When ATC's mess up???????
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When ATC's mess up???????
I would refer you to the article in the latest issue of "Aviation and Safety magazine" by Deon Barnard.
I would put the article on the site, but it is about three pages long.
When I read the article, I was just wondering what his point was. We have over the last few weeks been exposed to newspaper articles by un informed journo's about incidents, or non events really, that have put our aviation industry in a very bad light. Now, this article, by an airline pilot, who you would swear went to the same school as some of the journo's has now written this for all and sundry to read.
What was he thinking? We all make mistakes, pilots and ATC's alike. Nobody is perfect. It depends on how you correct your mistakes that counts.
What concerns me more, is how dramatic he makes it all sound, and how many glaring errors he makes in the article. According to him, intersection India is only a mere 100 meters from the threshold of runway 03L(900meters) Secondly, with him on a 1.5nm final for 03L, he would have landed on, OR IN FRONT OF, an A340 taking off passing the India intersection!!! Now that i would have liked to have seen. If it wasnt for his superior situational awareness there would have been a terrible accident!!
When are all these stupid articles going to stop. They make us all look like a bunch of monkey's.
I would put the article on the site, but it is about three pages long.
When I read the article, I was just wondering what his point was. We have over the last few weeks been exposed to newspaper articles by un informed journo's about incidents, or non events really, that have put our aviation industry in a very bad light. Now, this article, by an airline pilot, who you would swear went to the same school as some of the journo's has now written this for all and sundry to read.
What was he thinking? We all make mistakes, pilots and ATC's alike. Nobody is perfect. It depends on how you correct your mistakes that counts.
What concerns me more, is how dramatic he makes it all sound, and how many glaring errors he makes in the article. According to him, intersection India is only a mere 100 meters from the threshold of runway 03L
(900meters) Secondly, with him on a 1.5nm final for 03L, he would have landed on, OR IN FRONT OF, an A340 taking off passing the India intersection!!! Now that i would have liked to have seen. If it wasnt for his superior situational awareness there would have been a terrible accident!!When are all these stupid articles going to stop. They make us all look like a bunch of monkey's.
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It seems as if there is a righteous individual out there who feels that he can do no wrong. I also read the article and a few others by Mr Barnard who seems to put blame soley on others which makes me wonder who in actual fact is making the mistakes. I can't believe that a magazine would support and print such unintelligable nonsense. Makes me wonder!!!!!!!
Mr Barnard take a look at yourself and maybe you are the one that errs instead of blaming others who in my opinion do a fine job.
And this goes for the ATC's in your recent article and all the Captains (referred to in one of your previous aricles), that you rode around with in your ERJ, who in your opinion were not fit to command such an aircraft.
Mr Barnard take a look at yourself and maybe you are the one that errs instead of blaming others who in my opinion do a fine job.
And this goes for the ATC's in your recent article and all the Captains (referred to in one of your previous aricles), that you rode around with in your ERJ, who in your opinion were not fit to command such an aircraft.
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Here here beechbum
We try our best and no-one is perfect - to err is human after all - it is how we manage our ways and work to try and get it right every time
You know when I was a young and good looking goldfish, (now i am just and!) my late dad always told me that no-one is perfect.
I hate to think that he might have been wrong..........................
Gosh a perfect pilot.................Lands on the numbers, hits the threshold at exactly Vref, etc, etc
And another interesting point, if you are coming from George and the boeing was departing on a SID, it looks like that day you were arriving on runway19, what were you doing so far south in your Ejet that you passed the B727 so close to him. The arrivals do not take you anywhere near Sir Lowrys Pass, so me thinks you were kinda far left of track......................
We try our best and no-one is perfect - to err is human after all - it is how we manage our ways and work to try and get it right every time
You know when I was a young and good looking goldfish, (now i am just and!) my late dad always told me that no-one is perfect.
I hate to think that he might have been wrong..........................
Gosh a perfect pilot.................Lands on the numbers, hits the threshold at exactly Vref, etc, etc
And another interesting point, if you are coming from George and the boeing was departing on a SID, it looks like that day you were arriving on runway19, what were you doing so far south in your Ejet that you passed the B727 so close to him. The arrivals do not take you anywhere near Sir Lowrys Pass, so me thinks you were kinda far left of track......................
Last edited by Goldfish Jack; 28th Aug 2005 at 21:23.
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You know as we have all said here, we all make mistakes and as Goldfish rightly said we ain't perfect. BUT to blatantly criticise and run amock in a magazine article just ain't cricket!!! Have a laugh and talk it over a few beers which generally is the way to go.....but put it in black and white......aikona man!!!!!
Umm just trying to remember when I last landed on the numbers.........ummmmm
Umm just trying to remember when I last landed on the numbers.........ummmmm
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Here here again BB
Aviation is mighty small in this country and if you are only a co-pilot on an Ejet, and you have so much to say, don't think you are going to find another job easily.....................................
Aviation is mighty small in this country and if you are only a co-pilot on an Ejet, and you have so much to say, don't think you are going to find another job easily.....................................
If u feel that strongly that u want to put it in words go through the neccesary chanells and put it in an increp or Airprox form.
All of these are extensively investigated by the powers that be and if it is as serious as you state Mr Barnard then corrective and disciplinary action will be taken against those resposible from an ATC point of view.
I will be the first to say I am far from perfect and make plenty stuff ups, I just try correct them before they become paperwork, but hey we all human dude and if we are working everyday we bound to make 1 or 2 misshaps in a shift. Most are correctable as are most misshaps that go on in a flight deck but if you feel it was a danger a mag is not the place to express this. Follow the laid out channels bro.
All of these are extensively investigated by the powers that be and if it is as serious as you state Mr Barnard then corrective and disciplinary action will be taken against those resposible from an ATC point of view.
I will be the first to say I am far from perfect and make plenty stuff ups, I just try correct them before they become paperwork, but hey we all human dude and if we are working everyday we bound to make 1 or 2 misshaps in a shift. Most are correctable as are most misshaps that go on in a flight deck but if you feel it was a danger a mag is not the place to express this. Follow the laid out channels bro.
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Well said LO
Cant remember that incident in FACT to tell you the truth!
Agree there are channels - maybe he is just a frustrated FO that thinks he should be a captain of a big jet and making big decisions.
OH well it takes all types to make the TMA work!!!!
Cant remember that incident in FACT to tell you the truth!
Agree there are channels - maybe he is just a frustrated FO that thinks he should be a captain of a big jet and making big decisions.
OH well it takes all types to make the TMA work!!!!
