Looking for flight deck information on the Lockheed Constellation

[akaSylvia]

I'm interested in the Lockheed Constellation that crashed on the 19th oif June in the Syrian dessert. This has come up because of a comic strip in the Oatmeal telling the story of Gene Rodenberry and his bravery and rescue of the passengers in the crash.

It's going to be okay. - The Oatmeal

Obviously, the first thing that jumps out at the reader is the idea of the co-pilot abandoning the cockpit in order to console the wimminfolk in the back...

I wrote this piece about it last week, clarifying the details:

Fear of Landing ? Factual Version of the Clipper Eclipse crash featured in the Oatmeal

So, here's where I'm stuck.

In the comments, there's an interesting question asking about where the third officer (relief pilot) should sit...

There were eight flight crew members on board the flight, where I would think that at any point two pilots, one engineer and one radio officer would need to be sitting in position. That leaves second and third officer, second engineer and second radio officer needing seats.

The third officer (Roddenberry) was definitely in the back, along with two cabin crew. All three survived.

Four flight crew would have been seated in the cockpit but now I have no idea: Where were the other three?

Does anyone know the plane well enough to explain this - either on the comments in direct response or here for me to quote over there?

Thank you!

[Blind Squirrel]

Weren't there five flight crew members on the Connie? P1 and P2 left and right; radio operator behind P1; flight engineer behind P2; navigator in separate compartment behind radio operator. That was my understanding, anyway.

[akaSylvia]

Weren't there five flight crew members on the Connie? P1 and P2 left and right; radio operator behind P1; flight engineer behind P2; navigator in separate compartment behind radio operator.

That's right.

So on this flight (on the Clipper Eclipse, on its way back to the US as a part of the round-the-world service) we have:

• Captain (P1)
• First Officer (P2)
• Second Officer and Navigator (in separate compartment behind radio operator?)
• Third Officer (in the cabin along with two cabin crew - all survived)
• First Engineer (behind P2)
• Second Engineer
• First Radio Officer (behind P1)
• Second Radio Officer

You've slotted in the second officer for me as he would have been acting as navigator when not subbing for FO ...or let's assume at least using that seat.

So, we know that the third officer was in the cabin during the emergency descent, the cabin crew saw him there. It seems safe to assume the five flight crew are all in position.

That still leaves two people where I don't know where they would have been. Would all three relief crew normally be in the cabin or was there some other area where they could sit separately from the passengers? Did the third officer leave a seat to take one in the back or was that where he was seated in the first place?

[dhavillandpilot]

Why not contact the HARS people in Wollongong in Australia as they operate one

[Stanwell]

As dhp says, HARS would probably be a source of information.
Their Connie, however, is actually an ex-USAF C121 - externally representing a late QANTAS L1049 Super Constellation.

I suspect akaSylvia's subject Connie may have been an L749, so there may be flight deck differences.
Anyway, HARS have accumulated an amazing amount of info which they are always happy to share.

[akaSylvia]

Thank you! I will contact them and report back!

[Stanwell]

Further to my last post, I now understand that 'Clipper Eclipse', NC88845, was in fact an original model Connie, the L-049.

[akaSylvia]

Sadly, I've not had a response. It's not a big deal, I was just curious. Apparently it isn't quite as simple a question as I thought it was!

[Stanwell]

Shame about the lack of response there, Sylvia.
I'm disappointed.

You might like to have a look at Ralph M Pettersen's site, - conniesurvivors.com.
On that he has a Q&A Forum.
Aside from that, he has a wide range of contacts within the Connie world and in the unlikely event he can't answer your query, he'll know who can.
The website gives a link to his email address.

Good luck and let's know how you go.


p.s. My compliments on your website, 'Fear of Landing' and.. love the sub-title - 'The art of not hitting the ground too hard'.
.

[megan]

akaSylvia, the typical arrangement on the aircraft (1049C, suspect the 049 would have been the same) was as follows

Pilot & Copilot
Flight Engineer, seated behind the Copilot facing outboard
Radio Operator, seated behind the Captain and facing rearwards
Navigator, seated behind the Radio Operator facing forward

To the right of the Navigator (on the opposite side of the aisle) was a forward facing crew rest area seat which could seat two certainly, perhaps three. Not exactly sure on that detail of 2 or 3.

Immediately behind the crew seat and Navigator was a bulkhead with door to the passenger cabin.

The crew were Captain Joseph Hall Hart, Jr., First Officer Robert Stanley McCoy, Second Officer & Navigator Howard Thompson, Third Officer Eugene W. Roddenberry, First Engineer Robert B Donnelly, Second Engineer W. E. Morris, First Radio Officer Nelson C. Miles, Second Radio Officer Arthur O. Nelson, Purser Anthony Volpe, and Stewardess Jane Bray.

[Spooky 2]

My recollection was the seating or sleeping area across from the nav could seat up to four or sleep two with the bungling board installed. Flying Tiger 1049H convertible pax freighter. Former KLM. Radio operator station just aft of the Capt. seat.