastern europe
Posts: 40
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
one thing that one has to get used to is the fact that it just isn´t a DH8-300, and that´s what the handling crews, ATC and the pilots have to realize. It takes quite a bit longer to refuel, unload, load, board etc. ATC here in europe often treat you as just another turboprop and then start getting nervous when you start outclimbing CRJs, heavy airbuses and boeings etc, admittedly usually below FL100 when everyone is still doing 250 KIAS. And from a pilot´s point of view it´s a bit of an eye opener when a heavy Q400 doesn´t really want to slow down when advancing the condition levers to max and a rapid speed reduction was hoped for as one is used to on the 300.
The jets will have a substantial time advantage on flights that are in excess of, say, 500nm. But below that the Q400 really does make economic sense if the loads are right. The Q400 isn´t even close to perfect but, being a pilot, I do tend to look at it from a "fun" perspective. And I am having fun on the thing!!!
The jets will have a substantial time advantage on flights that are in excess of, say, 500nm. But below that the Q400 really does make economic sense if the loads are right. The Q400 isn´t even close to perfect but, being a pilot, I do tend to look at it from a "fun" perspective. And I am having fun on the thing!!!
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Dubai
Age: 56
Posts: 469
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Have been watching the Q400 with interest. Seems to be alot of hype around it. Still need to chat to somebody who has really flown it.
To be honest, i cant see it being a ball of fire. It only has the same power to weight ratio of a J41. J41 has 3300shp for just under 11 000kg's and the Q400 is 10 000shp for just under 30 000kg's. Makes me think its gonna struggle out of FAJS on a good summer day.
Also would be interested to hear what REAL TAS and REAL fuel flows it has over a GRJ sector.
To be honest, i cant see it being a ball of fire. It only has the same power to weight ratio of a J41. J41 has 3300shp for just under 11 000kg's and the Q400 is 10 000shp for just under 30 000kg's. Makes me think its gonna struggle out of FAJS on a good summer day.
Also would be interested to hear what REAL TAS and REAL fuel flows it has over a GRJ sector.
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Johannesburg
Posts: 417
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I have my real doubts about its continued operation to GRJ, its not about the aircraft but rather the competition. Like it or not the pax still like jet over TP so with BA and CE operating jets I can see any advantage for SAX as they will have to lower prices over time to attract the traffic.
I dont know what the guys at SAX are up to-to me I would keep this aircraft on BFN- period. I see it does some sectors as does the F28, now why send the F28 to BFN in the morning when you can send it to GRJ instead?? Send the Q400 to BFN will make you more cash out of the same traffic.
I dont know what the guys at SAX are up to-to me I would keep this aircraft on BFN- period. I see it does some sectors as does the F28, now why send the F28 to BFN in the morning when you can send it to GRJ instead?? Send the Q400 to BFN will make you more cash out of the same traffic.
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: #37 for Start
Posts: 460
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
TAS varies between 360 and 372 Kts
Fuel Flow in the region of 1050 kgs/hr
As far as I know, that is similar to an ERJ, but atleast 39 pax more to pay the bills.
DJ, as understood from a friend, when the second Q400 arrives in a few weeks time, the F28 will soon be a thing of the past (or used to help out on high demand routes somewhere else).
Fuel Flow in the region of 1050 kgs/hr
As far as I know, that is similar to an ERJ, but atleast 39 pax more to pay the bills.
DJ, as understood from a friend, when the second Q400 arrives in a few weeks time, the F28 will soon be a thing of the past (or used to help out on high demand routes somewhere else).
Join Date: May 2006
Location: George, South Africa
Posts: 181
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I see it does some sectors as does the F28, now why send the F28 to BFN in the morning when you can send it to GRJ instead?? Send the Q400 to BFN will make you more cash out of the same traffic.
Currently both the Q400 and F-28 is serving both GRJ and BFN. The Q400 does the morning and 3rd rotation to GRJ and then in the evening to BFN. While the F-28 does a morning rotation to BFN and then the 2nd and 4th rotation to GRJ. In line with this I agree that at least have a jet aircraft for the morning flight, to compete on the route for that time of the day ( for business travellers), like I said before you've got both BA and CE departing to GRJ within 20 minutes after SAX, but they still arrive before it... Probably won't be possible though when the second Q400 replaces the F-28?
What is the possibility of more Q400s, for replacing the DC-9 on CPT-PLZ-DUR?
Currently both the Q400 and F-28 is serving both GRJ and BFN. The Q400 does the morning and 3rd rotation to GRJ and then in the evening to BFN. While the F-28 does a morning rotation to BFN and then the 2nd and 4th rotation to GRJ. In line with this I agree that at least have a jet aircraft for the morning flight, to compete on the route for that time of the day ( for business travellers), like I said before you've got both BA and CE departing to GRJ within 20 minutes after SAX, but they still arrive before it... Probably won't be possible though when the second Q400 replaces the F-28?
What is the possibility of more Q400s, for replacing the DC-9 on CPT-PLZ-DUR?
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2004
Location: eastern europe
Posts: 40
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
as nice as it is to hear those Spey engines on the F28 it´s time that they went for an extended holiday in some american desert! The Tays on the F70 chew about 1700kg of fuel with 80 pax. The Speys will probably gobble up quite a bit more, I suspect. Time to move to more modern equipment. Q400 is a start and should be a success if operated on the right routes. Am watching the GRJ route with interest. It is about equal to the maximum distance that we operate the Q400 over here. At the end of the day most people book their flight based on the price. If the price is right SAX will be filling up the flight to GRJ. Most people won´t have a clue what aircraft they are flying until they bang their heads on one of those six blade props!
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: USA
Posts: 40
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
....
I wish my company in the states would have gotten ahold of the -400 when the boneheads had the chance to get 'em for pennies on the dollar. Now were taking in more tired -100's to replace our great 200's. Great. Thats what happens when you let the pencil jockeys run the show. But on a positive note we get to keep our -300's until 2009 or something like that.
Just a note, whats the max pitch on landing for the -400, looks like it cant be much. 3 or 4 degree's?
Just a note, whats the max pitch on landing for the -400, looks like it cant be much. 3 or 4 degree's?
Join Date: May 2006
Location: George, South Africa
Posts: 181
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Am watching the GRJ route with interest. It is about equal to the maximum distance that we operate the Q400 over here. At the end of the day most people book their flight based on the price. If the price is right SAX will be filling up the flight to GRJ. Most people won´t have a clue what aircraft they are flying until they bang their heads on one of those six blade props!
Would be interesting to see how passengers at GRJ take to the Q400 in about 6 months time. For a couple of years now GRJ was the only airport in South Africa where no scheduled flights were operated by prop-planes, mostly ERJs, 737s and MD-80s. Now within a year SAA/SAX has gone backwards on the route, from 3 daily SAA (2x738+1xA319) to 3 daily SAX (2x732+1xCRJ) to now 4 daily prop-planes. The white 732s didn't always appeal to everyone also. If they were to compete with the other carriers operating jet-aircraft, would it be wise to buy newer CRJs (CRJ700 or CRJ900), how much more economical is the new generation CRJs?
Would be interesting to see how passengers at GRJ take to the Q400 in about 6 months time. For a couple of years now GRJ was the only airport in South Africa where no scheduled flights were operated by prop-planes, mostly ERJs, 737s and MD-80s. Now within a year SAA/SAX has gone backwards on the route, from 3 daily SAA (2x738+1xA319) to 3 daily SAX (2x732+1xCRJ) to now 4 daily prop-planes. The white 732s didn't always appeal to everyone also. If they were to compete with the other carriers operating jet-aircraft, would it be wise to buy newer CRJs (CRJ700 or CRJ900), how much more economical is the new generation CRJs?
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: London
Posts: 64
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
DHC8 FO
The max pitch up in the flare on the Q400 is 6 degrees anymore than that and you set of the Touch Runway warning light which should be renamed 'Find another job' warning light because that's what you'll be doing when the Chief Pilot is finished with you.
The max pitch up in the flare on the Q400 is 6 degrees anymore than that and you set of the Touch Runway warning light which should be renamed 'Find another job' warning light because that's what you'll be doing when the Chief Pilot is finished with you.
Join Date: May 2006
Location: George, South Africa
Posts: 181
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
When is the 2nd Q400 expected, I note that it is scheduled on the JNB-GRJ route as from 24 July, replacing the F-28, meaning all 4 daily flights by SAX on the route will be with the Q400 then.
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Langley, BC
Age: 49
Posts: 10
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Flying the arrival the other afternoon for 06R in YYZ happened to look down at downsview airport (Bombardier plant). The only a/c on the ramp was the SAX Q400, only got a ten second glance but it looked good seeing that tail uphere.... enjoy.