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-   -   FedEx 757 (https://www.pprune.org/accidents-close-calls/655135-fedex-757-a.html)

Chiefttp 5th Oct 2023 12:58

FedEx 757
 
Just in, a FedEx 757 landed gear up at Chattanooga Tennessee Airport KCHA . . Early reports say It was intentional as there was a hydraulic problem and they couldn’t use the alternate gear extension system. Again, these are early reports. No injuries reported.

https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....0a5826317.jpeg

MLHeliwrench 5th Oct 2023 14:02

Video
 
Close up video of touchdown gear up

https://reddit.com/r/aviation/s/KqKfHwYPbG

llagonne66 5th Oct 2023 15:36


Originally Posted by MLHeliwrench (Post 11514883)
Close up video of touchdown gear up

https://reddit.com/r/aviation/s/KqKfHwYPbG

Excellent job from the guys at the pointy end 👏

Liffy 1M 5th Oct 2023 16:00

The aircraft involved was N977FD, line number 163, built in 1988 and originally G-BNSD with Air Europe. https://www.planespotters.net/airfra...express/r644l3

oceancrosser 5th Oct 2023 17:14

Having had to use Alternate Gear Extension on a 757, lets hope the reason it did not work here is an actual issue, not just a CB as LOT on a 767. Good work getting it on the ground in one peace, without significant injuries. Probably end of the line for this airframe.

tdracer 5th Oct 2023 18:28


Originally Posted by oceancrosser (Post 11514981)
Having had to use Alternate Gear Extension on a 757, lets hope the reason it did not work here is an actual issue, not just a CB as LOT on a 767. Good work getting it on the ground in one peace, without significant injuries. Probably end of the line for this airframe.

Normally doesn't take much to write-off a 35 year old airframe...
While narrow body FedEx and UPS aircraft tend to be relatively low hour/cycle for their age, this was originally a passenger 757 and probably racked up a fair number of hours/cycles before FedEx converted it roughly ten years ago.
In the old days I could check the Boeing data base and get the latest hour/cycle numbers, but lost that ability when I retired.

sandringham1 5th Oct 2023 20:38

The video of the landing looks just like the end sequence of the film 'Airplane'.

Flch250 5th Oct 2023 20:49

I suspect no calculations exist for no gear landing. However some data from accidents may exist.

What is the runway required? Seems like 7,000 may not be enough. This was a short flight and may not have been fully loaded. What if it was at MTOW?

How would one know runway requirements?

Chiefttp 5th Oct 2023 22:11

https://barandgrill.ipapilot.org/hom...%2FKCHA%2FKMEM

Capn Bloggs 6th Oct 2023 00:22


Originally Posted by Sandringham1
The video of the landing looks just like the end sequence of the film 'Airplane'.

Surely you can't be serious?

ZFT 6th Oct 2023 00:29


Originally Posted by Flch250 (Post 11515101)
I suspect no calculations exist for no gear landing. However some data from accidents may exist.

What is the runway required? Seems like 7,000 may not be enough. This was a short flight and may not have been fully loaded. What if it was at MTOW?

How would one know runway requirements?

Back in about 1972 when Don Smith, who was the FE on the SAA B707A that performed the wheels up landing at Niarobi following ground contact someway short of the airport, was giving us a course, he mentioned that after touchdown they had a issue slowing down as the aircraft slid along on the keel beam and they even deployed speed brakes to assist.

bean 6th Oct 2023 03:42


treadigraph 6th Oct 2023 03:54


Originally Posted by ZFT (Post 11515182)
Back in about 1972 when Don Smith, who was the FE on the SAA B707A that performed the wheels up landing at Niarobi.

Hadn't heard of that incident, Embakasi seems to gave been popular for landing short - or nearly so!
https://aviation-safety.net/database...?id=19601029-2

stilton 6th Oct 2023 07:45

I flew the 757/67 for eleven years, other than the LOT 767 gear up I don’t remember another case where the gear could not be extended by any means on either aircraft ?

PC767 6th Oct 2023 08:02


Originally Posted by Capn Bloggs (Post 11515180)
Surely you can't be serious?

I am, and don't call me Shirley!

skwdenyer 6th Oct 2023 10:16


Originally Posted by oceancrosser (Post 11514981)
Having had to use Alternate Gear Extension on a 757, lets hope the reason it did not work here is an actual issue, not just a CB as LOT on a 767. Good work getting it on the ground in one peace, without significant injuries. Probably end of the line for this airframe.

Since it looks like most of the braking force came from the nacelles, which will (with the bypass ducts) have deformed quite a lot on touchdown, it’s possible the primary airframe damage will only be the tail drag.

That said, the LOT 767 that landed in similar fashion at Warsaw Chopin some years ago was a hull loss.

Chiefttp 6th Oct 2023 16:10

The 757 alternate gear extension utilizes hydraulic power to release the uplocks which allows the gear to free fall. The 767 utilizes a small electric motor to release the uplocks. The LOT 767 gear up landing was due to a popped circuit breaker which also powered the small electric motor that released the uplocks which then allowed the alternate gear extension to work. 2 different systems, so an electrical issue shouldn’t affect the 757 alternate gear extension system. This will be an interesting investigation.
We had a similar scenario in the C-141, where a crew due to limited fuel, rushed the alternate gear extension checklist and failed to secure the nose gear. It collapsed upon landing.

BFSGrad 6th Oct 2023 16:41


Originally Posted by Flch250 (Post 11515101)
I suspect no calculations exist for no gear landing. However some data from accidents may exist.

While I wouldn’t expect Fedex (or other operators) to have gear-up landing performance data in-house, it seems likely that Boeing would. Does Boeing provide 24/7 engineering support for emergency situations?

Based on a few photos, appears that N977FD stopped just short of the localizer antenna, so perhaps about 800 ft of overrun? Must have chewed up a portion of the runway 2 MALSR.

EXDAC 6th Oct 2023 16:52


Originally Posted by Chiefttp (Post 11515650)
The 757 alternate gear extension utilizes hydraulic power to release the uplocks which allows the gear to free fall.

"The alt gear ext on the B757 uses a small hyd power pack with its own electric motor. This runs for about 10 secs to unlock the gear and doors."
ref - https://www.pprune.org/archive/index.php/t-382117.html

If that's true then wouldn't this electric motor have a circuit breaker?

EXDAC 6th Oct 2023 18:21

"Landing Gear Alternate Extension

The alternate landing gear extension system uses a dedicated DC powered electric hydraulic pump. Fluid within the supply line to the pump is sufficient for alternate gear extension operation. This fluid is isolated from the left hydraulic system. Selecting the ALTN GEAR EXTEND switch releases all door and gear uplocks. The landing gear free–fall to the down and locked position."

ref - http://navfly.ru/wp-content/uploads/...ons_manual.pdf

I have not found any reference to an associated circuit breaker.


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