A Flighing Frelon in Cape Town
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Cape Town South Africa
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Thanx for the pic Dean.
Weak Bert, but I guess an attempt at humour is better than no humour at all!
Well done!
Morning all, have an incident-free day
As the street walkers by the waterfront would say," Freeloadin Minimus"
Well done!
Morning all, have an incident-free day
Gatvol
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FM
Your right on that. Uncalled for........Its been removed.
Since we are now on the Frelon topic Boys and Girls, lets dump a couple Pearls of wisdom here. Firstly before you all jump on the bandwagon. I wouldnt know a Frelon if it was the only Aircraft on the ramp.........Having said that there are a few things that most all pilots know when it comes to the heavies.
Something We call BIM indicators. There a little guage or window that sits on the blade near the hub that show indications of a blade going bad. Usually its from a Nitrogen charged blade. The charge runs through the spar and if there are indications of a crack, the BIM indicator will change color. I believe in this case the rule may say. "If they are white, its ready for flight. If they are red, you may soon be dead." OR if they are painted over so nobody can tell, its just downright criminal.
Different Aircraft are done in different ways.
An example of not taking these seriously occurred in the states a few years back on a CH-54 (S-64) Crane. Preflight revealed a bad BIM indicator. The blade was recharged while drooping and all was well. ( should never have been allowed) Soon after the aircraft took flight and was about 1500' AGL, the blade now in motion, failed. The description of the disintegration of the helicopter by the chase crew would turn your stomach..
Preflight is very important, when it involves these folks its a mandatory..
Second Pearl is the good old CAA Laws as to registration.
The ZS on that puppy will be good as long as its minimum crew and in a test flying stage. Once a passenger sits his money paying butt and it lifts off........its called "In Violation" Want to guess what will happen soon??
Your right on that. Uncalled for........Its been removed.
Since we are now on the Frelon topic Boys and Girls, lets dump a couple Pearls of wisdom here. Firstly before you all jump on the bandwagon. I wouldnt know a Frelon if it was the only Aircraft on the ramp.........Having said that there are a few things that most all pilots know when it comes to the heavies.
Something We call BIM indicators. There a little guage or window that sits on the blade near the hub that show indications of a blade going bad. Usually its from a Nitrogen charged blade. The charge runs through the spar and if there are indications of a crack, the BIM indicator will change color. I believe in this case the rule may say. "If they are white, its ready for flight. If they are red, you may soon be dead." OR if they are painted over so nobody can tell, its just downright criminal.
Different Aircraft are done in different ways.
An example of not taking these seriously occurred in the states a few years back on a CH-54 (S-64) Crane. Preflight revealed a bad BIM indicator. The blade was recharged while drooping and all was well. ( should never have been allowed) Soon after the aircraft took flight and was about 1500' AGL, the blade now in motion, failed. The description of the disintegration of the helicopter by the chase crew would turn your stomach..
Preflight is very important, when it involves these folks its a mandatory..
Second Pearl is the good old CAA Laws as to registration.
The ZS on that puppy will be good as long as its minimum crew and in a test flying stage. Once a passenger sits his money paying butt and it lifts off........its called "In Violation" Want to guess what will happen soon??
Last edited by B Sousa; 24th Nov 2005 at 13:50.
FM.. in answer, Z8's might be flying and so are BK117 Kawasaki 's Ha So.. makes f. all difference china ...they are not certified for flight in this country..where did you get the blades..behind the hangars at Ysters??? the bar counter at 15 ??
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Mornin all,
Thanx for the gen on the BIMs, Bert. These are definitely not painted. Did somebody REALLY do that? Thats almost beyond belief!
No, theyre checked, and they work. in this case, theyre yello when the press is correct, and were yello on the blades before refurb I.A.W.M.M. I fitted the blades myself, have flown in the machine, and would have no qualms about taking my beautiful 4yr old daughter flying in it. She really digs flying in the huey too!
Bert, here we have somethin in caa regs called part 96 which makes provision for just that. I understand thats not the case there.
Later chaps
an incident-free day to you all
Thanx for the gen on the BIMs, Bert. These are definitely not painted. Did somebody REALLY do that? Thats almost beyond belief!
No, theyre checked, and they work. in this case, theyre yello when the press is correct, and were yello on the blades before refurb I.A.W.M.M. I fitted the blades myself, have flown in the machine, and would have no qualms about taking my beautiful 4yr old daughter flying in it. She really digs flying in the huey too!
The ZS on that puppy will be good as long as its minimum crew and in a test flying stage. Once a passenger sits his money paying butt and it lifts off........its called "In Violation" Want to guess what will happen soon??
Later chaps
an incident-free day to you all
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Hi guys and gals.
Hey Dean.....nice pics of the Frelon...at least LH kept his promised to allow you in.
Quick word on BIM indicators. The Maintenance Manuals of most helicopters that I have flown incorporating BIM indicators do not call for the blades to be discarded/rejected the moment an indicator turns red.
The blade spars can be recharged with Nitrogen and depending on aircraft type, monitored over a period of time; first on the ground and then in flight after which any further degradation will be dealt with repectively. e.g. replace leaking valves, blade crack test etc.
I hope no pilot will purposefully fly a machine that is suspected of more serious fault. So if the Frelon Blades are servicable, good. If not, throw them away.
Hey Dean.....nice pics of the Frelon...at least LH kept his promised to allow you in.
Quick word on BIM indicators. The Maintenance Manuals of most helicopters that I have flown incorporating BIM indicators do not call for the blades to be discarded/rejected the moment an indicator turns red.
The blade spars can be recharged with Nitrogen and depending on aircraft type, monitored over a period of time; first on the ground and then in flight after which any further degradation will be dealt with repectively. e.g. replace leaking valves, blade crack test etc.
I hope no pilot will purposefully fly a machine that is suspected of more serious fault. So if the Frelon Blades are servicable, good. If not, throw them away.
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Hi Guyz,
Seems to me there are those who are truly appreciative of the machine and the long hours of toil involved in getting her airborne again after so many years of dormancy, while there are others who, because of who owns it, who just want to stir the proverbial 'sof n smelly'. To THEM...grow up, get a life, or better yet go flying!
Knocking off now, moving over to the pub. Anyone within the range of your helo's tanks is welcome to come over for a cold one!
Have a rewarding weekend of aviation
Seems to me there are those who are truly appreciative of the machine and the long hours of toil involved in getting her airborne again after so many years of dormancy, while there are others who, because of who owns it, who just want to stir the proverbial 'sof n smelly'. To THEM...grow up, get a life, or better yet go flying!
Knocking off now, moving over to the pub. Anyone within the range of your helo's tanks is welcome to come over for a cold one!
Have a rewarding weekend of aviation
Gatvol
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Bert, here we have somethin in caa regs called part 96 which makes provision for just that. I understand thats not the case there.
By the way Falling Things, be aware that it may be a nice hobby playing with old warbirds, but in your other life Im sure some are watching closely as to flaunting in relation to the CAA.
Most Major Airlines consider what you do in any endeavor reflects on them also. So should there be anything that may bring dust to their table, could mean you would be destined to fly on the waterfront for a living. According to your posts that may be a good way to go...
It is great to see such interest in old warbirds, they are disappearing fast. We have to do things a bit differently in the states....Our costs seem to be in acquisition and parts with lots of free labor such as in SA, from those who love the old things. Seems in SA the biggest cost is in Attorneys and who they have to pay.
Good Luck and enjoy.
Gatvol
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Come on Boys and Girls, You mean to say all is quiet and nothing is flying............
Something must be happening down there, aircraft on the ground cost money......
Something must be happening down there, aircraft on the ground cost money......
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Hiya Bert, We dont wanna open ourselves to comments about running fore we can walk, and such, now do we? The machine hadnt flown for about ten years, so slowly does it. Besides, we were making the best of being a pilot short to install a few modern bits with knobs and switches.
We flew her into Ysterplaat on Friday for the airshow on a late invite. (yup, some others cancelled) only to have our slot cancelled due to typical military B/S! Disappointed hundreds of folk well keen to see the bus fly.
Anyway, all is well in the 'Putco' camp, watch this space...
Safe airborneness all
We flew her into Ysterplaat on Friday for the airshow on a late invite. (yup, some others cancelled) only to have our slot cancelled due to typical military B/S! Disappointed hundreds of folk well keen to see the bus fly.
Anyway, all is well in the 'Putco' camp, watch this space...
Safe airborneness all
Gatvol
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Frelonius
Good to hear...comments for me means you want more of my rhetoric here.....I really dont think so.
Great to hear that the Aircraft is flyable and that it went to an airshow. To most people that would mean its finished the Testing phase and has been properly registered. I mean who would take an unregistered aircraft in to a Military Base.....? The Helibase crowd??, you have to be kidding. But again thats South Africa.. its on the weekend and the CAA is asleep.....
"Miltary B/S" they have that there too? Could it be something like maybe the Base Commander catching flack for allowing the aircraft in there??
Whatever........
The Photos do show a great love for an old and disappearing Bird. I share that same feeling. Its the little things that get in the way that make these threads on the forum prosper.
Like Paperwork, Regulations, ultimately Safety. But hey, Its Helibase, nothing changes there but the time of day.
Run, Walk, Walk Run?? Whats this??
Good to hear...comments for me means you want more of my rhetoric here.....I really dont think so.
Great to hear that the Aircraft is flyable and that it went to an airshow. To most people that would mean its finished the Testing phase and has been properly registered. I mean who would take an unregistered aircraft in to a Military Base.....? The Helibase crowd??, you have to be kidding. But again thats South Africa.. its on the weekend and the CAA is asleep.....
"Miltary B/S" they have that there too? Could it be something like maybe the Base Commander catching flack for allowing the aircraft in there??
Whatever........
The Photos do show a great love for an old and disappearing Bird. I share that same feeling. Its the little things that get in the way that make these threads on the forum prosper.
Like Paperwork, Regulations, ultimately Safety. But hey, Its Helibase, nothing changes there but the time of day.
Run, Walk, Walk Run?? Whats this??
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The Photos do show a great love for an old and disappearing Bird
But hey, Its Helibase, nothing changes there but the time of day.
Would love to stay and dispell more myths, but duty calls
Safety first chaps
Gatvol
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Definitely NOT disappearing
As to the Frelon and the Z-8 being the same aircraft? I would think there may be something that we would call an STC for the interchange of parts between the two. That would be of course with the approval of the CAA.......Im sorry, thats not necessary in the Cape....(albeit a pain in the ass anyway)
Fill in the blanks. Is that correct or not.......
Feasant Plucker
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Putco Drivers?
It is wonderful to see a 'Putco' in the air again after all these years. Brings back many memories of the old bird, still the nicest helo I have flown to date.
By the way, where did HTN originate - is it ex-SAAF? I know there was a civvie Frelon a long while ago - operated by Ancom if my memory serves me correctly. It was at Lanseria last time I saw it. Who is current on a Frelon, instructor-wise, in SA these days?
Regards to all the ex-Putco drivers - may cold beer and safe flying accompany you always.
By the way, where did HTN originate - is it ex-SAAF? I know there was a civvie Frelon a long while ago - operated by Ancom if my memory serves me correctly. It was at Lanseria last time I saw it. Who is current on a Frelon, instructor-wise, in SA these days?
Regards to all the ex-Putco drivers - may cold beer and safe flying accompany you always.
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SA321 JA Super Frelon ZS-HTN (c/n 169) has led an interesting life. Built as a civilian helicopter, it served as a VIP transport in the Zaire Air Force with registration 9T-SPF. It was then obtained by the SAAF in the 1980's, but was never taken into service. It was stored at what was then known as the military side of DF Malan Airport, Cape Town.
It was then obtained by Martin Gericke on 30 June 1988, who painted the aircraft in Ancom Jet colours. This was predominantly white, with rainbow stripes on the forward fuselage. It was flown from Cape Town to Lanseria in the early 1990's, where it had stood, derelict, until mid 2005 when it was delivered to HeliBase, who also operate Bell UH-1H Huey and AB-205's around Cape Town. The aircraft was formally registered to HeliBase (Pty) Ltd on 20 September 2005.
HeliBase also have ex-SAAF Super Frelons 302 (c/n 111) and 312 (c/n 135) which are awaiting restoration.
The first hovering test-flight was conducted on 21 November 2005.
It was then obtained by Martin Gericke on 30 June 1988, who painted the aircraft in Ancom Jet colours. This was predominantly white, with rainbow stripes on the forward fuselage. It was flown from Cape Town to Lanseria in the early 1990's, where it had stood, derelict, until mid 2005 when it was delivered to HeliBase, who also operate Bell UH-1H Huey and AB-205's around Cape Town. The aircraft was formally registered to HeliBase (Pty) Ltd on 20 September 2005.
HeliBase also have ex-SAAF Super Frelons 302 (c/n 111) and 312 (c/n 135) which are awaiting restoration.
The first hovering test-flight was conducted on 21 November 2005.
Gatvol
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The aircraft was formally registered to HeliBase (Pty) Ltd on 20 September 2005.
Would you clarify that for us.
Or was it just a Bill of Sale Transfering the Aircraft.
